wphamilton

This one seems obvious when you think about it, but I didn't even realize I was doing it. Which makes it a bad habit, and maybe worth reminding people about.

The situation: I'm coming up to my left turn, wide lanes and multiple lanes including dedicated turn lanes. The cars are queued up so I filter up to sit beside the first in line. There's plenty of room and I'm going to turn wide into the bike lane, pacing the lead car or just behind him, out of everyone's way. It works pretty well, when there's lots of room.

The light turns green, wait a couple of seconds for traffic to clear, the car on my left goes and I go. All good, right? Wrong, don't do that! As soon as we enter the intersection, we're slamming the brakes because some fool is shooting through the red - he must have been going 70. I have unusual reflexes which saved me, but thank God the driver on my left also stopped in time because his car wouldn't have been much of a "shield" if he'd been hit at that speed.

Always look first, even when other cars are already entering the left turn! When I'm in front, of course I look and I'm not going until I see them stop. But I just trusted the other driver in front, and I didn't realize consciously that I did until almost too late. Subconscious habit. Stay aware out there!

KD5NRH

I tend to do this with 1-ton+ duallies and other large vehicles. If anything hits them hard enough to move them several feet to the side, I'll likely be in the mess whether I'm alongside or still hanging back.

FBinNY 

Thanks for the reminder.

Fortunately (or unfortunately) I spend plenty time in Mount Vernon, NY, where every intersection is an adventure. I'm used to large numbers of drivers running lights, or racing to beat ones about to change, making turns from poor lance placement, and (my personal worst) cutting lefts too close, and chopping the corner where cars or bicycles may be coming to a stop.

Riding in a flea circus is good training, and conditions the brain to treat every intersection as if there were no lights or stop signs. I'm always thinking about what a driver may do, rather than what he should do.

Chris0516

Unless I read your description of the road wrong, would it be a safe presumption of mine? That the road you were on had 1-Left Turn 1-Left Turn/Straight Lane 1-Straight Lane 1-Right Turn Only Lane

Is that the lane configuration of the road?

When I am on a busy road like that, I do follow the lead vehicle in the Left-Turn/Straight Lane, so I am in the 'outside' lane for the turn. But I don't follow so closely in the turn, that I would have to slam so hard on the brakes if the lead vehicle did. I also watch for speeding vehicles like the one you mentioned that blew through the red light.

wphamilton

1 left, 2 straight, 1 right.

I wasn't in danger from hitting the lead car - I was beside him pacing. The guy running the red missed him by inches.

1989Pre 

I'm sorry that happened to you, but I appreciate you sharing your experience and observation. It serves to remind us that a lot of what we do repeatedly becomes "automatic" and that vigilance gradually makes way for imitation.
We also have to remember that intersections are where a lot of accidents happen. I think the best thing you can do at these places is to ride slowly and with a great deal of suspicion.
I'm glad you avoided mis-hap. It sounds like a near-disaster.

wphamilton

I don't know about "slowly" but you're spot on. No "automatic" and always treat the intersection with vigilance.

Chris0516

I wasn't thinking you were in danger of rear-ending the vehicle. I was just thinking of how close you 'might' have been to the vehicle, in the turn.

ItsJustMe

This is the sort of thing that might get me someday, because I'm not used to people running lights. I can't recall the last time I saw someone run a light; it's probably been 20 years.

canklecat

That's why I always try to get directly behind the first or second car, rather than beside the first. I'm always expecting someone to run the light just after it turns red. And I can usually accelerate enough to keep pace with the car ahead of me across the intersection, so I'm not holding up anyone behind me. There's a really tricky starfish shaped intersection in our city with the potential for a vehicle coming from any direction if it runs the red light. Keeps my eyes on stalks and head on a swivel riding through there.

AdvXtrm

I stay away from motorized vehicles as much as I can at all times, including intersections of course. "Mingling" with them is a great way to die. It's bad enough mingling with cars and trucks while riding a motorcycle and fully geared up, but on a bicycle, you can't where that kind of gear; and you will be one crippled up or dead full eventually.

howsteepisit

What is it with this fearmongering? The odds against being killed on a bicycle are very very low. there are some 700 deaths per year in the entire US, with how many million bike rides? Chance of being "cripple up" are also vey low.

Paul Barnard

Especially from his screen name.

winston63 

That's what I normally try to do as well - take the lane in behind some of the lead cars. I can easily keep up for the duration of the turn so I'm not holding anybody up.

On a couple of busy, tricky intersections I won't even do that. I'll just go straight through on the green and re position myself to go straight through again on the cross street when the light changes. Takes a bit longer but avoids some of the stress and danger of navigating a tricky turn with lots of inattentive drivers.

AdvXtrm

Even for trolls, you're both not very bright. A little common sense even beyond the figures goes a long way as well.

"How big is the problem?
Deaths and Injuries

In 2013 in the U.S., over 900 bicyclists were killed and there were an estimated 494,000 emergency department visits due to bicycle-related injuries.3
Cost

Data from 2010 show fatal and non-fatal crash-related injuries to bicyclists resulted in lifetime medical costs and productivity losses of $10 billion.3"
https://www.cdc.gov/motorvehiclesafety/bicycle/

"..research into hospital records shows that only a fraction of bicycle crashes causing injury are ever recorded by the police, possibly as low as ten percent."
Pedestrian & Bicycle Information Center

howsteepisit

Also noted from your source is that avioding riding on streets and roads is not considered an effective intervention:

How can bicycle-related injuries and deaths be prevented?

Effective Interventions

Effective interventions to reduce injuries and fatalities to bicyclists include the following:
Bicycle helmets

Bicycle helmets reduce the risk of head and brain injuries in the event of a crash.5 All bicyclists, regardless of age, can help protect themselves by wearing properly fitted bicycle helmets every time they ride.
Bicycle helmet laws for children

These laws are effective for increasing helmet use and reducing crash-related injuries and deaths among children.6
Bicycle helmet laws for adults

These laws increase helmet use among adults.6
Promising Interventions

Interventions that have shown promise for reducing injuries and fatalities to bicyclists include the following:
Active lighting and rider visibility

• Fluorescent clothing can make bicyclists visible from further away than regular clothing during the daytime.6
• Retro-reflective clothing can make bicyclists more visible at night.6
• Active lighting can include front white lights, rear red lights, or other lighting on the bicycle or bicyclist. This lighting may improve the visibility of bicyclists.6

Roadway engineering measures

Information about roadway engineering measures, like bike lanes, that can improve safety for bicyclists is available from The Pedestrian and Bicycle Information Center.


Also noting that this source does not seem to state which injuries and fatalities were related to MV involvement. I will stand corrected on the 900 rather than 700 deaths annually. And even with nearly 500,000 ER visits related to bicycling (noting once again no estimate of how many involved MV interaction) how many bike trips are there annually? NHTS says 9,000,000 per day. I will let you do the math as I am not intelligent enough for multiplication of that magnitude. I will posit that the annual chance of injury or death on bicycle with or without MV involvement is nearly insignificant.

FullGas

sorry, but those stats are not particularly scary...

Chris0516

I presume you live outside the suburbs of any city in Michigan?

The OP lives in the suburbs of Atlanta(GA):https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpharetta,_Georgia

Red light runners are a common sight in cities.

I see them all the time in the MD-DC-VA region.

CB HI

Be careful, some day you may inadvertently see the statistics for falling out of bed and deaths while sleeping in bed. Where will you sleep then?

FBinNY 

Well, despite the good intentions of the OP, in offering a friendly, experience based reminder of a specific, easily forgotten potential risk, the thread managed to degrade in pointless trolling and name calling in less than 20 posts.

This may be a new BF record.


Chill out guys. Ride wherever and however you feel is OK. Just ride smart, and stop trying to sell your personal preference as better.

FBinNY 

You're kind of new here, having only signed on this summer. You don't know the players, so until you find the playbook, or get to know who's who, you might go easy with posts that start this way.

If people didn't factor your newness and apparent unawareness of the rules relating to courtesy, you might have been reported, and gotten a PM from a Mod.


BTW - while you don't ride on shared roads, the thread was started by someone with decades of experience doing so, and addressed at fellow road users. So, since you've already made a decision, this thread isn't relevant to you. Having said your piece, common courtesy would dictate that you let those for whom this is relevant have their discussion, free of further trolling.

I-Like-To-Bike

AdvXtrm should be especially fearful of going to a hospital; he would be shocked, shocked to learn how many people die there every year.

jfowler85

It's so unusual that the guy right next to you has the same super power...that's like, unusual x2!

wphamilton

Might have taken him a second or two to stop after seeing it. Maybe his car warned him. There's no way of knowing.

It's better to see it coming than to rely on reactions, skills, routine or whatever you believe your edge is. Even if that means looking over the next lane of cars before starting to roll.

wphamilton

I think it must be the season, allergies to politics is going around.