Legal question about lights
#26
I'm good to go!
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,991
Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020
Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6194 Post(s)
Liked 4,810 Times
in
3,318 Posts
A luxor light from my perspective is directional.
#27
Non omnino gravis
I'm hosing out around 1000 lumens (forward) when riding in the dark (350 on the bars, 650 on the helmet.) Lord help the night vision of any poor soul who is coming directly at me. I run my Hotshot PRO on steady, so it's only 90lm lighting up everything for 50 feet behind me in a soft red. Red is better for night vision, but you're gonna get a big dot in your vision anyway. All the lamps are very directional.
Luxor lights aside, if I had a string of LEDs on my back, no one could see it.
Luxor lights aside, if I had a string of LEDs on my back, no one could see it.
#28
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 711
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 622 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I'll start looking for LEDs.
The reason I was concerned is because I know vehicles can't have rear white lights but I don't know if the law was written narrowly for motorized vehicles or broadly for all vehicles. I'll keep using what I have for now....and start looking at a brighter front light.
The reason I was concerned is because I know vehicles can't have rear white lights but I don't know if the law was written narrowly for motorized vehicles or broadly for all vehicles. I'll keep using what I have for now....and start looking at a brighter front light.
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 38,716
Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter
Mentioned: 140 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5788 Post(s)
Liked 2,580 Times
in
1,430 Posts
I'll start looking for LEDs.
The reason I was concerned is because I know vehicles can't have rear white lights but I don't know if the law was written narrowly for motorized vehicles or broadly for all vehicles. I'll keep using what I have for now....and start looking at a brighter front light.
The reason I was concerned is because I know vehicles can't have rear white lights but I don't know if the law was written narrowly for motorized vehicles or broadly for all vehicles. I'll keep using what I have for now....and start looking at a brighter front light.
Consider -- while cars can't have rear racing white lights -- as vehicle lights, there's no law that prevents someone from having some sort of decorative lights on the rear deck, and visible from the rear. Likewise, your backpack, lit or not isn't covered by any kind of law, so do whatever you wish and don't worry about what nobody else is going to either.
As for buying LEDs vs. using what you have, consider that you already own these, so using them won't cost you a cent. IF you are unhappy with battery life, then you might consider buying LEDs or replacing them with another idea (or nothing).
__________________
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
Last edited by FBinNY; 09-03-17 at 06:42 PM.
#30
What happened?
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Around here somewhere
Posts: 7,927
Bikes: 3 Rollfasts, 3 Schwinns, a Shelby and a Higgins Flightliner in a pear tree!
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1835 Post(s)
Liked 292 Times
in
255 Posts
I once saw a kid with those shoes that flash red lights when you step walking down a dark road once.
Everyone going to and coming from the bar looked nervous.
Everyone going to and coming from the bar looked nervous.
__________________
I don't know nothing, and I memorized it in school and got this here paper I'm proud of to show it.
#31
SE Wis
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 10,515
Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970
Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2747 Post(s)
Liked 3,396 Times
in
2,056 Posts
if you're worried dab a little red nail polish on them
#32
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 124
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 160 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Don't ever ask police in California about the laws regarding bike lights. They have NO clue. In fact, they have no clue about anything bike law related.
#33
Been Around Awhile
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Burlington Iowa
Posts: 29,973
Bikes: Vaterland and Ragazzi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked 1,536 Times
in
1,045 Posts
Sure, just ask total strangers on the Internet who are self-styled experts on the law and law enforcement; these characters with attitude overload are anxious to provide clues about everything.
#34
Senior Member
Don't know what state you are in but for instance, I can google "NC Bicycle Laws" and get plenty of info. I'd suggest finding out for yourself what your State Statutes are. In the end, any state's laws and statutes are interpreted by the State Attorney General's office, and by extension, the local DA's office and court systems.
Cops aren't paid to interpret the laws. Sure, they SHOULD be knowledgeable, some are and many think they ARE, but that doesn't mean they all are.
Last edited by WNCGoater; 09-06-17 at 07:15 AM.
#35
You gonna eat that?
I get the sense that's how it's looked at where I live. I run stop signs and red lights with some regularity (but only if it's clear for a long way). Occasionally I notice a cop in the distance and they've never hassled me.
#36
Been Around Awhile
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Burlington Iowa
Posts: 29,973
Bikes: Vaterland and Ragazzi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked 1,536 Times
in
1,045 Posts
I'll promise you that officer won't show up to A. Testify on your behalf and B. Tell the judge he's wrong.
Don't know what state you are in but for instance, I can google "NC Bicycle Laws" and get plenty of info. I'd suggest finding out for yourself what your State Statutes are. In the end, any state's laws and statutes are interpreted by the State Attorney General's office, and by extension, the local DA's office and court systems.
Cops aren't paid to interpret the laws. Sure, they SHOULD be knowledgeable, some are and many think they ARE, but that doesn't mean they all are.
Don't know what state you are in but for instance, I can google "NC Bicycle Laws" and get plenty of info. I'd suggest finding out for yourself what your State Statutes are. In the end, any state's laws and statutes are interpreted by the State Attorney General's office, and by extension, the local DA's office and court systems.
Cops aren't paid to interpret the laws. Sure, they SHOULD be knowledgeable, some are and many think they ARE, but that doesn't mean they all are.
Does anyone on this thread, or anywhere for that matter, actually think that drivers are not aware of the traffic laws concerning speeding, drunk driving, illegal parking or a host of other traffic laws that they violate often, if not everyday?
#37
Been Around Awhile
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Burlington Iowa
Posts: 29,973
Bikes: Vaterland and Ragazzi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked 1,536 Times
in
1,045 Posts
#39
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 3,947
Bikes: Trek 1100 road bike, Roadmaster gravel/commuter/beater mountain bike
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2281 Post(s)
Liked 1,710 Times
in
936 Posts
I mean, really, it's not like she's shining a 1,000,000 candlepower spotlight backwards from her bike, it's just little white battery powered Christmas lights. I really doubt any cop would write a ticket for that.
#40
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Metro Detroit/AA
Posts: 8,207
Bikes: 2016 Novara Mazama
Mentioned: 63 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3640 Post(s)
Liked 81 Times
in
51 Posts
Folks roll all over Detroit with their bikes decked out in any number of flashing colored lights at night, without issue. Some of the light displays are quite the works of art.
You should be fine.
You should be fine.
#41
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 377 Post(s)
Liked 221 Times
in
121 Posts
I do agree though, the officers name and date and time would be helpful but still not 100%. 6 months from now the officer might not even be able to recall the conversation.
Saying someone from the police department told me it was okay won't work IF ticketed and it goes to court.
My .02
#42
I'm good to go!
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,991
Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020
Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6194 Post(s)
Liked 4,810 Times
in
3,318 Posts
Someone a while back in this thread came up with the most correct answer. And that is the laws on lights generally only deal with the lights that are required to be used while biking. I've never seen any that say you cannot use something.
However it would be unsafe to use lighting that will impair your vision or the vision of oncoming or overtaking traffic.
However it would be unsafe to use lighting that will impair your vision or the vision of oncoming or overtaking traffic.
#43
Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 4
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I just got a reflective jacket but here in southern California the heat is strong even at night
#44
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 377 Post(s)
Liked 221 Times
in
121 Posts
Someone a while back in this thread came up with the most correct answer. And that is the laws on lights generally only deal with the lights that are required to be used while biking. I've never seen any that say you cannot use something.
However it would be unsafe to use lighting that will impair your vision or the vision of oncoming or overtaking traffic.
However it would be unsafe to use lighting that will impair your vision or the vision of oncoming or overtaking traffic.
#45
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 38,716
Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter
Mentioned: 140 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5788 Post(s)
Liked 2,580 Times
in
1,430 Posts
Yes, there may be laws that cover blue strobes, or insanely bright or blinding lights, but that's not what we're talking about here.
What saddens me about the thread is what it says about our culture, where so many worry about, or assume there would be laws covering all kinds of minor aspects of daily life.
We're talking about a legal non-issue, worst case unlikely scenario, a cop decides to cite the OP, to do so, he'd have to list the SPECIFIC code violation, then a judge would have to concur, then assess a fine. The chances of this chain of events happening are infinitesimal, and the reality is that no cop would ever cite it, nor would any judge levy a fine.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
#46
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 3,947
Bikes: Trek 1100 road bike, Roadmaster gravel/commuter/beater mountain bike
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2281 Post(s)
Liked 1,710 Times
in
936 Posts
But asking the cop to cite the specific traffic ordinance which says you can't have lights on a backpack while riding a bicycle will get the ticket thrown out of court.
#47
I'm good to go!
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,991
Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020
Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6194 Post(s)
Liked 4,810 Times
in
3,318 Posts
#48
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 377 Post(s)
Liked 221 Times
in
121 Posts
So because you've not seen them they don't exist? Love internet law professors...
The OP is asking about what are essentially decorative lights on a backpack. I challenge you to find ANY laws that would apply to that.
Yes, there may be laws that cover blue strobes, or insanely bright or blinding lights, but that's not what we're talking about here.
What saddens me about the thread is what it says about our culture, where so many worry about, or assume there would be laws covering all kinds of minor aspects of daily life.
We're talking about a legal non-issue, worst case unlikely scenario, a cop decides to cite the OP, to do so, he'd have to list the SPECIFIC code violation, then a judge would have to concur, then assess a fine. The chances of this chain of events happening are infinitesimal, and the reality is that no cop would ever cite it, nor would any judge levy a fine.
Yes, there may be laws that cover blue strobes, or insanely bright or blinding lights, but that's not what we're talking about here.
What saddens me about the thread is what it says about our culture, where so many worry about, or assume there would be laws covering all kinds of minor aspects of daily life.
We're talking about a legal non-issue, worst case unlikely scenario, a cop decides to cite the OP, to do so, he'd have to list the SPECIFIC code violation, then a judge would have to concur, then assess a fine. The chances of this chain of events happening are infinitesimal, and the reality is that no cop would ever cite it, nor would any judge levy a fine.
The OP can be prudent and check local laws or listen to internet attorneys and hope she is never ticked for it, IF it's illegal in her area.
OP, I'd suggest you research your local laws. Maybe even find a bike kitchen in your area or a cycling club as both of those would be knowledgeable about the local laws in your area. You can also ask the local PD for the laws that cover lights (if there even are any where you live) and get them to give you the code so you can reference it..
Last edited by raqball; 09-07-17 at 03:39 PM. Reason: add quotes
#49
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 3,947
Bikes: Trek 1100 road bike, Roadmaster gravel/commuter/beater mountain bike
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2281 Post(s)
Liked 1,710 Times
in
936 Posts
So because you've not seen them they don't exist? Love internet law professors...
#50
I'm good to go!
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,991
Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020
Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6194 Post(s)
Liked 4,810 Times
in
3,318 Posts
Love internet law professors...
Really? I suggest you do a little more research. And for what it's worth, not everyone lives in the USA. Every jurisdiction on the planet will have different laws. Some random person telling them it's fine on the internet is meaningless in court. An officer telling you over the phone that it's okay is meaningless UNLESS that officer later testifies to that fact.
Really? I suggest you do a little more research. And for what it's worth, not everyone lives in the USA. Every jurisdiction on the planet will have different laws. Some random person telling them it's fine on the internet is meaningless in court. An officer telling you over the phone that it's okay is meaningless UNLESS that officer later testifies to that fact.
My advice still stands until you prove you are a better internet law professor.
What you can do in court is not the issue here. Common sense generally will keep you out of court.