bikeman9000

I have this 87 Peugeot road bike that has Campy brakes that the previous owner just haphazardly slapped on. They don't fit the frame (the nuts etc. look all wrong for this bicycle) so it kind of wiggles around freely and they are centred mostly by gravity.

I'm looking at replacement brakes. My bike has a 600 (EX?) groupset so I'm looking at 600 (EX) brakes from the late 80s. I think they originally came with the BR-6208 which are single-pivot.

i was wondering if the brakes will come with everything I need to mount it to the frame, or are the mounting bits perhaps frame-specific, in which case I would have to go hunting for mounting bits for this old peugeot.

Thanks

maddog34

here's a stock set...
https://velobase.com/ViewComponent.a...e-d573c762713a

does your frame allow recessed nuts like those shown in the pics?
alternate lengths of recessed nuts are available.

Andrew R Stewart 

I don't think the 6208 calipers will change the leverage by much. Fresh pads (even "basic" ones will grab better than dried out old Campys) and cables/housings will likely do the bigger difference. But that could be done with the Campys too...

Now if you're installing the dual pivot calipers of only a few years later their added leverage will contribute to "stronger" braking.

Since any caliper will benefit from the pads and cables being replaced and any 6208s you find will likely have old pads too I would just try the Campys first but with proper mounting and adjustments. But then I ran Campys for many years so I am biased. Andy

Crankycrank

I agree with Andrew that sorting out the Campy's with new pads/cables/housing might be the best and easiest solution . Figure out why they are loosely mounted. Could be you just need some spacers and a serrated washer to get the mounting right (Campy even makes their own washers if you want to be a Campy brake purist Campagnolo Toothed Brake Washer OEM Replacement Part : BR-RE021 | eBay ), could be some worn parts or bike mounting holes were modified or worn from misuse, etc., but try to figure it out.

bikeman9000

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

This is what the brakes look like just for reference: https://imgur.com/a/WqcrpWB

For the rear brakes it has these convex spacers (?) on both ends of that cross-shaped piece on my frame. It's like they were meant for a bike without the bit that runs parallel with the tires.

The nut at the front of the front brakes always wants to back off as well, but I guess that's an unrelated problem.

Ok, I guess you all have convinced me to stick with the campys then. The OCD side of me kind of wants to make it 'original' again, but that's silly I guess. I'm going to bring it in to a bike shop soon for somethign else and maybe the people there will be able to give me some advice on what pieces to add to fix it in place.

bikeman9000

Would like to post links so here is an empty post.

bikeman9000

Noob question about brake pads...

Is there a major difference between the three types of pads available in this listing?

https://www.amazon.com/Bell-BINDER-C.../dp/B000FJS88W

The first ones look like the ones I already have installed but are said to be for mountain bikes. The last ones are said to be for road bikes (what I have).

Crankycrank

That's a crime whoever mounted those brakes. Take the spacers currently on the back and check if the brake works without any spacers but if needed use flat spacers only to match the surface of the brake stay. The front clearly needs spacers and if the mounting surfaces are rounded use some concave spacers to match the roundness of the fork (The spacers currently on the back look like they are the wrong curvature for the fork but give them a try). I recommend using some KoolStop Salmon colored pads for the replacement. Best stopping pads for wet and dry available. Check the pad measurements given on the page and shop around for best prices. Mafac 4 Dot Insert Replacement Pad – KOOLSTOP

bikeman9000

Yeah I love the bike but the guys who sold it were hacks looking to make an easy buck selling to unsuspecting rubes like me. It's had a bunch of small to medium sized quirks like this and I'm still working them out years later.

I'll give the spacer thing a try. I'm not too knowledgeable mechanically but it's a learning opportunity.

Thanks for the pad recommendation. They look to be hard to find in Canada for a reasonable price but luckily I live near the border so it's not too much of a hassle to pick them up.

Iride01 

The mounting bolt going through the fork looks one size too small in diameter. Maybe not, but if it is that might be making some issues with the caliper arms as well.

Those old brakes can be a pain to get centered up. They aren't going to stop you as well as more modern dual pivots. So if you aren't needing the period correct look, then just get some new brakes. Microshift and others make more modern stuff that is compatible with older standards. Depending on how deep you want to reach in your pockets, you might even put a entirely new group set on it and get rid of the down tube shifters if that is what is still on it. If that's a 130 mm spacing in the back, you could get a new rear wheel and put 10 or 11 speed rear on it if you want to pull out your wallet too.

maddog34

the rear caliper is Bent (left arm.. look at the pad angle and position ).... and i agree with Crankycrank on the "concave spacers" issues.... as to the pads, do Mafac replacement pads work in those pad holders, and are those pad holders capable of having their pads replaced?

one thing that hasn't been established yet.. is the front fork "recessed nut" capable? it is a peugeot fork, but may not be the stock fork..... the "recess" is about 8mm ID.
this becomes a factor when changing, or properly mounting, any brakes to that bike.

and, as a rule... Bell ANYTHING pretty much SUCKS.... I avoid Bell products.

bikeman9000

I believe you're right about the mounting bolt being too small. There is a lot of play on the horizontal and vertical axis, and if I grab both ends of the bolt and wiggle it it makes a little knock.

Assuming that the mounting bolt is tied to the brakes I guess that means there is no hope of keeping these brakes and trying to make them work?

If I was depending on this bike for a daily commute or for more serious riding I would consider a new groupset, but it seems like too much cost (and time spent figuring out how to install everything).

I'll look around for dual pivot brakes. The other reason I was looking at the the BR-6208 single pivot is that I feel like I can be confident it will fit my bike since it's what it originally came with. It seems a bit tricky to figure out if such and such brakes will fit on my bike.

BTW I'm not seeing any brakes on the microshift site, or when I search for 'microshift brakes' on google.

SurferRosa

Not sure if you're wanting to replace the brake calipers as mentioned in your first post, but it would be helpful to see the back of the fork and the back of the rear brake bridge without the calipers mounted, so we could see if it takes a recessed nut. Most bikes made in the late '80s take a recessed nut.

Familiarize yourself with the two vintage brake mounts, nutted versus recessed. If your frame accepts a recessed nut, then the proper thing to do is to mount calipers that are designed accordingly.

And you now have the required number of posts, so you can post images to this thread directly.

bikeman9000

Yes, I think I'm in favour of replacing the calipers now that it looks like the existing mounting bolt is wrong.

I just took the rear calipers off and here is how it looks:

https://i.imgur.com/cuPnbcI.png

maddog34

as to pads... i install a lot of these... https://www.ebay.com/itm/30504695121...Bk9SR-qqtNHdYg

bikeman9000

Thanks, not sure why I didn't check ebay before but that's the best price I've been able to find for the kool stops.

Andrew R Stewart 

Are you sure the calipers are actually Campys? Or am I seeing only Campy center bolts (that are missing spacer and frame fitting bits) with either Dia Compe or Weinnman arms? The rear's QR lever and it's backing nut are dead ringers for these brands.

Given what I think I see I suggest a full assessment of the complete bike as the ham fisted results on the brakes might be the tip of the ice berg. It would be a shame to have this bike end up being rebuilt part by part while not working well all the time. Andy

bikeman9000

Sorry yes, the arms are Dia Compe. No clue where I got the idea they are Campy... my bad. As for the other parts I can't say where they come from.

The bike did indeed have a lot of issues (e.g. untrued wheels, bad freehub, the handlebars stopped turning and after opening it up a bunch of orange dust spilled out..lol) but I sorted the major ones out right away, and then put a few hundred---maybe a thousand miles on it. I used to ride it maybe 8 miles per weekday 8 for months a year.

bikeman9000

Here is how the front calipers look still mounted. I can probably take it off if it helps.

https://imgur.com/a/qWvIvus

I'm now getting faint flashbacks of speaking to a mechanic at a local bike shop who I believe told me to look for "nutted" brakes. It could be that he said "recessed nut" but I would bet on the former.

SurferRosa

What does the front of the rear brake bridge look like, so we can determine if it's a recessed mount? Show the back of the fork as well (with the front brake removed).

SurferRosa

Here is the front of the rear brake bridge on two of my bikes with brakes mounted. They are both recessed mounts.

Crankycrank

I recommend trying to find a Co-Op or friend to help sort this out. There are more issues with just the brake setup than I thought could be possible combined with confusion about what make brakes you have, mis-matched pads, etc. We'll be chasing our tails around till Christmas getting this done right. Not trying to be snarky but a hands-on, knowledgeable eye could figure this out pretty quickly.

bikeman9000

Here is a front view of the rear brake mount, and then two shots of the front. I was not able to get the front totally disassembled as I do not know how to unscrew the weird circular piece.

https://imgur.com/a/8plg9pe

bikeman9000

Fair enough. There is a co-op about 1 hour from me which is where I had plans to take it soon anyway, so might as well get an opinion on the brakes too.

Iride01 

Although I mentioned that to me double pivots are more superior to the old brakes. I have to say that even with wet rims/brakes and chromed steel rims I was always able to stop in the nick of time. So if you aren't a high speed demon as I was/am on a bike, if you find a deal on a used set of vintage style brakes then go for it. A "deal" in my mind is free or a token sum. Or if you can get those working well enough with the proper scrounged parts.