Cassette Removal with a torn up lock ring
 

Hello. I am working on a Raleigh from the early 70s. The rear cassette doesn't rotate well -- lots of resistance. I took out the axle and cleaned everything and re-greased, but no improvement. I then figured I'd need to take the cassette off but it looks like someone else tried that and tore up the lock ring (see picture). Any hope for getting it off? And if I do, what do you think could be causing the resistance? Thank you.


http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=489227

What you have is a freewheel , not a cassette . If you clean up some of your grease around the axle you will see 2 or 4 slots for a freewheel puller . you need one of these two puller , Freewheel Remover - Park Tool & Freewheel or this one Freewheel Remover - Park Tool & Freewheel to remove it with . For learning how Repair Help Articles - Park Tool and follow from step 2 and on . What you had torn up is the cone to the freewheel , it come off clockwise . You remove that then you will have a mess on your hands with bearings and then you need to replace the freewheel .

Thank you for the reply. I took two new pictures which hopefully are more clear. It is those 2 slots which I would use with the freewheel puller that have been damaged . . . unless I am mistaken. Again, thank you for the time.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=489231http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=489233

yes they are the two I am referring to .and you welcome .

The prong type freewheels are about the worst design you can imagine. The tool doesn't engage well and the freewheel body isn't strong enough to withstand the torque needed for removal. Both the tool and the body often shear off.

What you are looking at is a destructive removal of the freewheel. In a nutshell, you have to remove the lockring (the inner ring with the two indentations), remove the outer shell and clamp the rest of the body in a vise. The hardest part is removing the lockring. It's reverse threaded and the indentations don't give you much purchase on the ring. It can be done but it's not easy.

Alternatively, you could just replace the whole wheel and freewheel. Wheels aren't that expensive nor are freewheels, although 5 speed freewheels can be hard to find. It's certainly a lot less hassle.

It's not that hard if you use a hammer and something hard and small enough to wedge into the holes. Just hammer it in the direction you want it to go, it'll come off pretty quickly.

Juts remember the "....direction you want it to go...." is clockwise to loosen since it's left-hand threaded.

Hammer and a tapered punch; it will come right off.

BTW, the freewheel removal doesn't have to be destructive; I've done this numerous times without hurting anything, and if you re-cut the removal slots the part can probably be saved.

On the other hand, most shops have tons of these lying around and will probably give you a workable one for the asking...

While you're correct that the OP has a freewheel, not a cassette, neither of the tools you linked to will work with the OP's freewheel. The OP's freewheel uses the old Regina two-prong design, and needs a different tool. The Bicycle Research CT-1 is one of the better ones, as it has a ring to help prevent the tool from slipping off the notches and damaging them. They've been out of production for a while but they do turn up on eBay often, and your LBS or co-op may have one:

http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/br-ct1.jpg

The old Shimano Dura-Ace two-prong remover will also work, but these are somewhat harder to find these days:

http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/shim-dafw.jpg

It's possible that the locknut may need to be removed from the axle to fit the tool properly.

It was hard for me to see in his photos which freewheel puller the OP need is the reason why I posted what I did , but the two prong one would work if he use the axle nut to hold the puller in place during the remove of it .

No, actually it won't: the prongs on a SunTour remover are too wide to fit the notches on a Regina-style body -- unless, I suppose, damage to the notches has enlarged them enough for the SunTour prongs to fit.

Even with a hammer and punch, the lockring can be difficult to remove on old freewheel. Years of corrosion can cause problems. It can usually be done but it's not all that easy.

Already said that above.

In my experience, the removal slots have been damaged beyond any kind of repair if you have to go the destructive removal route. You can't really recut them since they have been broken and are unusable. Additionally, clamping the body in a vise damages the body since the vise cuts into the material. I suppose you could file off the vise marks but, honestly, that's too much work for a cheap part.

I had precisely this kind of freewheel... I couldn't get it to budge, and broke the tool. The LBS couldn't get it to budge, and told me they didn't want to damage their tool. The damage to the slots means that somebody else has already tried to remove the freewheel, and gave up.

I didn't think of the destructive removal method, plus I was looking for an excuse to install an old IGH that I had just cleaned up, so it was time for a new wheel.

Win - win. ;)

Ever seen a vise with wooden or aluminum face plates..?

Make one more try to remove using the freewheel tool. Remove lock nut. Fit freewheel tool. Use axle nut to secure freewheel tool tightly to the notches. Use a bench vise to hold the freewheel tool and turn the rim. Or hold the rim and use a large wrench to turn the tool.

If that doesn't work, use a hammer and punch to remove the lock ring. Insert the end of the punch in the holes and tap (hard) with hammer. May want to soak with penetrating oil overnight. When the lock nut is removed, unscrew the cogs from the freewheel body. Use a chainwhip to grab them, or - definitely not as good - try a bench vise.

After you have a few of the cogs removed, clamp the freewheel body in a bench vise and turn the rim to unscrew the freewheel.

You will destroy the freewheel but who cares, a bike coop will have a box of old freewheels for $5 each. Pick one or two that your freewheel tool fits, because if they are worn and your chain skips, you'll need to remove them. Get a new chain too.

Since freewheels are cheap, if you want to save the wheel you are going to need a heat source (hot air blower or torch) some good penetrating oil like PB Blaster and a pin spanner. Get the freewheel warm, then squirt oil into the lock ring and body threads, and tap it with a wrench or hammer since the vibration helps the oil wick into the threads. Then do this a few more times over a day or 2, and finally war the freewheel one more time and use the pin spanner to start the destructive removal process.
Alternatively, cut your losses and find a good uses 27" wheel and start over.

Like No. 5, Destructive removal is done by driving the pin holes around and the ring off with a pointed punch .

taking off the sprocket part, all the bearings fall out, then you clamp the center part in the bench vise

and unscrew the wheel from it.

its toast you wont use it again.

Yes but most of them don't have enough bite to remove a freewheel. If the removal tool is damaged due to the tightness of a freewheel, the body will just tear up the aluminum or wooden face of the vise.

Sometimes a good sized pipe wrench works too.

I'm pretty used to you arguing your points ad nauseum, but it's especially interesting when you argue against my experience.

I'm sharing what I have done, not my opinion...

I agree with [MENTION=21724]cyccommute[/MENTION]. Finish destroying the freewheel using the method in the article he cited. Replace it with something cheap. It's the quickest method, and there's not much sense in trying to save something that isn't valuable.

You can do what you want in terms of a freewheel but, honestly, what's the sense in trying to salvage a freewheel that is already damaged? Take apart the freewheel, corralling all the ball bearings (they are extremely small and easy to lose and there are about a million of them), removing the body from the hub without damaging it, then cutting new slots into a freewheel body that is already broken and reassembling the freewheel seems like a lot of effort for a freewheel that can be easily replaced with something that costs $8 to $15 new.

I rebuilt a freewheel once. It was an interesting experience but taught me that they just aren't worth rebuilding.

I rebuilt a freewheel once, when I accidently took it apart instead of taking it off. (Before I really knew how to work on bikes.) I wouldn't say it was very difficult, just lots of bearing balls to deal with. Was really only slightly more difficult than a typical loose ball bottom bracket. I do agree though that in most cases it's easier just to replace them.

No argument there.

I'm probably a bit older than you so before freehubs came out it was pretty common to service a freewheel, especially the pricier ones.

As I said in one of my previous posts, many shops have a box of old freewheels somewhere in the back and will often just give you one if you ask nicely enough...

So, then the answer is no, you haven't seen a vice faced with a pliable material.