StankApe/Pinkrobe: great to have that extended comment. As in post above, the VFRs don't show up much round here; my (much loved) LBS carries both Giant and Norco -- it stocks the Giant FCR (which I am considering), but not the VFRs, though can easily get them on order. I'm considering switching from road-ified mtb to a road-based bike, but do really like discs, which the FCR doesn't have (the FCRs are now the same frame as the Aust. CRS (or X??), but a disc version isn't available in N.A., unlike in Oz.