The di2 thread
 

Hello all, I’ve searched for di2 info and started a few threads of my own but you have to do a lot of digging to find what you’re looking for, so I thought I would start this post with a few things I’ve learned and hopefully some of you guru’s can add your knowledge here. I can’t take credit for all of this as much of what I’ll add came from others.

Re-center front derailleur.
I moved my di2 from my old frame to my new, the front derailleur trim was all the way inboard as far as it would go and I still needed a couple more steps.
-What I did:
1 placed it in big ring/big cog, then went to trim mode and went outboard 12 steps on the front der to get it back to center.
2 cancelled trim mode.
3 went to big ring/little cog and adjusted the high.
4 went to little ring/big cog and adjusted the low.
5 went to big ring/big cog, then back to trim mode, then adjusted inboard a couple steps. This was my original problem it was pegged out inboard and I needed a couple more steps to prevent rubbing (even though I rarely use this combo)

- the Shimano tool you might need to insert or remove your cables is Shimano TL-EW01 Di2 Wiring Plug Tool. I’ve done it with needle nose pliers but they suggest using this tool. When inserting make sure you push until you feel a “click”.

- if you install yourself something I’ve learned is you don’t have to connect your cables to your J box or A box in any certain order, just shove them into whatever port you want and the system will figure it all out.

- Park tool makes a nifty little tool set you can buy that makes running cables much easier. It’s a little pricey but if you’re gonna do it more than once it might be worth it. You can find it here

One more thing I thought I would add is when researching this I found that you don’t have to have e-tube to put your bike into synchronized shifting mode. You can do it by pressing the button on the bottom of the A box. Press twice and the lights come on steady, this means you’re in manual mode. Quickly double press again and the lights blink twice telling you you’re now in semi synchro mode. Press twice again and the lights blink 3 times, now you’re in full synchro. I tested it and it works.

Some helpful links:
Shimano e-tube manual pdf
A good Di2 installation article
Di2 crash recovery mode
Ultegra 8050 di2 manual pdf
A thread about rear derailleur di2
Shimano tech doc search
Ultegra 6870 di2 manual pdf

I’ll add more as I discover them but if anybody has some wisdom or articles to share please do.

Thanks for the followup. It is rarely as complicated as it originally seemed. Although how Shimano can
create a tech doc near 200 pages long on Di2 stuff and never mention that all ports (with one exception
on brifter) are equivalent is a mystery to me.

Here's one. Can i run di2 with just the climbing or sprint buttons only. No brifters.
And would it be cheaper?

My understanding is that using a climbing button would only shift the rear.

It would be cheaper but if you don't run brifters then how are you going to stop?


-Tim-

Climbing buttons are RD only as supplied. In theory one could use the Etube soft ware to reprogram a
climbing button set up to shift the FD but no one has commented on this particular mod. ie the
shimano etube literature seems to suggest this might be feasible. dunnoh....

As to cheaper, maybe $50-150 but rigging the buttons would require some compromises on a drop bar
and how acceptable that would be is problematic. On a flat bar it is great IME.

Alfine 11 speed Di2, looks interesting , the cable pull length between gears apparently is short, so the stepper motor seems like a good thing.

Looks like it is retrofittable on the IGH.. too;

Individual components will work by themselves. This is one of the diagnostic features of DI2. A fully functional component should pass all of the test tests on the computer that's running Shimano's DI2 software on. In a set of circumstances you will need a junction A and Junction B. For the most part its just a matter of daisy chaining components together into a workable order. The DI2 system is a fairly rudimentary dumb computer system. The only component that locks you into a DI2 system are the derailleurs that determine whether your bike is a 10 speed or 11speed DI2 bike. Other than that everything is compatible for DI2 road except the first generation 7970 Dura Ace DI2. You can even put 9070 components on a 6770 bike once you have the front and rear derailleurs and the basic firmware wont know any different. You just wont get the 11th gear.

So no huge savings.
I ride the drops mostly so i thought i could position the shifters better.
And it is the front shifting i am most interested in. Am i rght in thinking that is where the biggest improvement over mechanical is.

Personally, I have one bike that's full Di2 6870, and another that's a mix 5800/6800 with the new 5801 FD (similar to 9100/8000/7000). For me, the biggest difference is rear shifting, but I live in a fairly flat area and don't get out of the big ring much. It's crisp, quick, hassle free, no need to worry about barrel adjusters... it just works. With the new design of the front derailleur, it's really not as big of a difference aside from you don't have to move the lever at all to shift into the big ring with Di2. The new mechanical FDs are actually a big improvement over the original 11s design.

In my opinion yes, the front is best because it auto trims itself depending on which cog you’re in. So you can use all 22 gears. You don’t use them all with synchro turned on, you really don’t need to. But as far as I’m concerned both front and back are great, in fact I think it’s the biggest bike advancement in 50 years.

[MENTION=3379]MikeOK[/MENTION]

I've had Di2 since 2014, and I still learned a lot from your post. Many thanks!

Is there a similar procedure for re-centering the rear derailleur? Mine is almost at one extreme.

I was thinking about this when I made my first post, but didn’t include it because I’m not sure, haven’t tried. But I don’t see why it wouldn’t be the same. Maybe someone who’s done it will chime in.

I thought it couldn't be done (and asked and got that answer here before), so I think you discovered something new. Did you just figure this out the hard way, or is it documented somewhere?

Actually I started another thread asking about this and the responders gave me a lot of resources and that’s how I stumbled upon the solution. I’ve never been able to find this exact fix anywhere and I’ve done a lot of digging, but I can’t take all the credit the guys gave me enough help that I was able to finally stumble onto this fix. And it took a little trial and error.

[MENTION=347046]wgscott[/MENTION] I gave it a little thought, and I’m pretty sure you can do this to re-center the rear, in fact it might be simpler than the front. Just go into trim mode, move it as many steps as it takes to get back to center, cancel trim mode, then adjust your high and low. I bet that will work.

As note that Di2, at least in the recent software, may lock out certain gear combo’s, so crank and cassette dependent, you may not be able to shift the system to all 22 gears. You sometimes have to cheat the system somewhat and tell it you are using a 53/39 crank and 12-25 cassette (regardless of what you have), then set to manual mode and Gear Position to Not Set, in order to get the rear derailer to the 2 smallest cogs.

I discovered this in January while setting up a 50/34 crank and 11-23 (11 spd.) cassette, that I could not access the 12 or 11 cog, even in manual mode or Gear Position Off, while in the 34 small ring. Issue 1 was Shimano has discontinued the 11-23, so it doesn’t even show up in the E-Tube settings as a cassette to use.

Note that this may be a moot point if desiring to use Synchro, as the gear chart in E-Tube shows, you have other ring/cog choices to get the same gear inches you would find in the 34/12 and once you figure out where the shift points are, it shifts the system for you when you need the next available gear.

And cheating the system by indicating a crank/cassettes that you are not using only rears it’s head if viewing the gear positions on a Garmin head unit or some such, otherwise the system doesn’t care what you actually have in use, as long as you configure chain length correctly.

I have my system set to Full Synchro and so far am happy with it. I switched to a 14-28 cassette, live in the big ring most of the time, have no need for a 50/11 anyway, so am pleased with how it all works. I like having the Gear Position on the Garmin 1000, means I don’t have to look back at the cassette to see what gear I’m in.

I have noted though, that using BT on the Di2 battery in a constant link to the Garmin while riding, does use up DN110 battery life, when it went from 100% to 90% in about 5 riding hrs. (As displayed on the Garmin) Not linking BT to the Garmin showed no add’l battery drain over the next 5 hrs.

Steve thanks for adding. My knowledge is limited to my Ultegra 6870 50x34, 11x32. In manual on the original frame I could get all my gears, but after moving it all to a new frame I would get slight rubbing when in big ring/big cog. That is what prompted me to start the original thread. I was pegged out inboard and even though I rarely cross chained like that it bothered me that it wasn’t perfect. Since I started using synchro I really only need it re-centered because that’s just how it should be.

Its the same as any computer. Leave the bluetooth on, on your phone and it will eat batteries also. Its a service that is running on your bike. It's great if you want to connect to the Shimano app or connect to other devices but otherwise its just going to sit there being a battery hog.

Rear can be re-centered.

There are 33 steps in the 6870 rear derailleur adjustment. Put it in adjustment mode, adjust the derailleur all the way to one side and then move if 16 steps to the other side. It will then be centered.

Then just follow the FD-6870 dealer manual exactly. Set it up as if you were installing a new derailleur for the first time and it will be fine.


-Tim-

I'm probably not being clear.

What I was hoping to do is re-center the window for adjustment with respect to the cassette, so that after the derailleur is perfectly adjusted with respect to cog #6, it will have 16 steps available to each side. On one wheel-set, I have 3 or 4 clicks remaining; on my other wheel-set, I have none remaining.

I’m pretty sure we are understanding you wgscott. When you have your trim set centered on cog 6 it will be centered on every other cog as well. And you’ll have 16 steps of trim adjustment each way. I have two rear wheels as well and mine are different maybe 4 trim steps, even the high and low are a tad different. I’m running an el-cheapo wheel right now and I can’t get it to go into the #11 cog without chattering no matter what I do, it works fine on the better wheel. So I’m gonna wear this one out then change it all.

OK, I will try it again. I am clearly missing something.

[MENTION=396691][/MENTION]wgscott - did you get it to work? I had to do my front again because I adjusted the preload on my BB.

I have an e-tube question for you guys, I am trying to lower the cog that prompts a ring downshift and it won't let me. Right now it lowers my chain ring when i go from my second cog to my big cog, and I want it to shift down when go from my 3rd to my 2nd. I am able to move how many cogs that the rear moves (I went from 3 to 2) but it won't let me change when it shifts. I was able to change where it up shifts to the big ring.

To add to the discussion one thing I was wondering is if the Bluetooth unit would work in a titanium seat post and yes, it will. But when I paired to it my iPad it lost it's connection in the middle of updating the firmware and completely locked it up. I couldn't get the lights on the a box to light and it wouldn't shift. I unhooked everything and reconnected, still nothing. I called a bike shop and they told me I would have to take it there and they would hook it up to some gizmo that only dealers have. A few minutes ago I went out to the shop and connected my pc to it. Then I was able to reset the Bluetooth settings and now all is well. I can now connect with both my iPhone and my iPad. Still trying to figure out how to make it downshift in a higher gear.

This need to be a sticky and as Timothy H wrote:

"Firmware updates on any device require the device to be rebooted. Rebooting the wireless unit interrupts wireless communication to the unit and so the final part of the update cannot complete. A wired connection is much more reliable for reestablishing connection to a device which is rebooted. Always use a wired connection for updating wireless unit firmware.'

https://www.bikeforums.net/electroni...es-anyone.html

Not sure about the downshifting. Are you stating it will not shift at all to higher gears ?, or you are locked out of the 2 highest gears ?, which is normal Di2 behavior.
SB

[MENTION=3379]MikeOK[/MENTION] I don't have the bluetooth unit and now I feel justified in that decision. I've left the settings and the firmware alone since 2015 (which took some restraint, because I obsessively update everything else). It shifts as if I had mechanical shifting, and I now have both non-Shimano crank and in one case cassette sizes, so I feel your pain, but took the coward's way out.

Also, I haven't yet tried to re-center the derailleur adjustment frame-of-referece. I'll give it a go.

My bike now shifts down the front derailleur only when it is going to the big cog from the second. I've tried everything I can imagine and I can't get it to change. I can build a file that lets me move my shift point to a smaller cog but on the page where you drag and drop your file to S1,S2 I get an error message. I even tried multiple different gear selections by lying to it and it won't let me use them.

[MENTION=94341]Steve B.[/MENTION] Yes I should have read Tim's post closer before I paired my iPad. As soon as I paired it the first time it went straight to updating the wireless unit firmware, I didn't even have the option to do it or not. I bricked it just like Tim's post said it would. So take heed everyone, make sure you update everything with a pc before you pair to your devices via Bluetooth.

Well, this stuff can be hard to troubleshoot over a forum as we aren’t there to observe. Here’s (what little) I know and suspect. It sounds like it’s in one of the Synchro modes, thus the auto shift. As well, Shimano locks out the 2 smallest cogs on a lot of cassette and crank choices. I think what you need to do is set to a dummy crank of 53/39, then a 12-25 cassette, then set Gear Position to off, or not set. Then run the system in manual mode and it should allow you to use every cog both rings. Gear Position seems to be a legacy function from the mt. bike groups to deal with chain length and derailer wrap capability.

I can understand the frustration as it’s an entirely new way to deal with shifting issues and there are pitfalls for sure. Shimano as well is playing nanny state with its control over many functions (IMO), right down to discontinuing my favorite 11 spd. casssette, the 11-23.p, which doesn’t show up as a cassette choice in E-Tube. I ended up with 14-28 to get the gearing I wanted, which ran me $70 I didn’t want or need to spend.

As comment on BT E-Tube software and iPhone, it is possible to not have E-Tube automatically update when you connect. When you establish a connection, the phone app will likely tell you there’s new software and will automatically start the update. Immediately press the X cancel button. This stops the update and allows the app to the connect to change settings, etc....