No, because that's where the bolt to secure the quill riser will go (you know the one in the first pic you posted). You'll still have a top cap, but instead of connecting to the star nut it will connect to the wedge at the bottom of the quill and it won't be used for tensioning.

Yeah, but the reason Sheldon's mod is ill advised for a 1in steerer is because the seat clamp won't have enough friction to hold tight on the smaller circumference tube. The OP, however, will be maintaining bearing tension with either a normal threadless stem (in cascade with a normal quill) or a threaded race, all of which work fine with 1" steerers.

What happens inside the spacers is irrelevant. But what ARE critical differences are that the OP's setup will have less leverage to flex the headset area and uses better clamping mechanisms than a seatpost clamp, which makes it safer than Sheldon's setup. We can argue all day about the differences, but the point is that all the parts will function in their normal capacity, therefore it will work.

Sure, the OP doesn't have experience, but we do and mine says that what he's proposing is at least as safe as what Sheldon proposed. How much experience do you have tensioning threadless headsets without top caps? I have plenty and have found they're rather forgiving.

Why isn't it cost effective? Sounds like he has all the parts except the threadless stem (which he's going to reuse once he upgrades) and the quill. So it's a choice between buying the quill vs buying a new fork, with the quill being cheaper (at the expense of being heavier and requiring more labor to install and maintain than a bonifide threadless fork).

While it's true that quill stems aren't quite as secure as threadless stems, if they're secure enough to hold the handlebars than they're certainly secure enough to hold the bearing tension. After all, in the words of one bike manufacturer that doesn't spec top caps, "if you lose headset tension the worst that happens is you will need to adjust your headset, but if your handlebars come loose you're going to crash badly"

But, yeah, if given the option using the threaded top cap is probably better because there are fewer clamping mechanisms involved, but it's not a big deal.

The point is - the OP only needed to replace a threaded headset withanother threaded headset to be home free. That would have been the most cost effective (parts and labor) solution.

But the OP would also like to move to a threadless fork at some point in time - he apparently just doesn`t have the money at this point. But he managed to get hold of a threadless headset and apparently doesn`t have the patience to wait for a threadless fork and so wants to try this NOW.

Personally I don`t care what works for you and I don`t care what works for me. If this guy damages anything through inexperience it comes out of his pocket - not your`s or mine.

But if you want to drop by his place and give him a hand and let him benifit from your limitless experience -I`m sure he`ll appreciate it. But you`re also proving my point. Based on all that experience you apparently have. the only reason I can see for you making duplicate posts and creating some kind of long drawn out drama out of choosing a cheap pair of handlebars is because you`re bored and this is what you do for enternainment.

Several people asked you for specifics on the bike because if you were driving a threaded headset with a long gooseneck and a single bolt handlebar clamp - then the bars would only be a small a small part of your flex problem. But you consistantly avoided those requests.

Hope it was fun for you.

The setup would probably work ok and serve it's purpose as a temporary low cost solution until a new fork arrives. Seems like the main question is if it might mess up the nice threadless headset. Maybe some locktite or something in the threads of the steerer where it may sit would help.
Different from this situation, but I did a pretty desperate modification to allow riding a too short threaded fork with threaded setup. I cut off the top of another threaded steerer and slipped it inverted onto the quill stem and used the threads at the bottom for the upper race, then shoved the stem with it down into the fork and tightened the quill. The overall length of the cut off steerer section and the length of the threaded part of it were dependent on where the stem ended up as far as it's height and acceptable insertion into the fork steerer (this section buts up against the crook of the stem and can't hit the top of the fork steerer). Kind of hard to explain and visualize, but it "works".
This was only meant as a very temporary fix to allow testing the ride to determine if it was worth keeping and looking for another fork, and it is, I really like the ride with this fork as a reference for a replacement. It's a secondary bike and I don't consider it very safe (if I loosen the stem bolt the fork falls out) and ride it accordingly while keeping my eye out for an acceptable longer fork.
Anyway, whatever you do try not to mess up the new headset.

Hi - There`s no doubt that it MIGHT be a workable solution. But no chance that it could be considered low cost unless you consider your time worth nothing. The `LOW COST` solution would have been to have the threaded headset replaced with another threaded headset at a shop equipped to do the job.

But instead he saw a `deal` on a threadless headset and thinks he eventually wants a threadless fork anyway - so why not?

Your point about the threads being a problem is right on, particularly if there is a rubber seal in the top cap. Ideally the complete threaded area except for the part that would inside the locking nut should be filled with epoxy and the profile sanded smooth. And the locking nut should be drilled and tapped for two grub screws to keep it from coming undone since it now has no other threaded nut to lock against and bearing preload pressures are minimal.

If this was a prototype or an R&D project with an equipped workshop the whole thing would be a lot more likely to come together successfully - but if that was the case, then the OP wouldn`t be on a forum like this askink some pretty basic questions.

So why do I have so many reservations? Because the last guy that brought a BMX into the shop because he couldn`t get the threadless headset adjusted properly had tried to do the installation himself. In his case he had used a 2 x 4 and a hammer too install the bearing cups. But that was only part of the issue. The profile on the crown race originally installed on the forks didn`t match the new bearings and since he didn`t know you had to change it -he didn`t. But since there aren`t supposed to be any parts left over P the new crown race got added in somewhere else.

And then he took the bike down to the skate park (where he was actually an excellent rider) and started doing jumps with it.

No money saved - he needed a new headset.

Forums can be fun, but I`m thinking that if people start to be held accountable for what they post and were open to lawsuits for injury or damage resulting from what they post or encourage, they`d be a lot more conservative.

Sometimes the best advice to give in some situations wher the poster has limited experience is: Take it to a shop!

I agree 100% with that sentiment, but most of the posters on here don't wanna here it.

+1, [simplifying the how to stuff I wrote earlier] just Get a threaded headset, dude .

if you then want to use a threadless stem, then buy a conversion plug ,
7/8" quill on the bottom, with a 9/8" diameter on the top to grip with the stem,
of your choosing

the carbon fork is questionable, used, you don't know its former life..
could be hidden surprises.

I know, right? Not only do I not know about the third-hand fork's previous 13 years of life, I got this threadless headset for a good deal and I even got it installed for free today, ($65 for a 6 month old chris king, you ask?). So I'm sticking to threadless for now at least. I'm in the market for a new threaded headset probably in the future, as the old tange on my bianchi rc has some play, probably from pitted cups. Haven't disassembled to tell though.

I appreciate all of your input, and I think a general consensus has been made. I think that another person who comes along with a similar thought will be better-informed by this thread. I took my frame in to the shop here, and the mechanic told me that I could use the top nuts from my old threaded headset as long as a second was used to keep the lower one from loosening. That would've been fairly tricky given the profile of the nuts and the fact that the threads don't go all the way through on the top nut.

I think I may be able to afford a threadless fork, just not a high end one. After thinking about it, it will be more cost effective and guarunteed-to-be-safe then jury rigging a quill type extension in there. I was thinking something like the nashbar 1" carbon fiber fork for $80. I don't know what nashbar branded stuff is like, though. Maybe you guys can shed some light on an appropriate fork for my R1000.

So, does anyone have a recommendation for a great value, threadless 1" carbon fork? Nashbar -- $79. rake on my original is 43mm fyi.

Actually that sounds like an ideal configuration with your existing fork - suggest you review my previous postings.

I had previously pointed out that the top locking nut was not threaded all the way through and that the steering tube is normally cut to size so that it does not quite contact the ridge inside the locking nut.

Yes, normally two nuts are turned against each other in a threaded headset arrangement, but thats no longer what you have. If you drill and tap that nut for two grubscrews you`ll have an ideal alternative.

And I also mentioned that Giant manufactured threaded headsets with a top locking nut that already had grubscrews installed. If you can locate or order one - that`ll be a $3 solution that will let you use your current fork.

I`d have no reservations about using a secondhand carbon fork. If it shows no signs of delamination or cracking or abrasion that has exposed fibre - go ahead.

Once you have that headset nut installed you have the equivalent of a threded headset (although a hybrid solution). From that point you can use an adapter to convert from a gooseneck type stem to a threadless style stem without issue.

Please keep posting.

Well if I'm looking to upgrade my fork down the road, I wouldn't want to put epoxy on it cause then it would be more difficult to sell. (unless re tapping it will be easy?). I did a couple searches and couldn't find that headset.. maybe I'll have to ask lbs. Do you think that a little blue thread lock will accomplish the same task as using the epoxy? or teflon tape?

Unfortunately things are usually relative. Since the upper threads will already be exposed, it would be a breeze to chase those threads and clean out anyhing in them if you had s die in that threadsize. If not - a wire brush would do the job but take a lot longer.

Resale on used forks isn`t just affected by condition - fit plays a critical role too. New forks are sold uncut. Used or even OM forks (sold as new but taken off new bikes) have been cut to fit a particular steering tube length. So your chances of selling this fork later are not only dependent on finding a buyer that likes the fork and condition, but also has a bike with a steering tube the same sie or smaller than yours.

I suggested filling the threads (inside the headset area only) to provide a smooth contact area for the tapered V-ring to use. Electrical tape or teflon tape will increase the diameter and still not provide the same thing. I might be being overly fussy - you can use your discretion on that one.

I have one of those Giant top locking nuts here on a machine. I`ll see about uploading a photo you can use as a reference.

I actually already have a buyer.... and told him that I'd do $45 shipped. I thought it was fair considering the age. Love to hear others thoughts on that though.... it's a cannondale slice fork. I have some 8.5" of steerer which will easily work on most bikes if threaded down a little more and cut (60cm frame).

In fact probably nicer than anything you`ll get to replace it for two or three times what you`re selling it for. Personally I`d keep it. It won`t affect anything else you plan on doing.

$80 for a carbon fork new? wouldn't that be worth it?

Threaded route:

$20 run-of-the-mill headset (would have preferred dura ace or chris king.. so really $60-80)
$30-40 cinelli 1a stem in black
$30 smaller diameter bars
$0 used carbon fork I know nothing about

$60-80

Threadless route

$60 chris king headset that I'd get for a future bike anyways
$35 new fork (after selling old one)
$58 thomson stem new (after trading in some parts I didn't need to lbs)
<$10 spacers. (possibly free from lbs)
Piece of mind and good aesthetics - priceless
$0 FSA energy traditional bars 31.8 (got for free basically)

$153-$163

Just wanted to put it into perspective a little bit. So, for me, it's about twice as expensive. It's a good investment, in my opinion, to go threadless. I want to try the riser temporarily, but then I've got to buy a riser. Why don't I just get rid of the fork and do it the "right" way from the "beginning". Can anyone offer any ideas about new carbon forks?

At this point I`m getting the impression that you seem to think that tour Thompson stem and FSA bars can`t be used with anything except a threadless fork -WRONG!

Any $10 to$35 threaded to threadless conversion extension (available in different diameters) will let you do that. In fact - I for one was under the impression that that was pretty much what got this thread started in the first place.

As for carbon forks - three of the bikes that I personally built up this year using Thompson stems had DT Swiss carbon suspension forks and one had a rigid bladed fork. The rigid fork retailed for over $450 and the suspension forks run around $1,200 ea. Basicly for $100 you,re going to get garbage. You`d be better off using a decent cromoly fork or the one you have now. If you think there`s something about the fork you have now that is suspect - then you shouldn`t be selling it either.

And considering a bike an `investment`? And now, after initially insisting on using that threadless headset with that threaded fork you now want to `do things the right way` after its now been spelt out clearly enough how to do what you wanted to do in the first place - safely?

From my perspective this thread has turned out to be a very poor `investment` of my interest and expertise. Think I`ll just stop wasting my time.

To me there isnt any bad outcome to this thread, and I'm not agreeing that expertise was wasted. Personal choice changed, and I think it is not very difficult to respect.

I don't necessarily think there's anything wrong with the fork, but I rather have more certainty about it. I wanted a clean install too and I don't think I could do that with the riser and extra nuts.

While it may sound counterintuitive that I need theft protection and I'm going with a threadless set up, I'm happy with the pitlock system I currently have.

It might still be worth hanging on to what sounds like the original fork, at least until you get things worked out. There seems to be some differences in hard to measure fork dimensions that could make a small difference in ride characteristics. This may be less important with carbon forks but I think there is often some length variation there too besides offset, not that any change would be noticeable or bad.
Also, a lot of people prefer quill stems for their easy height adjustment, and that fork might be hard to replace.
I like the mechanics of theadless, especially getting rid of the stem wedge, and can somewhat relate to your situation, but I think a lot of people would be better off sticking with their original threaded fork, even with an adaptor for a new stem. I used to fiddle around a lot with my quill stem height and it was kind of nice to have that easy flexibility.

Yeah.. I have another bike with a threaded headset that I might swap over to use the 600 stem I have. For me, however, putting the other headset on still won't allow me to go higher with the 600 quill I have without sacrificing aesthetics. On my other steel road frame, there is actually a spacer in the threaded headset about 5/8" high. I doubt that will be able to fit on this cannondale fork.

I will go back to the shop and see if they have that giant lock nut. Otherwise out with the new and in with the old. I'll be without my geared road bike for a while unless i swap everything else over as well (this is supposed to be a FG/SS).

I would like pictures if you're still willing to post, Burton.

What's going on here? this was in a recent bike show...
threaded fork:

I`ll have them posted as an edit to this response over the next day or so.

This particular headset was branded with the Giant name but was manufactured by Tien Hsin and incorperates their `double lock` feature.

What you`re trying to do isn`t unheard of, in fact if you look at the Ahead website, they are currently marketing a modular system that will let a combination of components be used with either a threaded or unthreaded fork. The problem is - you don`t have an Ahead headset so you`re left scrambling looking for compatible parts to make what you do have do something it was never intended to do.

With the photos and manufacturer`s name, it should be possible to get what you need to do the job.

As a reference, Zoom also offers conversion stems for threaded forks to let you use steering stems and bars intended for threadless systems. They`re solid - I`m driving a machine with one on a BMX with cromoly bars and there`s no flex.



OK thats both sides of the locking nut showing the two grub screws. That's a stock configuration. The hanger underneath is just for canti brakes.

That's nifty... will keep in mind for future builds.

finished product with new fork rides very nice. 18 pound bike. $55 stem new, fork was $80.. headset $65.

Picture in # 43
What's going on here? threaded fork:

a 7/8" plug quill with the stem gripping the plug .. Given it's Tom Ritchey,
you think the plug would be flush with the top of the hand brazed stem, at least.

You`ve obviously gone out of your way to pick up some quality components so please don`t take any criticisms personally. I`m sure you want as good a build as possible and thats the intent.

The spacer stack height in this photo is unacceptably high. Typically spacer stack height between the headset and steering stem is 1 1/2 in on a steel tube and 25mm on a carbon tube. A steel tube on a threadless fork for example, is 45% thinner walled than the equivalent steel tube fork. It isn`t designed to take the same stress hence the angled steering stems to adjust handlebar height.

I`m noting that the Thompson stem you have installed looks like a 5 degree model and you can invert it and move some of the spacers above it and maintain the same handlebar height, but you might be better off with a 10 degree rise.

Is the bike frame sized to your build?

The handlebar tape also appears to have been installed from the bars downwards to the bar ends rather than the other way around. Bars are conventionally taped from the bar ends upwards because that orients the ridges in the same direction as your palm force when in the drop position.

Suggest you pick up a couple good reference books. The Zinn book advertised on this site is OK as is the Park Tool Big Blue Book. The Park Tool website also posts an extensive amount of tutorials and reference material. Its all free.

Checked with nashbar and they said 50mm was fine with this aluminum steerer. 10 degree rise. Meaning to get shorter spacers but have to redo steerer and move starnut...

handlebar tape was reused.. it ripped while reapplying it and thus is wrapped the wrong way. It was wrapped bottom up anyways on one side. other side is the same just reversed direction.

bike shop didn't hesitate looking at the 40mm spacer while helping me tension headset properly....

Looks like a cool bike. Is it single speed/fixed gear? I don't see any shifters.

Although it may not be critical I agree with Burton that flipping the stem may be better to give you less stack height while achieving the same handlebar position.

That is less than safe and should not be ridden far or fast. In fact I would not want to ride it that way. The center of the upper clamping screw is above the top of whatever stem it has and that means there is little to no support from the upper screw.