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Transferring Vulcanizing Cement

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Transferring Vulcanizing Cement

Old 08-22-22, 04:07 PM
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tessellahedron
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Transferring Vulcanizing Cement

I made the mistake of buying this.

it can't be opened without channel lock pliers, and once open it's virtually impossible not to over apply because the brush has been sitting in cement and is beyond saturated. My options are, spend ten minutes wiping back and forth every time I pick up the brush, or over apply while dripping everywhere. I tried using something else instead of the brush but the stuff I tried didn't work. I've got my eye out for a small brush but how ridiculous.

I dunno about the brush but the cap would have been so easy to design properly. It makes me sick. I can't even fix it by driving a nail through it because it's too thin. Does someone else have an easy fix I haven't thought of? I mean a strap wrench, channel lock pliers, or even your mom's jar opener should all be 100% unnecessary.

what are my opinions for transferring this to another container? I bought blunt syringes for transferring ink. Could I just fill them with cement or would it harden in there? I suspect they're polypropylene. I also have some glass jars, kind of like Mason jars, but maybe that's to much air volume, I dunno.

the little tubes in patch kits usually dry out or leak. I had one leak this morning. Is there a better way to carry this stuff?

I'll never buy another slime product. They obviously sell products they've never even tried to use.
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Old 08-22-22, 05:50 PM
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What I use. No problems for years.

​​​​​​https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7651198
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Old 08-22-22, 06:27 PM
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I get that you are unhappy, but not much more. This is a standard type of container for rubber cement in auto industry. You wipe off excess cement from the brush against the opening in the container. For use on the road with a bike, I pour the cement into small glass vials straight from such a container, or, for a cleaner job, I use disposable pipettes. The cement can be diluted with heptane or white gas.
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Old 08-22-22, 06:30 PM
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Transfer it to the trash.
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Old 08-22-22, 06:47 PM
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Thanks for the napa link! I didn't know they carried that and it's one of the few stores in town.

Knowing what to search I found a few other options on Amazon and two things proved universally true: they all included a brush applicator, and they all had much larger diameter lids than slime.

so I'm gonna try it in a jar and a few vials and probably just chuck it if it dries out. White gas would be expensive since I don't have any. Is a q-tip a bad idea for applicator? I know it says don't get dirt and oil in the patch but what if I just cleaned my finger and used that?

I guess I'm the odd one when it comes to the brush applicator. Actually I just realized part of the reason it's so maddening is that the opening is so small. I'm gonna hope that's it and buy the NAPA cement next time.
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Old 08-22-22, 06:56 PM
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Those little tubes in patch kits - do you use the Rema kits? I've found the caps go back on and tighten reliably and that if I rolled the tube up or squeezed until glue started to come out when putting the lid back on, very few tubes dried up. And many bike shops sell just the tubes and just the patches.

That can in your photo looks perfect for a Cycle Oregon mechanic preparing for 2000 cyclists and goatheads. Or this and maybe my next two lives.
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Old 08-22-22, 07:05 PM
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That's the kind of container a heavy equip mechanic would carry in his tool box. (metal-puncture proof) Once you break the bead, you slobber a pantload in there, push in a patch with a bunch slobbered on it and push it all back together. If you're running 10PSI you've over inflated the beast. If you need more pressure, you fill the casing with calcium. For my bikes, I like Elmers in the 8oz container with built in brush. Of course, I now only carry a single tube and do all my patching at home. If I get more than one flat, I'm walking. It's not like I'm in a race.
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Old 08-22-22, 07:09 PM
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Q-tip is not a good idea as it will leave fibers. Just be more diligent taking off excess cement against the opening. Tip of a screwdriver, narrow piece of sheet metal can be good applicators.

The vials are better than cement tubes as you can see whether the cement started drying out or not and you can always a bit of solvent to keep it useful. Mineral spirits may work in place of white gas, but it would be the best to try out on a small quantity.

Rema has additives that speed up vulcanization, especially in contact with Rema patches.
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Old 08-22-22, 07:21 PM
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I had 5 or 6 tubes of cement when I moved last year. Three or 4 were completely empty. They looked full, but when squeezed nothing came out and they just flattened down. Another had leaked, another was almost gone, and the last one had a split cap. They were all generic garbage but even so, the pathetic performance pushed me to buy the can.

now I'm looking at other containers. I think I'll use a glass jar for the bulk of it and try the little dishes that THC concentrate comes in to carry on the bike. I found one type of dish that has a fully plastic lid and that's the closest thing I have to a vial.

I saved an empty hand soap bottle with the pump. That would be weird but I think it's too large.
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Old 08-22-22, 07:24 PM
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Never used anything but the brush cap on those.
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Old 08-22-22, 07:31 PM
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I found 6ml (16x60mm) with alu caps to be the best for the road. https://www.ebay.com/itm/203928536989
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Old 08-22-22, 08:07 PM
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Rema, Rema, Rema

Originally Posted by tessellahedron View Post
I made the mistake of buying this.
No kidding. You don't even say what you're using this goop for, but if you're patching tubes, discard the Slime product and get a Rema patch kit. Much less trouble. If you insist on a lifetime supply, buy the Rema can. Best of luck.
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Old 08-22-22, 08:51 PM
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Slime is what I am using currently to patch tubes, IME such cans are good for about 5 yrs before evaporation thickens the
goop to the point of unusable. At $6-8/can I would throw it out but I haven't bought one in a while and note they are upto
$10-12 now. Slime is not 'vulcanizing' ie chemically reactive with the patch, which gives a somewhat superior bond to
such as slime, but IME slime or its analogues are adequate. Vulcanizing cement costs ~3x as much. If you patch a lot
Rema patches are on amazon in boxes of 100 for ~$20 or so.
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Old 08-23-22, 06:11 AM
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One should distinguish between solvent evaporation and vulcanization. If it is only evaporation, the solvent may be added and the cement can be made liquid again. However, after a number of years, this does not help and the vulcanizing fluid just turns into a ball of goo that does not react to the solvent. I.e., you cannot have a lifetime supply in practice. The lifetime is shorter for Rema.
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Old 08-23-22, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by 2_i View Post
I get that you are unhappy, but not much more. This is a standard type of container for rubber cement in auto industry. You wipe off excess cement from the brush against the opening in the container.
I've got the same stuff, but keep it for use at home. If you need pliers to open the can, you probably need to get some sturdy rags and clean the dried-up glue off the can and lid threads.
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Old 08-23-22, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by 2_i View Post
One should distinguish between solvent evaporation and vulcanization. If it is only evaporation, the solvent may be added and the cement can be made liquid again. However, after a number of years, this does not help and the vulcanizing fluid just turns into a ball of goo that does not react to the solvent. I.e., you cannot have a lifetime supply in practice. The lifetime is shorter for Rema.
All true!

My father-in-law used to say, "Sometimes 15 minutes in the lab will save you a week at the blackboard." Of course it takes more than 15 minutes to see how well the two adhesives work on bike tubes, but I haven't seen a difference between Slime and Rema performance. From my point of view, Slime works as well, costs half as much, and (IME) lasts at least as long in the can and on the road.
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Old 08-23-22, 08:41 AM
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Store the can upside down. Same effect as sealant in tubeless tires. Any slight leaks in the cap that allow evaporation will be sealed by the fluid.
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Old 08-26-22, 11:18 PM
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If all you're looking for is an easier way to apply a bike patch sized amount of the glue, get some "acid brushes". They're small, cheap, reusable, but disposible if/when they're messed up available almost anywhere, any local hardware or big-box store. Here's just one example:

HDX Acid Brushes (3-Piece) 80-721-111 - The Home Depot

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Old 08-27-22, 02:29 AM
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Originally Posted by 2_i View Post
I found 6ml (16x60mm) with alu caps to be the best for the road. https://www.ebay.com/itm/203928536989
I ordered some tiny vials (2ml I think) with orifice reducers. I considered the roller ball or eye dropper vials (they make them that small!) But the minimum order was 25 and I only wanted 5 or 6. The roller ball would be so awesome if it works and doesn't gum up. I may try it someday unless someone else has. Chemical compatibility is my next concern but the plastic capped vials are used in labs so I'm gonna try them. Good to know aluminum exist. Ty

Originally Posted by sch View Post
Slime is what I am using currently to patch tubes, IME such cans are good for about 5 yrs before evaporation thickens the
goop to the point of unusable. At $6-8/can I would throw it out but I haven't bought one in a while and note they are upto
$10-12 now. Slime is not 'vulcanizing' ie chemically reactive with the patch, which gives a somewhat superior bond to
such as slime, but IME slime or its analogues are adequate. Vulcanizing cement costs ~3x as much. If you patch a lot
Rema patches are on amazon in boxes of 100 for ~$20 or so.
if I get the slime cement on my fingers and smear across the edge of a patch, the patch will partially dissolve and spread out across the inner tube. I'm pretty sure that means it's vulcanizing. Real rubber cement works but is a different patching method and using it just like vulcanizing cement didn't hold for half a second when I did it.

Originally Posted by Camilo View Post
If all you're looking for is an easier way to apply a bike patch sized amount of the glue, get some "acid brushes". They're small, cheap, reusable, but disposible if/when they're messed up available almost anywhere, any local hardware or big-box store. Here's just one example:

HDX Acid Brushes (3-Piece) 80-721-111 - The Home Depot

EXACTLY! My dad had one of those on his work bench for years but I didn't know the name. Thanks!
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Old 08-27-22, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted by tessellahedron View Post
I ordered some tiny vials (2ml I think) with orifice reducers. I considered the roller ball or eye dropper vials (they make them that small!) But the minimum order was 25 and I only wanted 5 or 6. The roller ball would be so awesome if it works and doesn't gum up. I may try it someday unless someone else has. Chemical compatibility is my next concern but the plastic capped vials are used in labs so I'm gonna try them. Good to know aluminum exist. Ty
Remember that for, the same size of opening, the rate at which a vial will be drying out is coarsely inversely proportional to the volume. I.e., a 2ml vial will be drying out 3x faster than 6ml. A too large vial may start to be vulnerable to breaking, so there is some sweet point.
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Old 08-27-22, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by 2_i View Post
Remember that for, the same size of opening, the rate at which a vial will be drying out is coarsely inversely proportional to the volume. I.e., a 2ml vial will be drying out 3x faster than 6ml. A too large vial may start to be vulnerable to breaking, so there is some sweet point.
finally someone else who thinks analytically!

I see what you're saying about the size of the opening, but that's with the top off. I've been looking at drying rate as function of the ratio of cement to air in the container. With each opening, assume 100% air exchange, and now you have X ml's of clean air for the volatile components of the cement to evaporate into.

after thoroughly overthinking everything, I ordered 1ml vials. I can't say if they'll dry out or leak or turn into solid platinum so I figured a single use size was the safe bet.
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Old 08-27-22, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by tessellahedron View Post
I see what you're saying about the size of the opening, but that's with the top off. I've been looking at drying rate as function of the ratio of cement to air in the container. With each opening, assume 100% air exchange, and now you have X ml's of clean air for the volatile components of the cement to evaporate into.
With and without the top. Every seal in the world leaks, the question is just at what rate. With a full 6ml vial I can afford adding solvent once a year, with a full 2ml, I may need to add it every 4 months. Opening briefly for gluing does not need to matter. However, keeping the container only partly filled is expected to hurt.
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Old 08-27-22, 12:03 PM
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Since you're using vials too what's your applicator?

1ml is more than enough for one patch right?
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Old 08-27-22, 01:10 PM
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I carry an alu strip, 8cm/3.25" long, 4.5mm wide, a left-over from cutting an alu sheet, 1mm thick. I rounded corners, so I do not scar the rubber. I try to spread the glue very thin. It dries then quickly. I also spread it on the patch. The amount you spend is minimal. I think it is a small fraction of ml.
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Old 08-27-22, 02:58 PM
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Reduce the width of the brush with a sharp knife?
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