Thanks again guys. The frame size is 22.5 inch all the hybrids listed on bikepedia only went to 21.5 all the tourers were made in 22.5 and up to 23.5; my guess is for the American market at least all the hybrids had gone to a sloping toptube. With the huge wheels base it is defiantly tourer geometry, but it has a lack of bosses for panniers though on the rear stay it has the spoke holder and the bracket in the photo which I guess could be for a spare brake pad. Maybe a townie/workhorse type thing. Miamijim I was unable to find any info on the circa, I'm not sure but sometimes I wonder if anyone at google knows that Europe exists. Do you know much about the circa? I have a Peugeot venteux it is 501 but only 3 tubes, one of my friends has an old peugeot racer that he keeps for sentimental reasons, I was amazed when i picked it up and nearly put my back out. I didnt know you could get a racer that heavy. anyway I am interested in knowing all about this bike, or as much as I can so I appreciate the responses