unterhausen

I'm posting this so I can get rid of the thread about the cyclist taking videos of unsafe passing. The assertion has been made that mirrors are essential safety tools that will make unsafe passing a thing of the past.

I don't ride with a mirror. I find that sound is a very effective tool in knowing if I should attempt a left turn. I think a mirror would be convenient, but I haven't found one that works for me yet. I wonder how much good they would be for determining if there was a problem with an overtaking car. Motorists tend to switch lanes at the last second. If I drove my car into the ditch every time an overtaking motorist looked like he was going to hit me on the interstate, I would probably be dead.

njkayaker

That assertion is false. A mirror might be useful in responding to an unsafe pass. If there were no unsafe passes, then a mirror would be unnecessary (for unsafe passes). While I don't use one, I know people who do seem to use them effectively for some purposes (not necessarily to give way to unsafe passes).

chipcom 

A mirror is a tool to help enhance situational awareness...it has no automagical power to prevent unsafe passes or anything else.

Doohickie

Essential? No. Do whatever works for you.

I personally decided to go with a mirror when I had a close call with a city bus that came up from behind me unheard because the engine is in the back. Hybrids can be similarly silent. Also, it can be difficult to know whether a car is in the lane with you or the next lane over without looking over your shoulder or using a mirror.

Some people have no problem looking over a shoulder. I can't seem to manage it and keep a straight line. So I use a mirror. That's what works for me.

genec

Mirrors are a very effective tool... which is why motorists have 3, motorcyclists have 2 and big rig drivers have a whole bunch. If you chose to ride on the same road as the folks I just mentioned, perhaps you should consider that a single mirror just help "equalize" you a bit.

Now regarding hearing cars... yes indeed that does work... as long as the cars approaching you are the most significant sound... if on the other hand you are on a multilaned road as some of us often ride, you may find you cannot distinguish between cars in the near lane or the far lane by sound alone. In this case a mirror helps.

Is a mirror the ultimate tool "that will make unsafe passing a thing of the past," no. Mirrors just give you a bit more data on what is going on around you... and being fully aware of what is happening (being situationally aware) is the best thing you can do when riding bikes in traffic.

I have a mirror on my commuter... but not on my fun road bike... and I miss the darn thing all the time. I do not stare back looking to jump into the weeds, but I check the mirror whenever I consider making any lateral moves... and just to be aware.

But bottom line... it's your choice.

unterhausen

Usually, when buses catch me I have no place to go because of the curb. How would a mirror help in that situation?

try not to be so reasonable. I have a mirror which didn't work on my glasses. I've started riding with different glasses and I may try the mirror now. As you say, there are sometimes I can't hear and wish I had a mirror. Left turns are the main reason I want one. The other reason is that in the winter I often wish to ride on the roadway, but move over onto the shoulder as a courtesy to motorists. If there is oncoming traffic, I stay on the shoulder even though there may be nobody overtaking me.

Maybe I should prune the mirror posts out of the other thread. There were some absolutist assertions made in that thread.

jbrow1

I love my mirror. Cut it apart, glued some clothes hangar wire in to extend it, and it works great now. I took it off for a paceline ride once last summer, and told myself I would never ride without it again. I just like knowing whats back there. Many many times I don't hear cars, be it b/c they are quiet or the wind across the farm fields I ride next to. I have gotten so used to having it I feel wrong if I ride without it on the road. Just my feelings, to each their own

Seattle Forrest

And you've survived long enough to type out this post, proving that mirrors are not essential.

[/thread]

crhilton

I drug that thread down because I thought Bek was asserting that mirrors were a way to avoid rear enders. It seems like no one really believes that, so I take back all the nasty things I said about mirrors and their advocates.

I've never found one that actually works on the bikes I ride. I recently got ride of my bar end shifters on my commuter, so I might try a drop bar mirror on there. It's the only bike I tend to use when dealing with much traffic. I really see little advantage to the mirror out on the paved highways. There's not a lot of traffic, and turning isn't something I'm doing much of there, so it'd just serve as a way to watch people move out at the last second.

Looigi

Duh. Like others have said: Do you use mirrors when driving? How about riding motorcycles? Any reason they'd be less useful on a bike? I often find my self needing/wanting to take the main traffic lane to turn left, avoid getting doored, avoid rough pavement, debris, or other hazards on the right. Having a mirror makes it much easier and safer to judge when I can move over without getting run over.

I use mirrors that clip on to my glasses. For a while, my wife used a mirror that mounted to her helmet but now uses clip-ons. A guy I ride with has one that mounts on the end of his drop bars. There are many options. I find the ones that clip to my glasses to give me the steadiest and best view. I'm getting a new pair of glasses right now and one of the frame selection criteria was that it would be suitable to clip a mirror to.

I use hearing too, but when I'm going fast, the wind noise in my ears drowns out my ability to hear vehicles behind me.

chipcom 

But, just as in a car or on a motorcycle, you do a head check before actually making a move, right? If not, start...it's a tool, not a crutch. Trust, but verify.

10 Wheels

I use my mirror to see way behind me. To check if vehicles are responding to my Dinnotte taillight and changing lanes to the left.

chipcom 

OK 10 Wheels, that last image was uncalled for. Keep posting disturbing stuff like that and I'll start posting my glamor shots.

njkayaker

??

In that situation, I'd guess that having really good beer in your saddle bag wouldn't help you either. That doesn't mean the beer is without value.

10 Wheels

chipcom 

MY EYES!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Remember, you were the cause of this, bucko....

LesterOfPuppets

Definitely not essential for all except many recumbents and folks with neck problems. It's really hard to look over the shoulder on laid back designs. I think the mirror's only good use is checking prior to lane change. Taking note of what overtaking cars are doing won't be of much use in the real world. I'm sure once in a great while you might jump on the sidewalk to avoid a crazy, but...

crhilton

1.) You're not keeping up with traffic, so you're not using them to track who is around you; that's constantly changing.
2.) It's very easy to look behind you on a bicycle (well, it is for me). In a car this isn't so, and I suspect it's more difficult on a motorcycle.
3.) I do a lot less lane changing on a bike.

I suppose some might find #1 to be true because they keep up with traffic pretty well. Others don't have roads that make that possible... Same for #3.

LesterOfPuppets

Not less useful on a bicycle, but less necessary. It's far easier to get a good look back on most bicycles than it is in most cars. Full face motorcycle helmets present a similar problem. You just can't get a good look back while wearing one.

chipcom 

If you ride with your wheel-sucking wife, a glasses/helmet-mounted mirror is essential to keep track of her.

LesterOfPuppets

Another mirror-as-necessity case is on crowded MUPs. One has to make so many passes that require a glance back you might as well get a mirror.

AlmostTrick

Well I guess if you're riding near the curb then yeah, you gots nowhere to go.

I prefer to ride near the center of the lane as default. Then, if a faster vehicle wishes to over take me, (and there is enough room to allow it) I can move right as a courtesy to the driver. My mirror makes this easy to do without even looking back.

LesterOfPuppets

A little motorcycle tidbit: a majority of motorcycle racers do so without a mirror.

CB HI

Many of us did just fine without a mirror for many years. But with the increasing number of distracted drivers, I consider my mirrors a necessity that saves trips to the hospital or morgue.

I have used a mirror for the last 20 years, and in the more recent 14 years, my mirrors have saved me from being hit from behind 5 times and have helped me catch a Hit&Run JAM.

First incident - 5 pm, clear dry afternoon, occurred on a 6 narrow lane highway (originally designed for 4 lanes) bounded by a curb and shrubs, with heavy traffic. While riding 4 feet from the curb in a VC manner, a routine check of the mirror shows a small foreign brown pick-up truck in the center of the lane behind me not slowing and not moving left. I hold my position in the lane to let him know the lane is too narrow to share. Check of the road ahead shows it is clear for the next 70 yards, since the guy that last passed me has not moved back into the right lane. Second check of the mirror shows the pick-up behind is close and will not slow or move left; I swerve to the right with 6 inches between my wheel & curb and my handlebar touching the shrubs just as the pick-up passes. The body of the pick-up is 2 inches from the left side of my handlebar and the right side mirror of the pick-up hits my left arm. Thank goodness that the truck mirror was of the collapsible design and only caused a bruise on my arm and loud noise when it collapsed on the truck. Of course the driver just kept going. He never even turned his head to look at me. I almost caught him at the next light. He was elderly and probably poor of sight. I do not think he even saw me. Without the mirror and routine checks, this guy would have just plowed over me at 30 mph. I did get his license # and immediately reported the hit-and-run to the police. The police took my report and then did nothing since a simple bruise is not serious. Two weeks later, the same pick-up hit a car and ran. This time the police caught the driver in less than an hour.

Second incident - 8 am, clear dry morning, occurred on a 6 lane highway bounded by a curb underneath an elevated freeway, no shoulder but did have bus turnouts. While riding 4 feet from the curb/right lane line in a VC manner, a routine check of the mirror shows a Jeep just about on me and I cannot see the right headlight of the Jeep in the mirror. I also cannot not see the drivers face as he is bent over. I know I am in trouble and make an emergency swerve to the right (moving at least 5 feet) as fast as I can into a bus turnout (lucky it was there). The Jeep passes about 1 foot from the left end of my handlebar. As he passes, I see he is bent over, picking up a CD player off the passenger floor board. He never saw me until I caught him at the light and started yelling at him. I can yell extremely loud. He made all the excuses, “I could not see you, it is dark under here”. I pointed to a couple of guys 100 yards away and asked if he could see them. He just kept arguing until I yelled that I saw him bent over picking up the CD player. The light turned green and he promptly speed off. I would have called the police, but I did not even have a bruise this time.

Third incident - 4 am, clear dry night, well lighted street, I had 2 white lights in front, 2 yellow and a blue light on my backside, reflective material all over and the legal required red reflector (standard moving Christmas tree). Same as the second incident except that the vehicle was an SUV with tinted windows and I could not catch up to the SUV. Because of the tinted windows, I could not tell why the driver did not properly pass.

Fourth incident - 8 am, clear dry morning, occurred on a 6 lane highway bounded by a curb, no shoulder but did have bus turnouts and a merge lane. While riding center of the merge lane waiting to move into the right through lane, I see a woman reading a pamphlet and she is drifting into the merge lane. I safely bailed. She swerves back into the through lane best barely missing jumping the curb and slamming into a concrete pile. I caught her at the traffic light and lectured her. She rolled up her window. As soon the light turned green, she speed off and went back to reading her pamphlet. It was a religious pamphlet, so I guess she thought God would keep her safe.

Fifth incident - 1730 lady on phone trying change lanes without looking and almost sideswiped car, so swerved back at me.

The Hit&Run JAM had harassed me and almost had a head on collision trying to pass me, so I used the mirror to read his license plate #. He began his second attempted pass, again almost had a head on, but this time he continued his pass and hit me with his side view mirror. Me already knowing his plate # got him caught.

randya