Tony V

I remember,I forgot about that,---very good.

Chris516

I hope all those kids get caught and, have to serve time, for aggrivated assault.

TRaffic Jammer

Jesus, beating the snot out of the helpful smiling harmless guy of the hood?
Bad neighborhood or no I sense a rather large karmic boomerang coming back on these kids. I'm willing to bet some of these kids are going to get it from their grandmothers once they figure out who did this. Too big a group for all to stay silent for very long, someone's gonna feel guilty.

Pheard

Finally some sense amidst the madness.

jtwilson

Nice article. Ayoob is great. I'll be including this as part of the concealed carry course I am teaching tomorrow.

In regards to the cyclist. The later article linked says he suffered severe groin injuries and will require extensive reconstructive surgery to his face. A shooting is justified if one believes to be in immediate danger of death or serious bodily injury. Facing attack by one large unarmed man, or by a swarm of unarmed teenagers does constitute danger of death or serious bodily injury. The couple in the Ayoob article were in their own home, and therefore [in most states] had no duty to retreat, whereas the situation with the cyclist is more complicated, and comes down to the immediacy of the threat, and the opportunity to escape.

If you are on a bicycle and end up shooting in self defense, you will have to face some quite extraordinary circumstances to argue that you could not flee from the threat. Clearly, the cyclist in this story could not escape or he would have, as he had no means to defend himself anyways.

To the poster who mentioned magazine capacity - this is a good argument for the 9mm, which typically holds a 2-3 more rounds per magazine than a similar model .40cal and 5+ compared to a similar sized .45. With high quality +p hollowpoints, the difference in lethality is negligible. Shot placement is more important. Carrying a reload is always a good idea however. Some carry two spare mags. Personally, I carry without a reload, as I feel 18 rounds of 9mm is more than enough for peace of mind. The best statistics available show that over 95% of self defense incidents where the victim draws a gun are resolved without a single shot fired. When also including situations where shots are fired, 99% end with 3 or fewer shot being fired. Obviously, it is extraordinarily rare to be faced by such a large group of attackers. The best course of action, had the victim been armed and assuming his opportunity to escape had closed and jeopardy was immediate, would have involved no verbal warning. If you don't have time to pedal, you don't have time to 'talk things out' while thinking about drawing your weapon. It would be time to place one in the vitals of the first few attackers in order of proximity, then scanning for reactions by the others, including guns/knives being drawn. Those would be your next targets. I'm guessing, even with only one magazine, you would have sufficiently shocked the remaining attackers to escape.

All that said, even if some of the thugs were armed and shot/killed me in the process of self-defense, I'd rather have gone down shooting, than wind up with mush for genitals and a 'new' face for the rest of my life. For all the victim knew, he was dead anyways.

Truly sad.

TopShelf

There is no mention of race in this particular article. Why not?- it was a group of young black mens who pummeled a white cyclist. If a group of young white men beat the crap out of a black cyclist, it would be a hate crime, and we'd hear about it from Al Sharpton. Either way, no matter what color skin the attackers and victim have - this is ridiculous. Some of those thugs had to have the victim's blood on them, and some of their fingerprints and DNA had to get on the victim and the bike. Then need to be prosecuted for aggravated battery and attempted murder., and locked away for a long time.

jtwilson

I agree. However, IIRC, one of the articles states that the victim was mixed race - part Native American, part black, part caucasion. Which brings up the issue - how 'white' or 'black' or whatever do you have to be to be the victim of a hate crime? Are mixed race people not able to be 'hate-crimed' if they share part of the race of the attackers? Furthermore, does the fact that the attackers were all of one race and the victim another mean the attack was necessarily a hate crime, or do circumstances have to prove that race was indeed a motivating factor? In any case, this is a disgrace to the humanity of all. How senseless. Research shows how powerful the mob/crowd mentality can be in persuading otherwise rational people to engage in brutally reprehensible acts. I can only hope that the burden of guilt on part of those who took a turn or stood by approvingly will lead to some serious soul searching and a lifetime paradigm shift in compassion for others. Otherwise, I pray for karma.

beerfilter

Just thought I would chime in here on the dynamics of a group beating.

I was 17 at the time and I was cycling home from school up a steep hill (thus going rather slow). I noticed a large group of 30 - 40 teens (of another race from my own) who were listening to one guy who was a couple of years older, gesticulating and speechifying. I paid it no mind and continued on my way. after about 20 seconds someone came up behind me and hit me on the back of the head with a stout branch.

I remember thinking it was just a prank or one of the group trying to show off in front of the crowd, but when I looked back I saw the entire crowd following me, clapping and chanting, "Get him, Get the white boy!" About 10 or 12 of the group was actively approaching me and someone shoved a branch into my spokes forcing me to go over the handlebars.

From that point I was able to get up and run. I made about a half a block when I was tackled. I decided my best bet was to turtle up and protect my vulnerable underbelly and skull. Over the next few minutes I was kicked repeatedly in the head, hit in every exposed part of my body with lengths of knotty oak, and at one point they were taking turns holding my bike over my body and then slammming down as hard as they could on me.

When I could peek out from my fetal, protective position, the main attackers, 10 - 12 or so, were indeed lined up in an orderly queue to get their turns while the other 20+ members of the group were circled around to view my beating and chher on the attackers. Then one of them, a smaller, younger one, maybe not even a teenager shouted, "Stab the whiteboy!" and the whole crowd started shouted with a high pitched whooping sound like when your favorite rockstar walks out on to the stage.

Then I noticed a sudden silence followed by feet running away. When I peeked out, I saw a car had pulled up and an old lady was shouting at my attackers and was helping me up. She took me home where I was able to assess the damage. I was blood covered and bruised but ultimately not to badly. No visit to the hospital was needed.

I went to the school to report the attack because it happened a block away and although I didn't recognize my attackers they may have been students. The Principal said there ws nothing to do about it. I said, "Maybe I should call the police." He replied, "That's not a good idea. You would just be making things worse."

So that was the end of it.

Until the next day when a smaller group of about 4 or 5 guys (not sure if they were part of the previous day's attack) tried to start something with me on the sidewalk right in front of the school.

I went inside and told the principal that I was definitely calling the cops and he got all defensive and said if I didn't call the cops he would have one of the secretaries give me a ride home every day for the rest of the semester. I should have called the cops but I accepted his offer.

Nothing was ever reported, and nothing made the papers. I was one of the only white kids in my school and the handful of others always had rides or their own cars so nothing else really happened. I graduated and got the hell out off there :-)

Oh, and I never found my bike.

beerfilter

David13

Dude. I have just heard exactly the same story coming from ... yes, dahn unda.
dc

banjo_mole 

Beerfilter, your pricipal sounds like a cowardly moronic idiot who is too self-serving to care about real justice. What a jerk.

geo8rge

" your pricipal sounds like a cowardly moronic idiot" - Sounds like a bureaucrat to me.

Blue Order

There's the problem right there.