Fandomii

Hi folks,

I’m riding with a pair of Bontrager Hard-Case Lite 27,5x2,4” tires and last month I got two punctures in my back tire, riding in my classic road commute using a speed e-bike. They are supposedly “extra puncture resistant” with 1mm Kevlar. I had no punctures for 3 years before using other tires. I don’t know if I’ve been unlucky but 2 punctures in 500km at decent roads seems too much.

My local bike shop insisted that I get some Tannus armour protection. What do you think - is this worth the extra weight and cost? Does it reduce the speed of the bike measurably due to the additional weight of 330g per tire? (In total my tires weigh 1300g and rims at 580g, without armour).



Thank you very much in advance!

grumpus

I think I'd rather have a puncture every few days than ride with those monstrosities inside my tyres, regardless of monetary cost. Much better to do a tubeless conversion, or just carry a couple of spare tubes and deal with the inconvenience. I'm no high performance rider, I pretty much just trundle around these days, but the dead, mushy feel of even cheap ordinary tyres takes away from the pleasure of riding. Of course your mileage will vary ...

Andrew R Stewart 

While I personally agree with grumpus I will admit that the E aspect does shift the flat tire fixing effort a bit, sometimes by a lot. Even with a pro repair stand and years of experience we really dislike having to deal with an E Bike's flats. Andy

Fandomii

At bicyclerollingresistance.com they speculated the watt loss of using Tannus Armour to be ~14W per wheel. For an e-bike running an average of 350W, running Armour on both tires would be a loss of 8% efficiency? Does that sound potentially correct?

Andrew R Stewart 

To a feelingless motor 8% is nothing. To a rider it can be a huge amount of efficiency loss. I suppose if you don't pedal it won't matter...

What will change for the worse, independent of efficiency issues, is the harsher ride that thick walled or liner set ups suffer with and the increased inertia from that added rotating weight. But then I know of no one who sought out an E Bike for their wonderful handling or sprightly feel. Andy

Iride01 

Are you certain all of your flats were punctures from road hazards? If the majority of them were from riding with too low a tire pressure and getting snake bites or from pinching the tube when installing it or other things, then these may not help you much.

If you are indeed in an area where goat heads and other debris is puncturing your tires that often, then sure they'll probably be worth it. And with a E-bike that you can dial up the assist level it'll be no issue to you. Perhaps you might have a little rougher ride, but with the additional weight of the E-bike, probably not as noticeable either as it would be on a 17 pound bicycle.

Fandomii

I'm not sure what caused the flats to be honest, the shop replaced both as they were on the back wheel of a gates belt drive plus inner gear hub. A mother to take apart.I wasn't running high pressure on the tires for sure, but two flats so close to each other on decent gravel was a surprise.

HillRider

Did anyone note where the punctures were on the tube? If they were on the rim side it could well be the rim strip has shifted or failed, not a puncture through the tread. Several years ago a friend had three flats in two day but just kept replacing the tube. When we finally analyzed the flats and inspected the rim, we found the flats were caused by the rim strip having shifted and the spoke hole edges were damaging the tubes. Resetting the rim strip fixed the problem.

fooferdoggie 

the problem with them is they flatten out over time and stay compressed. plus the hassle of installing them. if you have a mid drive then you have a choice of tires like the marathon plus. but even on my mid drive I notice the loss from them. but they are pretty good protection.

sweeks

I have had these on my folding commuter (non-e) bike for several years and several thousands of miles. I suppose there's a little extra rolling resistance, but I've only had one "puncture" flat, which luckily happened close to work. They are essential for commuting in my opinion.

fooferdoggie 

they were so harsh on our tandem it motivated me to change to tubeless since my rims were ready. it was like a jet propelled tandem so much better and smoother. I have 6 of them I have been trying to sell but shipping is too expensive.

veganbikes

I think they are great but I am not going to run them on any of my non-electric bikes more than likely. I have one on my rear tire because faffing about with a flat on a Rohloff E-14 wheel with a belt on a heavy bike is just not easily doable for me. I am not running it at the front and have no plans for that as it is just a thru-axle. I only got it after my second rear flat on the bike on a commute. If the tires I have were tubeless compatible I would probably go tubeless but I have zero desire to change tires as the Super-Moto X's are fantastic and there aren't a ton of options in that width and high quality and I sure as hell am not going narrower and have zero need on that bike for any sort of knobs.

With the bike being so heavy and it also have the assist I really don't notice it as much but a few of my other bikes run very soft supple tires but they are light bikes and unsuspended so it makes a bit more sense to avoid them there.

I think in your case for commuting on an e-bike go for them as I have done at least at the rear but beyond that probably not as much.

grumpus

I'd be inclined to suggest double ended inner tubes, at least for roadside repairs, for bikes that have issues with rear wheel removal. I've never tried them myself, and only rarely encountered them on other people's bikes, I wonder if there are problems with using them.

icemilkcoffee 

330g per tire? That's way heavier than the runflat inserts:
https://www.bikeradar.com/advice/buy...-tyre-inserts/
These don't prevent flats, but they allow you to continue riding after you get a puncture.

CrimsonEclipse

For your size, I'd suggest Schwalbe Marathon E-Plus, Moto, or Marathon Tour.

Skip the armor gimmick except for very specific uses.

Crankycrank

I could just be bad luck but why not go back to the other tires that worked for you rather than adding some questionable Tannus inserts that aren't cheap and can be a royal PITA to deal with when mounting a tire after a flat. The Schwalbe tires mentioned above would probably be more puncture resistant than what you have now as well.

Fandomii

Thank you - can you tell a little more, comparing the marathon E-plus to the Bontrager E6 Hard Case Lite, is the Schwalbe that much more puncture resistant ? Shouldn’t they be the same category or so?

Crankycrank

^^^^^Can't say for sure about any of the Schwalbe's but they have an established reputation for some of their heavier duty tires as being pretty flat resistant and the E Plus is one of the toughest tires they sell. Can't find much info on the Bontrager though. Go to the Schwalbe website and they have some good info about their tire belts and thickness. You may also want to take a look at going slightly narrower or wider to increase your available choices of Schwalbe models. Honestly I would give the Bontragers some more miles before giving up on them. You may have just had some incredibly bad luck but if the flats continue, a tougher tire would be better than any inserts with their extra weight and difficulty mounting tires with them.

Mtracer

I had those inserts put in my wife's ebike. I prefer tubeless, but she doesn't ride that much and I didn't want to maintain the sealant levels for something not used that often.
Being an ebike, some efficiency loss just doesn't matter other than a reduction in range.

I agree with others that maybe the issue isn't a simple puncture. You could be trying to fix the wrong problem.

Fandomii

Thanks folks. I ended up adding a Tannus armour to the back tire and keeping the front tire as is. I tired with armour on both tires and it was feeling sluggish , with one tire I don’t feel the heaviness so much.

I’ll give the Bontrager tires another go now and see how they do - maybe it was just bad luck. They say they have 1mm Kevlar protection. The shop that changed the tubes did not tell me anything about what caused the punctures, I think they’re just really busy and not paying a lot of attention.

If I get another flat I’ll have them look at the rim. And next time I change the tires (let’s say at 10000 miles or km) I’ll try the schwalbe marathon e-plus and might remove the Tannus armour completely if it’s pancaked in there. Thank you all for the really good information!

jgwilliams

I've been using Muc-Off inner tube sealant for a while now and found it quite effective. Small punctures it just seals up. I've had some bigger ones that don't seal completely but it means that I've never had a flat out on the road. I find the next day that the tyre is soft, but I just pump it up and ride. Then I can deal with the puncture at a time that's convenient to me.