waterrockets 

Start here (seriously, study and re-study this, even if you don't have a power meter), here, and here.

procrit

I'm talking a total of 100 hours in 2 months. That's around 10-12 hours a week. Quality over quantity.

Although the guy who won the p/1/2 race this sunday 'crammed' for the race this week, putting in over 20 hours (where he has only been riding a few times a week), and won it on a long break away. He keeps telling me that if I rode 20 hours a week I couldn't not be fast.

YMCA

That's actually very sort of true.
As long as recovery is taken in double doses as well.

I told a local cat3 who was riding 11 hours a week consistently for many years, to immediately jump into the 18-26 hr range.

Man, it was like night and day.

He's not a cat1 now, but at least he's very competitive in 3's instead of being pack fodder.

ldesfor1@ithaca

YMCA: what types of training did you have this student/client of yours doing. Complex question, but a general answer will slake my thirst.

thanks,

-L

waterrockets 

Yeah, I think my fitness could soak up a lot more training hours.

gsteinb

Indeed

waterrockets 

I wish I knew how to train back when I was 21 doing 300-400 miles/wk.

gsteinb

Me too. Me too.

kenkayak

Ah sorry as hell manGot on Texas

mollusk

Did you ever consider the fact that you can get away now with very limited hours per week now is due the fact that you built an enormous base back then?

Grumpy McTrumpy

not sure I'd call that a fact.

mollusk

I've seen his race results. I think that it is a fact.

And 300 to 400 miles per week at any speed is an enormous amount of base.

gsteinb

I have some opinions.

substructure

I have opinions too. But, seriously, who would care?

waterrockets 

Yeah, I think miles in the legs over the long haul stick around. I'm probably near 200,000 right now. I had some years in there with just a 15 minute commute each day and some mountain biking for fun, when I got up to 220 lbs., so there was certainly some comparatively sedentary time in there.

YMCA

The guys behind you

YMCA

Ides, his training went from 11 hours a week, to an immediate 18-26hr range. Within two months everyone in town was calling his name like a rock star (even though he was still a cat3). It was like he became a player when he had been nothing more than one of the guys since he started the sport. He had know idea if he could handle the mileage, but we can all handle way more than we normally alow ourselves, even with busy lives. It's all about priortizing recovery. Sleep, nutrition, recovery rides, ice, etc...

The type of training was exactly as he had been doing, but with added miles around the group rides or workouts. Those miles would be done at endurance paces mostly. And of course we added some extra recovery/endurance sessions, so he was doing two-a-days quite often.

Lemond's original training book said something along the lines that a masters racer training 10 hours a week and a cat1 training 25 hours a week had the same schedule of intense workouts and races, except the cat1 would be adding an extra 15 hours of endurance paced stuff, whereas the masters racer might not have the time, recovery, or desire to take on that workload.

I say go for the 25 hour weeks if so inclined. If your life is set-up properly, it's amazing what extra miles can do for you.

ldesfor1@ithaca

wow.

thanks for the reply YMCA.

I have the time, but dont think I have the motivation to do 25 hour weeks.

That said, I do 2-a-days often and am already thniking of ways to get more 3 hour rides in this Base period as I am very aware that aside from my weight (to much of it), long ride confidence/endurance was lacking this race season.

I am definitely a Quality over quantity type guy, and cant really convince myself to sacrifice one for the other, but I think I'm physically ready for both this winter/spring.

So again, thanks for the motivation/food for thought.

Also: by "Endurance miles" do you mean somewhere in the 65-75% range?

-L

dmb2786

Please continue with these awesome posts.

YMCA

variety of miles at Z1-2-3
so yes, a lot of 55-80% of max hr stuff if you are using that as a guage (65-75% is about right for normal Z2 year round base mileage), that's the meat and potatoes of any athlete

I personally prefer perceived exertion, but then I know intuitively what power/hr I'd be at from all my years.

My example athlete uses a PM and HR, but I try to get him to "feel" more.

NomadVW 

^^^^
This, me, more riding, better.

IMO, if you need a PM to tell you if you're riding "endurance," you haven't ridden enough endurance.

ldesfor1@ithaca

I already said that, I havent ridden enough endurance mile. Quit rubbing it in you mileage-junkie!



jealous/envious of you high mileage guys... sort of.

-L

gsteinb

sigh. lemme help


If you need a PM to tell you if you're riding "endurance," you shouldn't go to Europe.

ldesfor1@ithaca

but I Loooooooooove Belgian waffles!!!

substructure

Endurance miles tomorrow. Cold morning commute and a pleasant ride back home. "Wwweeeee!"

Does anyone really say, "Weee?"