Originally Posted by
NeilGunton
Hi Vik,
Yes, I've already investigated the Surly Long Haul Trucker. In fact I own a 56cm, which is the smallest of their 700C sizes. My bike shop guy talked to Surly as to whether I would also be able to fit the 54cm, since the top tube on the 56cm seems on the long side for me (I have fitted a very short stem), but surprisingly they came back saying no way would it fit. Something about not being able to get the bars high enough, not exactly sure.
Interesting thing is, the Rivendell Atlantis is still 26" in their 56cm size. So obviously the Surly LHT is not an exact copy as some people seem to claim. I don't know why Surly went to 700C for the 56cm - I get toe overlap with the front wheel, which is kind of annoying. I think that bike would be more natural in a 26", personally. In any case, the Atlantis in a 56cm might be good for me, but I haven't done a detailed fit on that.
On the Thorn front, I've pretty much discounted going to them because of the horrendous exchange rate that currently exists between the US dollar and UK pound. Also, they are quite expensive wherever you live. It's true that they seem to make really nice bikes, but I decided to try and find other possibilities which are more "native" to where I'm living currently.
In fact, the Novara Safari (which I also have) is turning out to be a very nice bike to ride. Also people on crazyguyonabike have been pointing to various stock bikes which exist (e.g. the Diamondback Transporter) which are quite cheap and yet would seem to have the right kind of geometry for what I'm talking about.
I don't think a bike like this should have to cost thousands, or even much more than $1000 really. I'd like a no-frills design that I'm not afraid to ding around and really use. If I pay thousands for a bike then I feel like I'm more likely to sit at home cooing over it than take it out to get scratched up!
In any case, it's not an urgent matter, more of an ongoing interest. The Safari is great for now, and I may even try to convert my Kona Lava Dome to be more "expedition" ready - put a Surly Instigator fork on there to replace the current suspension fork, and it should be pretty decent.
Neil
Neil I feel your pain with the exchange rate as I lived through a period where a $1USD=$1.5CDN...
I have to say that I'd scratch the Safari from my list of potential expedition touring bikes because off the disc brakes, as you noted in your earlier post simple and easily repairable the world over is what you want in an expedition touring bike. Plus disc brakes require a stiff fork that ends up not providing a nice comfortable ride like the steel forks on the LHT or Thorn bikes.
I also agree $1000 is a good price to shoot for and you certainly can do it
IF you have the volume Surly does with the LHT
AND you have the buying power of QBP behind you as Surly has to provide low cost OEM Parts. As soon as you start talking lower volumes and you don't have a parts supplier like QBP I don't see how you'd meet a $1000 price point for a business venture.
If you don't fit a 26" wheel Surly and you don't want to go the Thorn route you can certainly get rolling on 26" wheels with a number of other bikes. However, I think the many small and not so small touring design tweaks you get in a LHT or Thorn make a noticeable difference in how they ride.
Originally Posted by
DuckFat
A good possibility is to take the Thorn frames and build them up with domestically sourced parts. This is what I am leaning towards doing with the MojoBike project. We would only be dinged on the exchange rate for the frame and not all the components. Of course, we could also take an LHT frame and build that up as well. Or we could look to have a frame made for us to our specs. I noticed that Neil made it over there but I really want the rest of you to come over and hash it out on the
project website.
I love brainstorming stuff like this and I'm sure collective wisdom will come up with something cool.
I think the Thorn Sherpa is a great bike that fits the bill perfectly for a 26" wheeled expedition touring bike that isn't stratospherically priced, but you can buy the frame sets now and build them up. Perhaps if you buy in bulk you can get the price down for sale in North America? Honestly I would be cautious about tweaking a refined design like this unless you want to spend a 12-24 months testing the new ideas and validating they actually work.
You could also talk to Surly and Novara about making a full range of 26" wheeled expedition touring bikes. Both companies seem okay with tackling some of the smaller niche markets. Surly in particular might get jazzed about selling a full-on expedition touring bike like the Thorn EXP. It would fit right into their "style".
Originally Posted by
staehpj1
The one thing that I doubt is the assertion that the LHT would sell better if it had 26" wheels in all frame sizes. I am pretty sure that offering it only in 26" would be risky at best. Offering it as an option is almost like coming out with another whole bike. So yes they would sell some with 26" wheels in the larger sizes, but enough additional sales to warrant stocking two different frames in most of their sizes? I think that is far from a sure thing.
Some disagree, but I think the advantages/disadvantages between 700c and 26" are kind of a wash for most uses and to depart from the norm the advantage should be clear cut. Third world expedition style touring is the only place where there is a major advantage for 26" in any but the smaller sizes IMO.
+1 - the only place where having a 26" wheel is really important IMO is for an expedition touring bike where getting parts internationally is an issue. The problem as you note is this is a really small market. Only a few people really need a bike like this and a bunch more would ride one because they are cool, but you aren't taking a huge sales volume.