Utter tool kills cyclist in Richmond Virginia
#26
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Alpharetta, GA
Posts: 15,280
Bikes: Nashbar Road
Mentioned: 71 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2934 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times
in
228 Posts
Let's not forget that investigators collected some samples from the steering wheel. In the scenario where the driver stopped, wiped incriminating evidence off his bumper, got back in and drove on, traces of the cyclist could be there. That would lend weight to his knowing that he did hit something, and would be more consistent with something to hide than with hitting a deer or dog. Depending on what he removed - what they found on the steering wheel - he'd know it wasn't an animal.
#27
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Naptown
Posts: 1,133
Bikes: NWT 24sp DD; Brompton M6R
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
1 Post
(Alternatively, it's the truth, but only in part of the truth - they may not have known that they hit anything because they were drunk out of their mind.)
I am trying to figure out how these folks don't know they hit something... what is it about them as drivers or the vehicles they drive that gives them the impression that everything is OK?
I mean if something happens to your vehicle that leaves "samples on the steering wheel" isn't pretty obvious that this is not a normal thing?
I mean if something happens to your vehicle that leaves "samples on the steering wheel" isn't pretty obvious that this is not a normal thing?
My uncle has a neighbor the lives across the alley from him that has in the neighborhood of 15 DUIs including a manslaughter on record as a result of one of them.............and still has a license. We're supposed to have a 3 strikes and your out policy here but it seems like there are holes in it.
#28
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 3,040
Bikes: Bacchetta Giro, Strada
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
That said, if evidence was found on the steering wheel that indicates that the person stopped and cleaned up the car and continued, that should blow that claim out of the water. Assuming that the evidence can show that it happened immediately, and that it couldn't have happened the next day.
#29
Vello Kombi, baby
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Je suis ici
Posts: 5,188
Bikes: 1973 Eisentraut; 1970s Richard Sachs; 1978 Alfio Bonnano; 1967 Peugeot PX10
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 80 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 14 Times
in
13 Posts
... but even so, juries do buy it quite often. "Beyond a reasonable doubt" means different things to different people, and in many cases it means they have to be pretty damned sure. And really, hitting a big pothole could feel like hitting a body to an idiot, especially a drunk idiot.
That said, if evidence was found on the steering wheel that indicates that the person stopped and cleaned up the car and continued, that should blow that claim out of the water. Assuming that the evidence can show that it happened immediately, and that it couldn't have happened the next day.
That said, if evidence was found on the steering wheel that indicates that the person stopped and cleaned up the car and continued, that should blow that claim out of the water. Assuming that the evidence can show that it happened immediately, and that it couldn't have happened the next day.
__________________
"It's always darkest right before it goes completely black"
Waste your money! Buy my comic book!
"It's always darkest right before it goes completely black"
Waste your money! Buy my comic book!
#31
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,278
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4260 Post(s)
Liked 1,366 Times
in
947 Posts
There is no implication that the "samples" were a result of the accident. The may have been present before the accident occurred
#32
genec
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times
in
3,158 Posts
#33
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Pasadena, CA(for now)
Posts: 1,101
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
All the hallmarks. Hit and run. Driver has had 19 moving violations in last ten years. "Didn't know he hit anything." This one is bad, close your eyes:
https://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/n...al-ar-2105066/
Memorial ride in RVA, Sunday, 9pm.
https://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/n...al-ar-2105066/
Memorial ride in RVA, Sunday, 9pm.
#34
Señior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 13,749
Bikes: Windsor Fens, Giant Seek 0 (2014, Alfine 8 + discs)
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
7 Posts
I don't understand how having a record like this can be considered in any way normal. I accept that people DO get records like this, but it's just outside my experience. Nobody in my family has more than maybe 2 or 3 lifetime citations, many have none. I don't understand a culture that considers getting traffic citations on any kind of a regular basis is normal. I guess it is though since I often see people considering the cost of a traffic ticket to be part of the cost of driving. Just seems bizarre to me though.
__________________
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
#35
Banned
It depends on how a person was raised, and with dad and his lawyer continually pulling junior out of the fire, junior sees life differently than the many others who are not able to do or afford the same treatment. Just remember, the high number of convictions are only the tip of the iceberg that junior were caught violating, and with many of the charges being reduced considerably, it only emboldened junior's driving habits even more.
#36
Randomhead
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Posts: 24,403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked 3,702 Times
in
2,522 Posts
I'm probably jinxing myself, but I haven't gotten a traffic citation since 1985. If you are getting 2 a year, that means you are an utter tool and driving with recklessness on a fairly consistent basis
#37
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 13,447
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4237 Post(s)
Liked 2,949 Times
in
1,808 Posts
Not only the cost of a ticket, but the added cost to your insurance. That seems pretty outrageous to me, but maybe for people who do long commutes on the highway they consider that the normal cost of driving. Weird to me though.
__________________
Bikes: 1996 Eddy Merckx Titanium EX, 1989/90 Colnago Super(issimo?) Piu(?),1990 Concorde Aquila(hit by car while riding), others in build queue "when I get the time"
Bikes: 1996 Eddy Merckx Titanium EX, 1989/90 Colnago Super(issimo?) Piu(?),
#38
Banned
Star Wars and Billy Beer were brand new when I received my one and only speeding ticket, and the way my family chides me about my slow driving, I won't be jinxing myself.
#39
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 3,040
Bikes: Bacchetta Giro, Strada
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Remember Carlos Bertonatti? He had gotten 40 violations in 12 years. (He still hasn't had his trial, by the way.)
#40
Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 134
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
It's interesting that the perp works for the Richmond Times-Dispatch and the victim's mother works for a competing newspaper. One thing's for sure, this will get a lot of coverage in both newspapers. I hope that when the perp is found guilty, he loses his job.
#41
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 2,401
Bikes: 2012 Surly LHT, 1995 GT Outpost Trail
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
While that sounds like a lot, it's only two a year. While certainly on the high side, it wouldn't surprise me if over 10% of the drivers out there had similar records.
Given that he can probably take defensive driving once a year and get rid of one of those offences, this probably isn't even enough to trigger additional fines or loss of drivers licenses (I don't know Virginia laws regarding this, however -- this is just a guess.)
Hopefully they'll nail him for the hit and run now, however.
Given that he can probably take defensive driving once a year and get rid of one of those offences, this probably isn't even enough to trigger additional fines or loss of drivers licenses (I don't know Virginia laws regarding this, however -- this is just a guess.)
Hopefully they'll nail him for the hit and run now, however.
It is inexcusable to get 19 violations in 10 years. It's not hard to drive by the rules.
#42
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 13,447
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4237 Post(s)
Liked 2,949 Times
in
1,808 Posts
"Only" two a year? I've been driving for 16 years and I have one moving violation, which probably won't even show up on my record because it was bogus. Was doing 45 in a 45 and a cop pulled me over saying I was doing 65. Wrote me a ticket telling me to go to court on a night that court wasn't in session. Called the police department the next day and they said they have no record of that ticket ever being issued, and I obtained documented proof of that fact.
It is inexcusable to get 19 violations in 10 years. It's not hard to drive by the rules.
It is inexcusable to get 19 violations in 10 years. It's not hard to drive by the rules.
Was that one of those fake cops? I've heard of cop imposters pulling people over and giving them tickets and, when they find a woman who they want, extorting them for "favors" in lieu of writing the ticket.
__________________
Bikes: 1996 Eddy Merckx Titanium EX, 1989/90 Colnago Super(issimo?) Piu(?),1990 Concorde Aquila(hit by car while riding), others in build queue "when I get the time"
Bikes: 1996 Eddy Merckx Titanium EX, 1989/90 Colnago Super(issimo?) Piu(?),
#43
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 230
Bikes: Giant Defy Advanced 3, Trek 520
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
"Eli Webb told police he was driving the SUV that struck Lanie Kruszewski."
Why am I not surprised...?
Why am I not surprised...?
#44
MUP World Champ
Why am I not surprised?
Last edited by adamhenry; 08-07-12 at 12:36 PM.
#45
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Pasadena, CA(for now)
Posts: 1,101
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Let's not forget that investigators collected some samples from the steering wheel. In the scenario where the driver stopped, wiped incriminating evidence off his bumper, got back in and drove on, traces of the cyclist could be there. That would lend weight to his knowing that he did hit something, and would be more consistent with something to hide than with hitting a deer or dog. Depending on what he removed - what they found on the steering wheel - he'd know it wasn't an animal.
#46
Vello Kombi, baby
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Je suis ici
Posts: 5,188
Bikes: 1973 Eisentraut; 1970s Richard Sachs; 1978 Alfio Bonnano; 1967 Peugeot PX10
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 80 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 14 Times
in
13 Posts
Okay, update. Webb has been indicted on felony hit and run charges by a grand jury. The charges carry a sentence of one to ten years. Other charges may be forthcoming; the police investigation continues. Lemond, the police really do appear to be making a real effort on this one. I would reserve judgement on them here (I don't care to reserve judgement on Webb; the title of this thread stands. Maybe he's a nice guy, but he's a tool behind the wheel, and he likes to dodge responsibility).
I went on the memorial ride on Sunday, in a group of about 150 riders. The police intentionally left the ride undisturbed. The group I was with rode with Lanie's boyfriend. It was one of the saddest things I have ever seen; we stopped at her school, where there is a memorial wall, and the site of the accident. Everyone stood in silence as the boyfriend sat at both locations and remembered her. I'm choking up right now. It was an amazing crowd of riders, all ages, sexes, and races. It was beautiful and it was sad. I really do not know how to describe it. It gave me hope and it made me cry. All at once.
Fifteen years ago, I had a friend killed by a right hooking driver. There was no ride like this, no indictment. I have hope for the human race yet.
I went on the memorial ride on Sunday, in a group of about 150 riders. The police intentionally left the ride undisturbed. The group I was with rode with Lanie's boyfriend. It was one of the saddest things I have ever seen; we stopped at her school, where there is a memorial wall, and the site of the accident. Everyone stood in silence as the boyfriend sat at both locations and remembered her. I'm choking up right now. It was an amazing crowd of riders, all ages, sexes, and races. It was beautiful and it was sad. I really do not know how to describe it. It gave me hope and it made me cry. All at once.
Fifteen years ago, I had a friend killed by a right hooking driver. There was no ride like this, no indictment. I have hope for the human race yet.
__________________
"It's always darkest right before it goes completely black"
Waste your money! Buy my comic book!
"It's always darkest right before it goes completely black"
Waste your money! Buy my comic book!
Last edited by Poguemahone; 08-07-12 at 03:29 PM.
#47
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Pasadena, CA(for now)
Posts: 1,101
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Lemond, the police really do appear to be making a real effort on this one. I would reserve judgement on them here (I don't care to reserve judgement on Webb; the title of this thread stands. Maybe he's a nice guy, but he's a tool behind the wheel, and he likes to dodge responsibility).
.
.
#48
Vello Kombi, baby
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Je suis ici
Posts: 5,188
Bikes: 1973 Eisentraut; 1970s Richard Sachs; 1978 Alfio Bonnano; 1967 Peugeot PX10
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 80 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 14 Times
in
13 Posts
Webb is now out on 200,000$ bail. He had to surrender his passport and driver's permit.
https://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/n...bo-ar-2116849/
Chilling fact: Looks like the cyclist hit his windshield. This makes the deer defence pretty flimsy. Not that it ever wasn't.
https://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/n...bo-ar-2116849/
Chilling fact: Looks like the cyclist hit his windshield. This makes the deer defence pretty flimsy. Not that it ever wasn't.
__________________
"It's always darkest right before it goes completely black"
Waste your money! Buy my comic book!
"It's always darkest right before it goes completely black"
Waste your money! Buy my comic book!
Last edited by Poguemahone; 08-08-12 at 08:58 AM.
#49
ouate de phoque
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: La Prairie, Qc, Canada
Posts: 1,781
Bikes: Bianchi, Nakamura,Opus
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
In Quebec, by the law, it is a worst crime to hit and run than to be DUI, to discourage people to run away like that. They changed the law few years ago after there's been a lot of cases in the same summer. It's a bit better since but it still happen from time to time.
#50
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,278
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4260 Post(s)
Liked 1,366 Times
in
947 Posts
There is no implication that the "samples" were a result of the accident. The may have been present before the accident occurred
It's much more likely/reasonable that the "dabbing" was because of some suspicion of an illegal substance. But who knows.
Last edited by njkayaker; 08-10-12 at 05:06 PM.