Tolfan, I went and looked at those two pugs today. They weren't PX10as I can tell from reading on the web. I didn't buy them because they had no markings that showed any steel or any frame model. they had no serial numbers on the BB. They had no stickers that showed anything that would give a clue. the drops were stamped as I could tell. One had large flange Normandy hub wheels that were steel. they both had mafac brakes and stronglight cranks, but I have no idea what model they were, they are 170 in length. they had simplex der. wish I could tell more.

are the stems much shorter on vintage bikes? The toptube should have fit me but the bike felt very small, even though it measured close to me current bike.

Oh, the lugs were painted gold on the edges and no braze on cables/

Thanks for any help,

Chad