rkwaki

I know it has been discussed in the past but in looking through the Training Status thread the question came to mind and thought it might be a good place to start a thread for those who use weights as part of their training program.
As I have said many times this has always been a part of my training hence the 'linebacker' status but this got me to wondering:
1. Who uses weight training as part of their training regime?
2. Do you use this only in the off season or throughout the year?
3. There are many goals in using weights as part of your training, these include building lean muscle, building strength, building a different type of muscular endurance, etc. What goals do you have?
4. If you are using weights is your focus legs, legs and core, total body?
5. Any exercises you feel are really worthwhile that you could pass along to fellow riders.

The school of thought to some might be that it is counterproductive to racing, if you feel this way, why is that?

Just my thought of the day...

carpediemracing 

I'm curious how to improve explosive power. I used to have it, now I don't. I figure I can do some specific stuff (box jumping?) that would help gain back some of it. That or take steroids.

I rarely do leg things, just walking around (for work that might involve carrying 40-80 lbs while walking around) and lifting things "with my legs" vs "with my back".

I do, all season, maybe every few days (in season) to every week (off season), shoulder area stuff. I got it in my head that it would help with protecting my collarbone; let's just say the bone I broke first was my pelvis. Anyway, I do military press (up), something lifts (lift arm out), bent over flys, bent over rows, curls (just because), a tricep thing bent over (extend arm straight back). I just have one dumbbell (one in den, one in bike room), don't change weights, just 2x10lbs plus bar (22 lbs?).

(Along with shoulder exercises I also took Judo for a while as a kid - I'm convinced the tumbling exercises really helped with being able to fall relatively safely. I wouldn't do now what I did then - sprint at full speed at 4-5-6 kids with just their heads bowed a bit - i.e. they're taller than me - and jump over them, clearing them, and landing into a full Judo type landing roll a good 15-20 feet away. I can't imagine watching it even.)

Whenever I am bending my arm while doing weights, I hold the bar so it mimics the drops, i.e. the bar points fore/aft. Therefore my curls are with the bar 90 deg from normal, etc.

I also do pushups and situps/crunches, but not that frequently, more when I'm watching a movie on the TV (DVD or such, since we don't have cable). This is pretty infrequent, 1-4x/month, 2x25-40 pushups, 1x30-40 situps, or 1 to 3 x 40-50 crunches.

My knees start hurting as soon as I do any steady weights with my legs, takes about a week but pain is sharp and consistent. I've been negatively reinforced and therefore avoid leg workouts. I give it a shot every few years, learn pain again, and stop.

shovelhd

1. I have lifted all throughout my life but just started again recently after a full season back racing.
2. I intend to go 1x-2x/wk throughout the year.
3. I'm pretty lean already, 5'10" 62-63kg. I have a decent sprint but I'm not a pure sprinter in any way, more of an FTP/breakaway guy. I don't expect weights to help with the latter. I have read that Masters in particular can benefit from strength work during the season. I know I lost strength as I went through my build/rest periods and I want to try and keep it this season. If it helps my jump then that's icing on the cake.
4. My focus is total body within reason. A little of most.
5. I doubt any of it is worthwhile to anyone else but this is what I do. Contrary to popular opinion I do not work with free weights at all, only Cybex/Bodymasters. I have multiple old injuries to my right shoulder, bicep, and elbow from surfing and racing and I have to manage the benefit against the pain. Consistent range of movement really helps me manage the pain, and I feel more confident in a range-controlled setting. I do two sets each of:

seated lat pulldowns (tiller bar)
seated row
standing tricep extension (rope)
standing bicep curl (flat bar)
seated shoulder press
seated leg press
seated calf press
prone Cybex hamstring curl
layback Cybex ab crunch
seated Cybex core twist (this one kills)
seated leg extension

It takes me about 30 minutes not including warmup. I have been doing this after commuting home or riding on the trainer. If it's a rest day I'll ride for 20 minutes on the ass hatchet upright erg bike.

rkwaki

I will post up a functional workout that my trainer and I developed all you will need is an exercise band (or an old tube), a hallway/driveway and a sturdy chair. I didn't believe the workout we could get done without any weights. If you have a dumbbell that could be worked in as well.

tombailey

Lots of activation, stabilization and flexibility work at this time of year. Almost all body weight exercises. Full body.
Then some muscular endurance work (low weight, high rep, super sets of one on solid ground then one in a "balance" situation - one-leg, bosu ball, eyes closed, whatever). Full body.
Then a little max strength and plyometric type work. Mostly legs. Not sure how much this does for me physically, but mentally it feels good.
Usually leave the gym in March and don't go back (though i'd do one day per week of at least core work if i had more training time).

lokerola

I'm starting to use it 2-3 times a week to help my old fat body put on some muscle mass to burn fat. I don't want to be a power lifter, but I need to shed about 65lbs of fat (yikes!) to be where I want to be and adding some muscle mass should speed the fat burn.

So I'm focusing on compound movements for my legs and core along and body weight & assistance work for my upper body. And I'm always stretching on strength training days. Adding some old martial arts stretches in there.

Here's an example:
Mon
1. Pushups x10
2. Curls x10 @ 45lb
3. Pushups x 10
4. Curls x10 @ 45lb
5. Pushups x 10
6. Curls x 10 @ 45lb
7. Squat x 10 @ 45lb
8. Squat x 8 @ 115lb
9. Squat x 6 @ 135lb
10. Squat x 4 @ 155lb
11. Squat x 2 @ 190lb
12. Crunches x 30
13. Leg Lifts x 20
14. Do a 1 hour Spinervals DVD
15. Puke.
16. Stretch.

Fri
1. Deadlift x 5 @ 135
2. Deadlift x 5 @ 135
3. Deadlift x 5 @ 135
4. Deadlift x 5 @ 135
5. Deadlift x 5 @ 135
6. Goodmornings x 8 @ 45lb
7. Goodmornings x 8 @ 45lb
8. Press x 10 @ 45lb
9. Press x 8 @ 65lb
10. Press x 5 @ 95lb
11. Crunches x 30
12. leg lifts x 20
13. Plank x 2 @ 30 secs each
14. Spinervals DVD (I can hear coach Troy now = If your legs aren't shaking by the end of this workout - YOU DID IT WRONG!)
15. Puke.
16. Stretch.

rotti

I think it depends on the athlete. If someone is weak, just getting stronger in general will improve any sport they're part of. I used to train a few track and field athletes and the first thing I would do is evaluate the person and then the event they're training for. With that being said I personally do very little other then some modified cross-fit type sessions 2x per week. I've spent years as a competitive powerlifter and I don't see absolute strength as a limiter. I know I can out squat, bench, and deadlift Lance Armstrong any day of the week, but I probably couldn't hold his wheel for 60 seconds...haha.

graphs

I do very little training off the bike - 1 or 2 days a week in the off season and maybe one day every other week during the season. I do it because my posture is terrible, I'm afraid of bone density loss, but mostly because I'm actually pretty weak. I'd like to see a leaner body composition and some muscle gain but I don't expect much considering how little I do.

I focus mostly on core and stability exercises; planks, swiss ball, medicine ball and body weight exercises. I also do some upper body work with free weights and various squats with body weight (i.e. pistol squats) or with what free weights I have at home (2 x 35lbs i think). I did some plyometrics during build period last year but injured myself so I doubt I'll repeat. The gains I saw from a few plyo sessions were not so great as to be worth the risk of re-injury. Also, I suffer from an autoimmune variety of arthritis and high weight or high impact activites can aggravate certain joints that are prone it. A bad flare up could easily ruin a whole season so I'm very cautious.

Debusama

1. Who uses weight training as part of their training regime?
I do
2. Do you use this only in the off season or throughout the year?
Heavier and more frequently in the off season, body-weight movements once or twice a week during race season
3. There are many goals in using weights as part of your training, these include building lean muscle, building strength, building a different type of muscular endurance, etc. What goals do you have?
Building Sprint power, and core/joint stability for injury prevention.
4. If you are using weights is your focus legs, legs and core, total body?
The body adapts as a unit, some movements rely more heavily on certain muscle groups than others, but I think the idea that we can isolate one from the rest is part of the reason why most gym-goer's workouts are so ineffective at producing actual athletic improvement.
5. Any exercises you feel are really worthwhile that you could pass along to fellow riders.
Squats, dead lifts, cleans, snatches

SalsaPodio

I'll preface this by saying I used to lift. A lot. I'm 5'10" and was almost 190lbs. I was 20 pounds away from breaking 1000lbs in the big 3.

That being said, I don't see the point in lifting as a cyclist, expect for correcting large strength imbalances. Sure it'll make you stronger, but I feel like you would be much better off doing some low cadence high force work, because that specifically targets the muscles used in your pedal stroke. You can kind of think of it like the strong man competitions. Sure they lift a lot, but when it comes down to it, they still need to lift those huge stones on to platforms, and toss tires around, so that's what they practice.

I'm sure everyone here has realized that riding bikes makes you good at one thing: riding bikes. If I tried to run a few miles today I could do it pretty easily, but my legs would hurt for a week. That just shows how good we are at training only the specific muscles used in cycling. That shows me that to get better as a cyclist, specificity is key, which is why I feel like lifting weights isn't particularly useful. I think you can see some improvement by lifting, but not as much as if you were to so the same type of workouts on a bike.

Hermes

1. Who uses weight training as part of their training regime?

I started lifting weights in 1977 and I have been lifting consistently 4 to 5 times per week in the gym. I use the gym for strength training as well as recovery.

2. Do you use this only in the off season or throughout the year?

I belong to a full facility gym and use it throughout the year. Sometimes my focus is on building strength and others it is about recovery.

3. There are many goals in using weights as part of your training, these include building lean muscle, building strength, building a different type of muscular endurance, etc. What goals do you have?

IMO, strength in sporting events is an asset and competitive advantage. In cycling, other than sprinting, if there is too much weight or increased profile due to the added strength, then the overhead can be a detractor. My goal is to be a strong as possible while not bulking up.

The other aspect for me is that cycling seems to tear down or weaken certain muscle groups, that if left alone, causes me injury. Strengthening the unused or weaker muscles helps me stay healthy and may in fact increase power and endurance.

As one ages, we are supposed to get weaker. I do not buy into that theory and my strength, due to strength training, has remained about the same for the last 20 years and lately has been increasing.

4. If you are using weights is your focus legs, legs and core, total body?

I focus on whole body but give leg, core and back workouts a priority.

I used to do the standard issue weight workouts including bench presses and other exercises where my core was supported in a manner that allowed me to do maximum weight. About 10 years ago, I changed that to focusing on doing the same workouts but making sure my core was engaged. For example, instead of a bench press, I use a large inflated ball to support my shoulders and create a bridge with my feet close together. I use dumbbells instead of a bar. I start with the weights up and lower each arm while I keep one up at all times. This requires max effort to maintain stability and develops core as well as chest and arm strength. I have to use a lot less weight but I am not interested in bulking up my chest and arms. I will do 3 to 5 sets starting with a warmup set and increasing weight per set.

For each traditional weight training exercise, I have an equivalent that brings in the core. I do not lift any weights with my core supported. That is in contrast to what I used to do 15 years ago. When I do curls, I stand on an upside-down Bosa ball to destabilize the core and require balance and perfect form. Once again, I am not interested in big biceps just useful strength that can be advantageous for sport and health.

5. Any exercises you feel are really worthwhile that you could pass along to fellow riders.

One leg step ups on a bench with weight.

Standing on a balance board, I do squats with free weights in each hand and do a one minute hold in the squat position after 10 fast reps. The balance board makes it hard to hold the 1 minute as the small muscles start to fatigue and one loses the ability to balance.

Plyometrics. I do not to box jumping per se but I take a bench and starting with one foot on the bench jump over it landing on the other side like a cat with my opposite foot on the bench. The key to jumping is landing like a cat. The problem with jumping is if you miss it is all bad and I have seen racers injured box jumping due to landing wrong.

I also do ad/ab work and use a machine for the inner thighs and a black rubber band for the outer thighs. Using the black band, I put it around my ankles and walk sideways. I do it in the drop position and the TT position.

I side lunge while doing a cable pull engaging my lats. The goal is to engage the hip and back and work the quad and hamstrings and stretch the hip flexors.

I do a 5 minute isometric hold in the neutral spine position in the Roman chair.

The school of thought to some might be that it is counterproductive to racing, if you feel this way, why is that?

From personal experience, working my legs in the gym results in slower climbing times up known routes. So I limit my leg workouts when racing. Also, if I am doing standing starts, jumps and sprints at the track, my legs are toast and more work in the gym seems counter productive.

I have found that it takes about 3 months to convert the added strength due to weight training to increased longer term power. So in a perfect world, one bulks up in the fall and reduces or stops leg work as the season approaches allowing enough time to eliminate any excess bulk while retaining an increment of strength that with time becomes useful power.

mattm

That is my theory as well.

However, I'm thinking about doing plyometrics of some sort soon to work on explosiveness & fast twitch goodness.

Hopefully I can set something up at home... anyone have ideas better than using a milk crate?

waterrockets 

I worked my 10x freeweight squat up from 300 lbs to 405 lbs and saw no benefit regarding my sprint (this was before power meters for me). Drag races with friends and my race sprint performances were unchanged.

My old knee problems started coming into the picture, so I just gave up weights completely. Same with shoulders. I imagine I could learn new techniques to get some in-gym resistance training done without agitating chronic injuries, but given the 33% jump in squat strength (same % increase for extensions, leg curls, and leg press during that time), I don't see the motivation.

Contrast that with my on-bike strength training, and I was able to bump my 5" power from 1500W to 1750W, and my 1' power from 650W to 820W, doing nothing but riding.

SalsaPodio

You can work on explosiveness and fast twitch goodness by doing sprints.

mattm

And I do.. but for days when I don't feel like riding (usually weekdays after work, when it's dark/cold out), I'd like to have a backup workout that I could do at home and not feel lazy. (and not ride the stupid trainer)

Wii "yoga" just isn't cutting it anymore..

Debusama

[QUOTE=waterrockets;13601221]I worked my 10x freeweight squat up from 300 lbs to 405 lbs and saw no benefit regarding my sprint (this was before power meters for me). Drag races with friends and my race sprint performances were unchanged.

If you were doing sets of 10 squats @ 405, you must have had a hell of a strong lower back. Unfortunately, there is know if the injuries you didn't have may have been helped by the core strength you built by doing those squats.

ridethecliche

WR.

That weight is a bit excessive. If you lowered the weight and concentrated on explosiveness, then you'd probably have found more benefit.

Aki,

Kettlebell/dumbell snatches work the hips like crazy.
Try turkish getups as well. Great for the core.

RedLeg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_Dq_NCzj8M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQ6vrrIz-ws

wacomme

This is my new-found approach to weights. I do everything to make the lifts unstable and thus work the core.

The gym is my new friend. Diagnosed with severe spine degeneration and foramenal stenosis, I took to heart what the spine docs said, "Work the core, stretch, and avoid impact sports if you want to avoid spinal surgery and continue bike racing." Now, with base training ramping up, I'm going to the gym 2x/week instead of 3x/week. I'm also trying to fit in yoga at least 2x/week. At age 50, I figure year-round gym work is good for me to maintain strength. I focus on the entire body, and try to incorporate core into all lifts. Hermes offered a few new lifts to try; it's good to mix it up and not get into the habit of doing the same routine over and over.

mattm

Thanks - but I refuse to do burpees! Ever.

And the kettle bell looks interesting, but I want explosiveness for my legs...

markymark69

I do a standard weight lifting routine through out the year. 1 compound exercise & 1 isolated exercise per bodypart. The only modification is in season, I dont train legs. Personally I cant imagine not lifting weights just for general strength and fitness. I will never be a pro so I have a more general outlook on racing.

SalsaPodio

Chicks dig skinny arms and huge legs.

Hermes

He needs to work on the legs.

mikerhymeswith

Lifting free-weight 1-3 sessions per week since May for the most part; half-squats, lunges, hip stuff with bands, some dumbbell stuff; core stuff same frequency; just started alternating days for weight and core which make for better adherence to schedule - beats the boredom I think; have been raising weight, sets, reps very slowly to monitor and correct things that affect my left knee and right lower back (i'm tilted to the left)

Lifting and core improvements coincide with gentle improvements in FTP, timed courses, and 'cross finishes. Being content with the slow rate of improvement is another recent development.

Now doing the what was once unthinkable: riding p/t on a trainer. Rode an entire hour of rollers a couple of days ago too. Weird. It seems like the trainer and rollers let me concentrate on converting my growing overall strength to pedaling efficiency and balance, and not get distracted by all the things of a real bike ride. Impossible without auditory enhancement however. Finding the BPS matched to desired cadence is beneficial.

Will probably continue to lift year-round using some periodization technique. Loss of strength occurs quickly otherwise. Don't want to loose technique either. Kettleballs and plyo might sneak in. Doing 200 jump-ropes daily which is somewhat similar.

ericm979

At 6' and 142 lbs I look similar to Rassmussen, minus the spots and shades. And older of course.

I usually do 2x/wk in the off season and 1x/wk the rest of the year, with a month or so off when I'm building for a peak and want to use all my energy for riding.

I find that when I stop lifting I feel weaker over all. Lifting doesn't make me faster it just makes me feel better. At one point in my 20s I was lifting for 2 hours 3x week and got pretty strong for a skinny freak, but it didn't make me faster. Or bigger- I weighed 4 lbs less then.