Leisesturm

IDK... is it really necessary that I be noticed by the distracted driver in the southbound oncoming traffic, who would have to cross one lane going in his direction, and TWO more, with traffic opposing him in order to hit me in the northbound bike lane. <shrug> I am GLAD that I don't lose too much sleep about such imponderables. Saves money and time too.

bobwysiwyg

No. BUT, how about crossing traffic noticing you sooner be it in lanes or pulling out of a commercial lot or driveway. I've had many of the latter pull up short because they noticed me because of the front light. To each his own as they say.

Leebo

Its the same driver that will be left hooking you later.

merziac

Multiple lights, front and rear, blinking, flashing or non, 24/7 period. Many states and insurance companies have/had a question on accident reports, were the lights on? And it can help in a trial if they were depending on which end of the negligence you're on. Most trucks have a sign that says lights on for safety because their insurance companies require it for the same reason motorcycle headlights are on whenever it's running because it's safer and it helps the companies in a lawsuit. It will help you to.

fietsbob

I have a Brompton folding bike, I bought a new dynamo hub, a German B&M Eyc senso T headlight..

it has 3 LED 2 flat ones are the daylight runners, and the stand light when stopped, the bright one is hooked up to the light sensor..

Wired to it is the rear light another B&M product..





....

seeker333

Headlights which appear blindingly bright at night are usually barely perceptible in daytime, especially on sunny days on a busy roadway. For daytime use, I recommend operating a white-ish headlight in flashing mode if you hope to get the attention of approaching motorists. I further recommend Action LED lights, I have bought from him 3-4X in the past and never been disappointed. Their batteries are much longer-lived than the junk sold by most of the light sellers. Here's a good headlight to suit your needs, at reasonable price:

https://www.action-led-lights.com/co...ode-bike-light

BTW, there is a dedicated subforum for lights, you may wish to review for more information.

vol

Curious, those of you who use daytime headlight, where do you ride? I ride in Manhattan and don't feel the need. I can see the importance of it on a, say, country road with turns and hills.

rachel120

Usually I don't have a daytime light, sometimes I do. When I do it's when I would turn on my lights in the car. Not to see, but to be seen in poorly lit situations. And I'm in a small city.

mr_bill

The three cities around here - Boston/Cambridge/Somerville.

If you ride midtown and uptown, with wide straight avenues, intersections FAR apart, but even crosstown, still straight though a bit of an obstacle course, I can sort of see why you think you don't need them.

But below 14th street on the other hand, or across the rivers....

The more twisty little passages all alike you ride in, the more frequent the intersections, the more you ride in and out of shadow, the more useful daytime running lights are. Especially in cities. And, in the rare places where we have straight-ish roads, we still have a lot of street trees, again, riding in and out of shadows.

-mr. bill

VegasTriker

You are making a blanket statement for an entire continent. Looking at just a few countries seems to disprove your ban.
Holland - Your Internet Guide to Cycling in Holland
Requirements for bicycle lights and reflectors
Bicycle lights:

• Front light - white or yellow
• Back light - red
• Lights have to shine straight ahead
• Flashing lights are not allowed
• Loose lights (i.e. not fixed to the bike) are allowed if properly visible and attached to your upper body, not to your head or limbs

UK - A guide to Cycling Lighting Regulations
The following items are the minimum required, on a bicycle or tricycle, in order to ride it legally at night:
Front Lamp

One is required, showing a white light, positioned centrally or offside, up to 1500mm from the ground, aligned towards and visible from the front. If capable of emitting a steady light, it must be marked as conforming to BS6102/3 or an equivalent EC standard.
If capable of emitting only a flashing light, it must emit at least 4 candela.
Rear Lamp

One is required, to show a red light, positioned centrally or offside, between 350mm and 1500mm from the ground, at or near the rear, aligned towards and visible from behind. If capable of emitting a steady light it must be marked as conforming to BS3648, or BS6102/3, or an equivalent EC standard.
If capable of emitting only a flashing light, it must emit at least 4 candela.

I think you mistook German regulations for all of Europe. They do have strict regulations and you must use German certified lights. You can even buy cheap lights from China these days that meet the German regulations .

From Bicycle Germany website
Lighting: Non-blinking front headlamp to illuminate the road of white or pale yellow color. A red rear taillight that stays lit when stationary and may blink (intensity 1 cd). In the USA, blinking lights are sold but they are not legal in Germany. [This said, we see all sorts of violations of this rule. And we know of no one who has been stopped for a violation of it.]

The German standard is § 67 StVZO and if you buy a light that says it will meet this standard it is OK everywhere.

FBinNY 

+1

I make a decent effort to be seen from the back, because I'm 100% dependent on that. However I barely care about being seen drop the front. In most cases we're separated by the road width and passing safely like ships in the night,

The only times I worry about drivers seeing me from the front are those possibly making left turns, or entering from a side street. BUT I don't depend on being seen, I see them, assume they don't see me, or don't care, and prepare to make a crash avoidance maneuver if necessary.

Cyclist0108

We use Cygolight USB rechargeable head and tail lights. I ride under a redwood canopy for much of my commute, which is fairly dark even in the daylight, and these lights work really well.

Happy Feet

As a daily bike commuter it's pretty important for me to be seen by cars making left turns in front of me and by cars entering from a side road or driveway.
If they don't see me they could pull out and I would T bone them.

Leisesturm

If you did, that would be on you. Just saying...

VegasTriker

"Yes, 67stvzo standard should be law in the whole world!" Quoted from mtb addict
Hell no! Most of us like using flashing lights and that would be made illegal by adopting this standard worldwide plus it would stifle innovation in the design of new LED bike lights. It dictates things like beam pattern. It is very rigid. If you use the right mount you can even direct the beam from a CREE XML- T6 or brighter flashlight in a way it doesn't annoy other cyclists. If car drivers can withstand the light from an oncoming car's headlight, they can deal with the light from my double CREE XPE light.

mr_bill

Car headlights in the Sin City (and everywhere else in the US) are tightly regulated.

The automobile lights that the EVERYONE finds annoying on the road are unregulated "off road" and/or illegal HID reflector headlamp retrofits.

-mr. bill

Happy Feet

Really? How's that exactly

if you are riding on a road with a right of way and a car pulls out of a side street or driveway into your path they are at fault according to the motor vehicle code. Not that that matters if you are dead so I use a light.

The two worst spots for me on my daily commute are school driveways where parents pull out onto the street while I am passing by in a designated bike lane. On those stretches, rather than polish their hoods, I turn on my front strobe so they see me coming.

In a sense, riding defensively and minimizing known risks is "on me" and that's why I use a light.

jefnvk

Nope. It is their responsibility to come to a complete stop, judge traffic, and enter the roadway only when safe to do so.

Leisesturm

And so it is. However, the perfect man or woman does not (yet) exist. We all screw up eventually. One day you will fail to come to a complete stop, judge traffic, and enter the roadway only when safe to do so. And you will be glad that the driver who brings 4500lbs of Honda Accord to a screeching halt in time to keep from squashing you didn't stand on principle about it, but stood on the brake pedal instead. Pay it forward in the meantime.

jefnvk

I never once suggested if someone pulls out in front of you, that you shouldn't try to stop. Just that the fault is not on you if you are the one driving in a straight line down the road, rather on the person who failed to yield.

Leisesturm

fify

Leisesturm

I could have a whole lot of fun at your expense WRTA but I'll be kind.

rachel120

You'd have to put some serious money into a light to get it blinding. A car's low beams are 700 lumens. When I was looking for a new bike light on Amazon, it was very hard to find a light under $50 brighter than 700 lumens. The few I could find, the makers admitted in the descriptions they actually hadn't measured the strength and were estimating, and often the reviews indicated they were exaggerating.

I bought a 700 lumen light and that sucker is bright. (There is one spot on my route where I take a shortcut on a sidewalk. The sidewalk is about 200 feet long, a traffic sign at the other end is easily a good 30 feet past the sidewalk. On a cloudy day my flashing light clearly reflects on the sign when I just get on the far end of the sidewalk.) I doubt anyone would find a need to get a brighter light than 700 lumens.

Happy Feet

What the heck are you talking about?

We are talking about being seen more effectively by vehicles as you travel down the road. Daytime running lights are pretty well accepted as a visual aid and bicycles are not so special that the same principle doesn't apply to them. To my eye, as a daily commuter who both uses and observes them, they make a cyclist more noticeable, especially in strobe mode. To not "blind" drivers one simply has to point them down a bit. Not rocket surgery.

It would seem your philosophy is to just be prepared to stop. Wow.. thanks Captain Obvious! Hate to break it to you but, that a person should also be prepared to avoid a collision should it be imminent is not news... However, my philosophy is to try to stop the event from having the possibility of occurring in the first place by being proactive. One part of that is defensive riding and the other is being reasonably visible.

And Ps. Please don't fix my posts. If you want to make a weak obvious point do so in your own words. I have no problem with mine.

jefnvk

No clue what WRTA is, but have at it. I'm fairly thick skinned.

The simple fact is if you are driving or riding down the road, and someone pulls out in front of you in a manner that you T-bone them, the legal fault lies with them.

Michigan's incredibly clear and easy to read law on the matter, which I would be shocked if every other state didn't have an almost word-for-word copy of:

Of course, if you can safely avoid a collision, you should regardless of who is in the right, but legally you are not the one at fault.