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Acceptable Dishing

Old 05-15-15, 12:57 PM
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70sSanO
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Acceptable Dishing

Just received some used wheels that I am going use on my '88 Cannondale Criterium. Typical situation of an older aluminum frame with 126mm drop outs (measured) and 130mm OLD (130.4 measured). I am able to fit a 130mm wheel into the dropouts, but I have a wheel dishing question.

The replacement wheels are DA 7700 Hubs and 32 hole HPlus TB14 rims. Put them on my stand and and they look good, but the rear is dished about 1.5mm off-center to the drive side (checked with a dishing tool). I haven't checked the tension with a gauge yet but the non-drive side spokes don't "feel" loose.

My question is:

Based on the spoke count and a fairly wide stout rim, is 1.5mm of additional offset acceptable from a safety/durability perspective? I weigh 175lbs and I don't race.

I have read miamijim's thread: 10-speeds on a 126mm hub success.

I'm not sure if the 7700 hubs will work as well as the 7403 hubs in the thread, but being able to pick up a little in the 1.5mm dishing offsets does benefit the fitting. I am going to run an 8 speed cassette.

I've read that 1mm off-center is acceptable, but that is usually non-drive side, and for me it is not a centering issue as I'll just reduce the left side spacer width to center it.

FWIW... My current 126mm wheels are 36h MA-40's on Superbe Pro w/freewheel.

Thanks for any info.

John
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Old 05-15-15, 01:09 PM
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Al1943
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I would center the rim. Tightening the non-drive side may extend the life of the spokes, and it surely won't hurt anything.
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Old 05-15-15, 01:33 PM
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One way or another the wheel will end up centered. It is just a matter of how to get there... re-dishing or reducing the OLD.

John
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Old 05-15-15, 01:52 PM
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Bill Kapaun
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If it's a matter of tightening NDS spokes, embrace it!
It's not going to take very much and will better balance the tensions between DS & NDS.

IF it were the opposite direction, I'd be more inclined to leave it. It's a much bigger pain to go that direction.
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Old 05-15-15, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
One way or another the wheel will end up centered. It is just a matter of how to get there... re-dishing or reducing the OLD.
The OP wants to run an 8-speed cassette, the OLD must remain at 130 mm to make that happen.

Last edited by Al1943; 05-18-15 at 04:02 PM.
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Old 05-18-15, 09:42 AM
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Actually I would "like" to have an OLD closer to 126mm. I can get a 130mm into the 126mm dropouts, but it would be better to get it a little closer.

I think I have my answer...

miamijim's thread does help, but so does the recent 11 speeds on 5700 hub thread. In that thread, the right way is to re-dish, then I'll bring it closer to 1mm or less off-center, from 1.5mm, so the NDS tension will be a little better. I "may" be able to swap out the 1.0mm DS washer for a .5mm and/or the 7700 4.68mm DS lock nut for a thinner Deore lock nut. I just need to see how much clearance I will get between the lockring/chain to the dropout.

If, and that is still if, everything on the DS fits, I'll take a corresponding amount off the NDS. If it ends up closer to 128mm, I'll be happy.

John

PS... the NDS is already around 60% of the DS.

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Old 05-18-15, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
Actually I would "like" to have an OLD closer to 126mm. I can get a 130mm into the 126mm dropouts, but it would be better to get it a little closer.

I think I have my answer...

miamijim's thread does help, but so does the recent 11 speeds on 5700 hub thread. In that thread, the right way is to re-dish, then I'll bring it closer to 1mm or less off-center, from 1.5mm, so the NDS tension will be a little better. I "may" be able to swap out the 1.0mm DS washer for a .5mm and/or the 7700 4.68mm DS lock nut for a thinner Deore lock nut. I just need to see how much clearance I will get between the lockring/chain to the dropout.

If, and that is still if, everything on the DS fits, I'll take a corresponding amount off the NDS. If it ends up closer to 128mm, I'll be happy.

John

PS... the NDS is already around 60% of the DS.
Many of us consider 65kgf a bare minimum for NDS spokes.
So, assuming your DS spokes are at the somewhat "standard" 110kgf........
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Old 05-18-15, 12:33 PM
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John, Bill Kapaun's suggestion to simply re-dish is the route I'd take. I have 7700 series hubs on my '89 and have previously had 6400 series hubs on it since the mid '90s. No issues what-so-ever. Because at least three sets of 130 mm wheels have been centered in the frame I can only guess that your rear wheel wasn't properly dished or re-dished to adapt to a particular frame.

If you're uncomfortable using the 130 mm wide hub, the only alternative is to use thinner spacers on the NDS and possibly still need to re-dish.

Brad
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Old 05-18-15, 01:49 PM
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Brad,

Thanks! My original question was how far can I push the dishing limit. Right now I am just looking to fudge the 130mm down a tad to make it easier to fit into the dropouts. I think my '88, pre cantilever, is stout enough to handle 130mm OLD without frame issues, so if all else fails, I'll just stick with 130mm.

This is unchartered waters for me and has been a pretty enjoyable adventure. The other half of which are the Campy shifters.

In the meantime I am still running a 7 speed Sachs freewheel (12-32) with a 910 derailleur and DT shifters. I've really enjoyed that setup and which has caused me not to rush into this change.

I appreciate everyone's advice.

John
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