Rootman

Its a recent addition after the other main arteries have become clogged it was widened from an old 2 lane farm road to this. It used to be the "shortcut" to avoid traffic to get to the interstate. Literally BILLIONS have been poured into this area in roads, new buildings, stores, malls, etc, even a regional airport in the last 18 years. The airport was deemed a "boondoggle" when started because Bill Clinton pushed it though, but it's already been expanded a few times and still is suffereing growing pains. This whole area is still growing despite national trends.

To be honest the road is only 6 and 7 lanes for a very short distance, it's 5 for quite a few miles at 50 MPH and knocks down to 4 lanes and 45 till it reaches another main N/S road. It's still unnerving riding or walking on the wide sidewalk, especially when semi trucks blow past you at full speed. I stay off it, even during slow periods like early weekend mornings.

spare_wheel

So you admit to driving 15 mph over the posted speed limit of 30 mph? If I knew who you were I would write you a citizen's ticket, JYL.

https://goo.gl/maps/VQY4B

I take the full lane on Cesar Chavez many times each week. It's incredibly rare to be passed by someone in excess of 40 and the vast majority are driving around 30 mph. Chavez is a perfectly useable bike route and I personally have never had a problem with a motorist on Chavez. One of the reasons many cyclists take Chavez is because the bike boulevard which crosses 205 is circuitous, hilly, and requires lugging a bike up/down stairs.

I-Like-To-Bike

Does that mean a bicyclist should do all that because some guy in a following car got uncomfortable, wouldn't pass and posts all about it on BF?

How about if your coworkers, neighbors and/or family are "uncomfortable" with your bicycling in traffic? Does that mean you need to adapt to their expectations of safe bicycling?

I-Like-To-Bike

You are not the first Portand poster who threatened to write a citizen's ticket. The other poster was real vague about the status of that program. How many have you written so far? In fact, how many have been written and issued in PDX or Oregon in the last 5 years?

jyl

I knew this thread would draw all the bravehearts who think no street is too hairy to ride.

You guys, who claim to ride 39th (Cesar Chavez) regularly, are the rare exception. Stand by the street for half an hour sometime, and count the cyclists that ride by on 39th - not crossing the street, not on the sidewalk. You might not even need all the fingers of one hand.

Regardless of posted speed limit, the 85th percentile speed on 39th (Cesar Chavez) is 37-38 mph. At night, people drive even faster. It is very common to see cars at 45 mph. That area is practically my backyard - I live a few blocks from there.

Back to the cyclist I saw. Would you recommend that she keep riding 39th at night at her pokey 10 mph, as long as she takes the whole lane? Is that what you consider the safe and sensible thing for her to do?

wphamilton

I'd be uncomfortable if someone did that behind me. After he gets out of the way, all of those stacked up cars are going to go around me anyway, and I would imagine some of them even more impatient for the delay. I'd rather the traffic flow naturally without the blocking escort.

ModeratedUser150120149

Does the vehicle code in the OP's state permit four way flashers to operate when the vehicle is moving under its' own power?

I think anyone male or female would be nervous to have a strange vehicle shadowing them.

DNP

Please turn down your hyperbole. I made many qualifiers to my statements regarding this road and the streets of Portland in general. You're initial description of this encounter is full of irrelevant, persuasive speech and even now you're backing off your speed claims. I don't put much faith in your ability to describe a situation you disagree with objectively. 8 pm on a Monday night...I know what that street looks like and so do other locals on this board. No one claimed this street is a bicycling magnet in Portland, but that some choose to ride it for many reasons. I understand that the fear of being crushed by a car drives the majority of people to choose inconvenient and more difficult routes when they bike. I wish more people would venture off the bike-boulevards, at the very least during non-peak hours, to enjoy the convenience and smoother pavement of main roads. I am happy when I see a non lycra-clad roadie riding a road with typically low cycling numbers. Sorry to hear you were appalled. Try an alternate route.

Sincerely,

A sometimes-lycra-clad roadie

turbo1889

Don't know about the OP's state but it's legal in my state when there is a clear hazard and/or your driving considerably slower then other vehicles. One of the two guys in question yelled thank you at me after he pulled off into a side road after I'd been "covering his butt" for about four miles. It was a pea soup fog that night around the narrow two lane on the edge of the lake and you could barely see car tail lights more then five or six car lengths in front of you much less his one little bike blinky red tail light he had on his road bike. He was trying to edge ride on the non-existent edge when I came upon him while I was going home late that night and I was driving slower then other people because of the fog and I barely saw him in time so instead of swooping past him like the others I slowed down to his speed and stayed behind him about three car lengths and put my hazard blinkers on. He was slightly nervous for the first 20-30 seconds and looking back at me several times and then he seemed to figure out what I was doing and took the lane in front of me riding in the right tire track and we went along like that for about four miles with other vehicles that in my opinion were driving way too fast for the fog passing both of us together and then as I said when he turned off into a side road that leads to a subdivision section he gave me a thumbs up and yelled thank you to me as I continued on my way along the main road.

The other one wasn't as dangerous of a situation or as long of a distance and he didn't seem to care one way or the other if he even noticed me behind him since he never looked back.

spare_wheel

The same is true for the crap bike boulevard that meanders around 41st. Portland has largely failed to provide efficient N-S routes for cyclists...so I and many others ride arterials. While 33rd and 53d are more common routes, it's incorrect to state that no one cycles on Chavez. For example, I typically see other cyclists when I ride from Sandy to Hawthorne (my typical route).

I also live in the neighborhood, jyl, and I challenge your quoted 85th percentile speeds. The speed limit on Chavez was reduced to 30 mph and there is typicall congestion at the roundabout and the Burnside, Belmont, and Hawthorne intersections.

jyl

Yes, traffic slows at some intersections, and then too many drivers hit the gas and go way too fast until the next choke point.

I am aware the speed limit was changed to 30 mph - for the area of 39th I was on, back in the 90s, and for an area further south, several years ago. Unfortunately, most studies I've read indicate that changing the posted speed limit doesn't affect driver behaviour - you need physical traffic calming measures, or serious enforcement, to do that. As a result, speeding is rampant on that street.

So, anyone want to answer my question? If you were friends with the cyclist I saw, would you recommend that she keep riding 39th at night at her pokey 10 mph, as long as she takes the whole lane? Would that be your best advice to her?

MMACH 5

You keep mentioning her speed. If your description of traffic being well above the speed limit is correct, do you really think that if she pushes it to 15 or 18mph, the motorists will treat her differently?

Chris516

Lets' take just 'adapting to safe cycling', and put it in its' own context. Now is what I recommended tantamount to 'shriveling up like body parts that have been in the water a long time', no. At the same time, they further safe cycling, while not implying the cyclist should, ride in the gutter or get off the road.

Now lets' take the opinions of family, friends, co-workers(and motorists') making judgments' as to what they see as safe cycling. I used to get that all the time from my parents'. They finally backed off when, they started trusting me, that I knew what I was doing.

spare_wheel

Sure. I've ridden this road literally hundreds of times and have never had an issue. Our cagers are potty trained very well.

10 Wheels

Agree. ^ ^ ^

OP made the situation Worse by following the rider.

B. Carfree

If you really want to know, I suggest you contact someone who is likely to have the information, like this guy: https://www.stc-law.com/rthomas.html

You can browse his firm's web site and download their manual for cyclists. Older versions had the procedure for writing a citizen citation and the current version likely does as well.

jyl

Well, no-one buzzed her during the half mile I was behind her, versus multiple cars buzzing her both before and after I was behind her, so I doubt I actually made her situation "worse".

Anyway, it would have been hard to pass her without buzzing (passing very close). Once I got slowed down to 10 mph, then was a stream of cars whistling by me on the left; I would have had to get a gap behind her, then accelerate pretty briskly to merge.

Next time, I guess I'll blow by her like everyone else was doing, without letting myself get slowed down. I think this time, I was so taken aback that I kind of slowed down in amazement.

I wonder if I did make her uncomfortable? I'm not sure she even knew what was behind her. She never looked back, and had no mirror. I think - not positive - that she was simply poking along, oblivious and/or counting on all the cagers being as well-trained as spare_wheel thinks they are.

Indeed, Portland drivers are well behaved for - the most part. But not nearly all are. We have a steady enough stream of bicyclists being hit, as proof of that.

I-Like-To-Bike

I am interested in the success of posters who yap about issuing citizen's traffic tickets without any record or evidence that any citizen has actually been successful with this scheme. I am not really interested in citizen's issued tickets that require the services of a lawyer to make it happen.

spare_wheel

The majority of deaths are due to drunk driving or right hooks, not aggression or malice.

spare_wheel

For obvious reasons, a citizen writing a traffic citation (Z-cite) is not a major news story. Nevertheless, multiple cases have been documented in the local media. Use google.

Sixty Fiver

I have ridden and driven on Chavez countless times and think it is one of those roads that is ill suited for most cyclists.

I will ride pretty much anywhere and have a good level of confidence and skill and see this as a higher risk roadway to be riding on... riding at 10 mph is not as problematic if your personal visibility is high and although Portland drivers tend to be be pretty good with cyclists there are always homicidal tourists from other states like Washington you need to watch out for.

mrodgers

So, aggression or malice is poor behavior and driving drunk or not paying attention when you are driving are acts of good behavior? I'll have to remember that in a few years when I'm teaching my daughter how to drive.

spare_wheel

I've personally seen multiple daughters lying in intersections bleeding because they blindly trusted their right of way in a bike facility. I also see daughters "hugging curbs" and weaving in and out of parking gaps every commute. So, I really do hope you teach your daughter some "effective cycling" skills.