Reflectors do work
07-26-16 | 05:55 AM
#26
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OP had advance notice of a cyclist and was able to react/plan accordingly for no other reason than the fact that the cyclist had reflectors on his bike.
Reflectors that came on the bike right out of the box and always work as intended.
Nobody has to remember to buy and install them later or clip them on or charge them up or replace their battery.
I feel sorry for the hardcore bike fashion queens who cannot understand this.
Keep matching your shoes, water bottles and handlebar tape though ladies
Reflectors that came on the bike right out of the box and always work as intended.
Nobody has to remember to buy and install them later or clip them on or charge them up or replace their battery.
I feel sorry for the hardcore bike fashion queens who cannot understand this.
Keep matching your shoes, water bottles and handlebar tape though ladies
07-26-16 | 10:44 AM
#27
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On today's city roads it is just not safe to ride day or night without active and passive lighting. Meaning reflectors and lights front and rear. There are more ways for drivers to get distracted today than there were even just 10 years ago. No, reflectors and lights are not a silver bullet but they do increase your odds of being seen. That just may save your life some day.
Your best defense is still your brain with the aid of a rear view mirror on your riding glasses. Your brain should be telling you reflectors and lights......
Your best defense is still your brain with the aid of a rear view mirror on your riding glasses. Your brain should be telling you reflectors and lights......
isn't going to see a reflector.
OP had advance notice of a cyclist and was able to react/plan accordingly for no other reason than the fact that the cyclist had reflectors on his bike.
Reflectors that came on the bike right out of the box and always work as intended.
Nobody has to remember to buy and install them later or clip them on or charge them up or replace their battery.
I feel sorry for the hardcore bike fashion queens who cannot understand this.
Keep matching your shoes, water bottles and handlebar tape though ladies
Reflectors that came on the bike right out of the box and always work as intended.
Nobody has to remember to buy and install them later or clip them on or charge them up or replace their battery.
I feel sorry for the hardcore bike fashion queens who cannot understand this.
Keep matching your shoes, water bottles and handlebar tape though ladies
Milton Keynes may have seen someone's wheel reflectors at night but would he have missed the lights like my pictures above? Reflectors are okay for a last ditch, emergency back up but carry multiple active light sources and not depending on reflectors is far better.
__________________
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
07-26-16 | 11:04 AM
#28
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...!!!WHAMMMO!!!...
.
...all of your worldly troubles are over.
.
.
.
Last edited by JoeyBike; 07-26-16 at 11:07 AM.
07-26-16 | 02:15 PM
#29
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One of the first clues cops notice about drunk drivers is the failure to turn on their headlights. So there you are churning away on your reflective bike wearing all black at 2AM on the way home from the pub minding your own business, safe in the notion that you have the legal minimum safety gear on the rear of your steed when...
...!!!WHAMMMO!!!...
.
...all of your worldly troubles are over.
.
.
.
...!!!WHAMMMO!!!...
.
...all of your worldly troubles are over.
.
.
.
__________________
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
07-26-16 | 04:12 PM
#31
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Here's why reflectors are useless in the situation you described.
You were 100 yards (300 feet) from the intersection, when you spotted a bicycle crossing directly in front of you. Suppose you were traveling at 60 mph (90 ft/sec). It would have taken you 3.3 seconds to reach that intersection. In the meantime, the bicycle may have been traveling at 10 mph (15 ft/sec). The bicycle would have traveled 50 ft before you reached the intersection.
Let's further assume it would have taken you an additional 5 seconds to turn onto the street on which the bicycle was headed. The bicycle would have traveled an additional 75 feet. Thus, the bicycle would have been a 125 feet ahead of you at the time you actually turned onto the street.
Wheel reflectors would not be seen by you, once you and the bicycle were on the same road and going in the same direction. Something else would be required for the cyclist to be seen by you, e.g. taillights.
What did the wheel reflectors contribute? You saw the bicycle from a distance, in which the bicyclist was never in any danger. The bicyclist was long gone by the time you reached the impact point.
You were 100 yards (300 feet) from the intersection, when you spotted a bicycle crossing directly in front of you. Suppose you were traveling at 60 mph (90 ft/sec). It would have taken you 3.3 seconds to reach that intersection. In the meantime, the bicycle may have been traveling at 10 mph (15 ft/sec). The bicycle would have traveled 50 ft before you reached the intersection.
Let's further assume it would have taken you an additional 5 seconds to turn onto the street on which the bicycle was headed. The bicycle would have traveled an additional 75 feet. Thus, the bicycle would have been a 125 feet ahead of you at the time you actually turned onto the street.
Wheel reflectors would not be seen by you, once you and the bicycle were on the same road and going in the same direction. Something else would be required for the cyclist to be seen by you, e.g. taillights.
What did the wheel reflectors contribute? You saw the bicycle from a distance, in which the bicyclist was never in any danger. The bicyclist was long gone by the time you reached the impact point.
I do agree that lights + reflectors is the way to go. And you can call me a Fred for having wheel reflectors but at least they do work.
07-26-16 | 04:14 PM
#32
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Thank you. This is the exact basic point I was trying to get across.
07-27-16 | 07:41 AM
#34
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Generally not the case in my area, where more drunks are caught due to a headlight, taillight or brake light being burned out, rather than forgetting to turn on their lights.
07-27-16 | 07:59 AM
#35
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If you have good powerful lights front and rear, there is not need for reflectors...other than as the legal requirement that is part of the (somewhat outdated) Uniform Vehicle Code. I guarantee that someone approaching me from the front or rear with these lights
isn't going to see a reflector.
Perhaps some of us don't remove the reflectors due to fashion but remove them because we realized that they are ineffective band-aids that are stuck on bikes for those people who can't figure out that active lighting is far better than depending on the light from some vehicle to light them up.
Milton Keynes may have seen someone's wheel reflectors at night but would he have missed the lights like my pictures above? Reflectors are okay for a last ditch, emergency back up but carry multiple active light sources and not depending on reflectors is far better.
isn't going to see a reflector.
Perhaps some of us don't remove the reflectors due to fashion but remove them because we realized that they are ineffective band-aids that are stuck on bikes for those people who can't figure out that active lighting is far better than depending on the light from some vehicle to light them up.
Milton Keynes may have seen someone's wheel reflectors at night but would he have missed the lights like my pictures above? Reflectors are okay for a last ditch, emergency back up but carry multiple active light sources and not depending on reflectors is far better.
Citation? Oh right, this is just opinion based in...well, nothing really.
Last edited by jfowler85; 07-27-16 at 08:02 AM.
07-27-16 | 08:12 AM
#36
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But the point is, had he not had the wheel reflectors, I would have never seen him at that distance. I would have turned down the same street after he crossed, and had he also not have had rear reflectors I very easily could have hit him. But the fact that I saw the wheel reflectors 100 yards away, I knew to be careful for a cyclist up ahead in my path.
I do agree that lights + reflectors is the way to go. And you can call me a Fred for having wheel reflectors but at least they do work.
I do agree that lights + reflectors is the way to go. And you can call me a Fred for having wheel reflectors but at least they do work.
__________________
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
07-27-16 | 08:49 AM
#37
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The crossing path crash simulation results showed that none of the reflector or light treatments tested improved detection or recognition. All treatments were detected andrecognized at less than 200 feet. The results of this portion of the study demonstrate thedifficulties for effective countermeasure for a crossing path collision. Even the large area reflective sheeting target with good angularity characteristics did not perform well. Limitations of a driver's peripheral vision, limited headlight beam spread and background visual noise are known factors that contribute to decreasing detection and recognition distance. CPSC staff believes a bicycle side treatment with significantly increased signal strength may be necessary to improve detection distances under these conditions.
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Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
07-27-16 | 09:18 AM
#38
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I don't know... how many cyclists actually go out of their way to remove the very useful and life saving reflectors that come attached (very) securely to the spokes of their wheels? Furthermore, more than a few lights and flashers on the market are fairly effective reflectors by design, when not under power. Is the o.p. addressing a legitimate issue of cyclists purposely removing reflectors, whether to mount lights instead, or simply to experience the Ninja rush first hand? Also it must be said that a number of tires found on the kinds of bikes most likely to wind up ridden in traffic at night have highly reflective sidewalls. Just saying.
07-27-16 | 01:44 PM
#39
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Furthermore, more than a few lights and flashers on the market are fairly effective reflectors by design, when not under power.
07-27-16 | 01:58 PM
#41
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I love how so many of you are acting like the OP said you don't need lights, when all he said is reflectors are useful. The two are not mutually exclusive. Typical A&S, I guess, gotta fight about something!
07-27-16 | 02:01 PM
#42
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07-27-16 | 02:15 PM
#43
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And don't get me wrong, I don't think anyone should rely on reflectors alone. I never said that reflectors alone are better than lights. Anyone riding at night should have their bike lit up like a Christmas tree, as well as reflectors. It's my belief that you can't be too visible while riding at night. I'm just grateful the guy I saw left his reflectors on in lieu of actually having lights.
07-27-16 | 03:03 PM
#45
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I don't know... how many cyclists actually go out of their way to remove the very useful and life saving reflectors that come attached (very) securely to the spokes of their wheels? Furthermore, more than a few lights and flashers on the market are fairly effective reflectors by design, when not under power. Is the o.p. addressing a legitimate issue of cyclists purposely removing reflectors, whether to mount lights instead, or simply to experience the Ninja rush first hand? Also it must be said that a number of tires found on the kinds of bikes most likely to wind up ridden in traffic at night have highly reflective sidewalls. Just saying.
As for the reflectors being "life saving", read the CSPC report I linked to. Even they found them to be ineffective.
__________________
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Dreamin' of Bemidji Down the Mississippi (in part)
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Last edited by cyccommute; 07-27-16 at 03:12 PM.
07-27-16 | 04:38 PM
#47
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Except in this case they were mutually exclusive. The rider that Milton Keyness saw didn't have lights and was relying on reflectors only. The rider was probably under the impression that since the bike came with reflectors that was all he needed to ride at night. The Consumer Product Safety Commission may not want to be sending that message but that is the message being received.
07-27-16 | 06:00 PM
#48
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Unless he lives in the magic land of silky smooth roads with glowing curbs and streetlights that never go out, I can't imagine how anyone could ride a bike at night and not think it would be a good idea to put at least a headlight on it.
07-27-16 | 06:10 PM
#49
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A reflector is an array of small corner reflectors: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corner_reflector
Corner reflectors send light back in the direction from which it came.
For this reason, it will always be brightest when the observer is co-located with the source of the light.
Reflective tape accomplishes the same thing using tiny glass beads.
07-27-16 | 06:37 PM
#50
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While living in an urban setting with abundant street lighting I rode 20+ years with nothing but reflectors. It's rare I saw other cyclists back then, and although I can't swear to it, I don't recall ever seeing another with lighting. After living in the burbs for awhile I did purchase what many here would consider minimal lighting, just to watch out for pot holes, and a moderate blinky on the rear in lieu of not having a reflector at that bike. I find it comical, and somewhat annoying seeing ultra bright strobes on the MUP during daylight hours. Many of the lights I see at night are just obnoxiously bright, and hinder my vision.