EMERGENCY Frame Repair (worst I've ever SEEN!)
09-13-12, 10:47 PM
#26
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No, you didn't. At least not until now.
So basically: having been told by several knowledgeable people that it wouldn't work, you did it anyway and it failed shortly afterwards.
I used two tubes of the highest quality steel reinforced putty I could find.
<snip>
I've ridden it for almost 2 weeks every day for at least 2 miles, with some caution but not extreme caution.
It's just now starting to crack.
Epoxy putty is not all the same, and entirely depends on how it's used.
<snip>
I've ridden it for almost 2 weeks every day for at least 2 miles, with some caution but not extreme caution.
It's just now starting to crack.
Epoxy putty is not all the same, and entirely depends on how it's used.
Last edited by Mark Kelly; 09-14-12 at 03:20 AM.
09-13-12, 10:55 PM
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So your clever repair lasted for about 30 miles of gentle riding. Hardly sounds like a repair, not even an emergency one. Sounds like you fixed your frame about as well as a roll of duct tape would have done.
When folks here tried to help you, they were probably assuming you wanted an actual repair, not a duct tape level of kludge.
When folks here tried to help you, they were probably assuming you wanted an actual repair, not a duct tape level of kludge.
Don't insult duct tape! How dare you!!!
Duct tape has a proud tradition and history. It holds hurricanes at bay. It's on the winner's podium at NASCAR. It keeps hostages compliant so terrorists can be focused and comprehensible when they present their demands on national television. It's in your attic and it's in your basement - keeping your wife and kids warm AND cool. That's a man's peace at home.
So I demand an apology right this instant. The last thing I need is duct tape on my job feeling slighted and depressed - letting me down.
=8-)
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Disclaimer:
1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
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5000+ wheels built since 1984...
Disclaimer:
1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
4. I will provide information as I always have to others that I believe will help them protect themselves from unscrupulous mechanics.
5. My all time favorite book is:
Kahane, Howard. Logic and Contemporary Rhetoric: The Use of Reason in Everyday Life
09-13-12, 10:55 PM
#28
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If you put an engine on the bike I doubt Giant will want to warranty the frame.
Now if by engine you mean motor.... Take it to a Giant dealer and they will get the frame covered as long as you did not do something obviously wrong with it (like hit it with a car)
Now if by engine you mean motor.... Take it to a Giant dealer and they will get the frame covered as long as you did not do something obviously wrong with it (like hit it with a car)
09-13-12, 10:57 PM
#29
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The words strictly temporary mean absolutely nothing, do they?
I used two tubes of the highest quality steel reinforced putty I could find.
I STRICTLY TEMPORARILY reinforced the break using one tube, layering a few steel mesh patches over it, then using the other tube over the patches. I added a few touches to reinforce it, all of which you holier than thou bicycle enthusiasts would probably make fun of.
I've ridden it for almost 2 weeks every day for at least 2 miles, with some caution but not extreme caution.
It's just now starting to crack.
I used two tubes of the highest quality steel reinforced putty I could find.
I STRICTLY TEMPORARILY reinforced the break using one tube, layering a few steel mesh patches over it, then using the other tube over the patches. I added a few touches to reinforce it, all of which you holier than thou bicycle enthusiasts would probably make fun of.
I've ridden it for almost 2 weeks every day for at least 2 miles, with some caution but not extreme caution.
It's just now starting to crack.
09-13-12, 11:01 PM
#30
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Oh and you never mentioned the warranty being void in the original post. Are you just assuming it is void because the bike is no longer made? Having worked at a Giant dealer as a mechanic I can assure you they will find something comparable to replace the bike with. If it is because you did something out of the ordinary to the frame that is a different case.
09-13-12, 11:03 PM
#31
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Also, DO NOT TRUST THIS FRAME EVER AGAIN. EVER. AGAIN. NEVER. EVER. DO NOT EVER USE THIS FRAME TO TRAVEL EVEN 10 FEET.
Having the downtube detached put extra stress on the top tube, so even though your "repair" has lasted 30mi, the cracking shows that the aluminum joint has bent. Bent aluminum is seriously weak. Toss the frame and be glad your stupidity hasn't killed you yet.
Having the downtube detached put extra stress on the top tube, so even though your "repair" has lasted 30mi, the cracking shows that the aluminum joint has bent. Bent aluminum is seriously weak. Toss the frame and be glad your stupidity hasn't killed you yet.
09-14-12, 04:12 AM
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Oh and you never mentioned the warranty being void in the original post. Are you just assuming it is void because the bike is no longer made? Having worked at a Giant dealer as a mechanic I can assure you they will find something comparable to replace the bike with. If it is because you did something out of the ordinary to the frame that is a different case.
09-14-12, 07:24 AM
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You holier than thou bicycle enthusiasts have lost another valuable elcitric-bicycle-rider with your 'honest practical advice.'
09-14-12, 07:26 AM
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THe OPs attitude was pretty interesting. I hope he eventually does stop riding that frame as it is a serious accident waiting to happen.
09-14-12, 07:42 AM
#35
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Would you rather that someone tell him to do the repair, spray paint it and put it on Craigslist?
09-14-12, 07:46 AM
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You're kidding, right? I didn't see any cautionary advice here that he wouldn't have gotten from a dealer as well. It was all pretty much an attempt to save an accident. Electric bikes tend to be heavier and be driven faster than the average city bike. Yeah - there's a built in speed limiter, but more than half the ebikes I service have been crashed because the rider misjudged their speed coming into a corner. Some things aren't worth taking a chance with - a broken frame on an ebike is one of them.
Would you rather that someone tell him to do the repair, spray paint it and put it on Craigslist?
Would you rather that someone tell him to do the repair, spray paint it and put it on Craigslist?
I agree with one thing the OP said: this is the worst I have ever seen. We may disagree on what 'this' is, though.
09-14-12, 07:49 AM
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Your bike frame is essentially a beam, supported at the headtube and rear dropouts. The way the stresses work with a beam supported at both ends is fairly simple: the bottom of the beam is under tension (being pulled), and the top of the beam is under compression (being squashed). In a bike frame, this applies in such a way that the downtube is under tension, while the top tube is under compression. For all intents and purposes, we may now assume that your epoxy joint has no tensile strength since it's cracked, or that it's now got such low stiffness that it might as well have no tensile strength. Either way, you've basically got no downtube. Now, the beam isn't the whole frame, it's your top tube (at least for the front section of the frame). Your top tube is being loaded in compression along its half, and also in tension at its bottom half. It was never designed for that kind of loading. How long do you think it will last before it fails? For your information, it will probably fail at or near the seat tube joint when it does. Your frame will break completely in half.
This has already been said implicitly, but you seem reluctant to accept it.
Don't ride the bike.
09-14-12, 09:40 AM
#38
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Failure of your repair is not the issue. Consider the following.
Your bike frame is essentially a beam, supported at the headtube and rear dropouts. The way the stresses work with a beam supported at both ends is fairly simple: the bottom of the beam is under tension (being pulled), and the top of the beam is under compression (being squashed). In a bike frame, this applies in such a way that the downtube is under tension, while the top tube is under compression. For all intents and purposes, we may now assume that your epoxy joint has no tensile strength since it's cracked, or that it's now got such low stiffness that it might as well have no tensile strength. Either way, you've basically got no downtube. Now, the beam isn't the whole frame, it's your top tube (at least for the front section of the frame). Your top tube is being loaded in compression along its half, and also in tension at its bottom half. It was never designed for that kind of loading. How long do you think it will last before it fails? For your information, it will probably fail at or near the seat tube joint when it does. Your frame will break completely in half.
Your bike frame is essentially a beam, supported at the headtube and rear dropouts. The way the stresses work with a beam supported at both ends is fairly simple: the bottom of the beam is under tension (being pulled), and the top of the beam is under compression (being squashed). In a bike frame, this applies in such a way that the downtube is under tension, while the top tube is under compression. For all intents and purposes, we may now assume that your epoxy joint has no tensile strength since it's cracked, or that it's now got such low stiffness that it might as well have no tensile strength. Either way, you've basically got no downtube. Now, the beam isn't the whole frame, it's your top tube (at least for the front section of the frame). Your top tube is being loaded in compression along its half, and also in tension at its bottom half. It was never designed for that kind of loading. How long do you think it will last before it fails? For your information, it will probably fail at or near the seat tube joint when it does. Your frame will break completely in half.
Very good analysis.
09-14-12, 10:24 AM
#39
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Also, I would like to say that I'm using the JB Weld PUTTY not the glue. It is STEEL REINFORCED not just "glue and filler". Has anyone used anything other than "JB Weld" glue? This putty is used to repair American vehicles. I've seen it used to reinforce frames many times. I've seen epoxy resins used to BUILD BICYCLE FRAMES. People who build bamboo frames use epoxy putties and resins. Even companies such as Stalk bicycles use an epoxy system to build their bamboo frames.
This is an aluminum frame, so I understand that it isn't the safest method. This is for a strictly temporary fix, until I either replace the frame or have it welded. The break is not in a very dangerous spot as far as my safety goes, just the safety of the cords that run into my engine.
This is an aluminum frame, so I understand that it isn't the safest method. This is for a strictly temporary fix, until I either replace the frame or have it welded. The break is not in a very dangerous spot as far as my safety goes, just the safety of the cords that run into my engine.
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09-14-12, 10:29 AM
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Whoa there fella!
Don't insult duct tape! How dare you!!!
Duct tape has a proud tradition and history. It holds hurricanes at bay. It's on the winner's podium at NASCAR. It keeps hostages compliant so terrorists can be focused and comprehensible when they present their demands on national television. It's in your attic and it's in your basement - keeping your wife and kids warm AND cool. That's a man's peace at home.
So I demand an apology right this instant. The last thing I need is duct tape on my job feeling slighted and depressed - letting me down.
=8-)
Don't insult duct tape! How dare you!!!
Duct tape has a proud tradition and history. It holds hurricanes at bay. It's on the winner's podium at NASCAR. It keeps hostages compliant so terrorists can be focused and comprehensible when they present their demands on national television. It's in your attic and it's in your basement - keeping your wife and kids warm AND cool. That's a man's peace at home.
So I demand an apology right this instant. The last thing I need is duct tape on my job feeling slighted and depressed - letting me down.
=8-)
I bet a duct tape repair of the OP's original break would have lasted longer than the epoxy one..............
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09-14-12, 11:26 AM
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OP will now have lots of fun cleaning off two tubes plus mesh of hardened JB Weld, if he still plans to follow the Giant dealer route, which chriskmurray suggests is/(was) a viable option.
09-14-12, 11:58 AM
#42
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I've ridden it for almost 2 weeks every day for at least 2 miles, with some caution but not extreme caution.
It's just now starting to crack.
It's just now starting to crack.
Two whole packs of metal powder filled epoxy putty and some metal screen patches and you got a whole 28 miles of riding like Miss Daisy. Then you come back with a "Ha, so there you holier than thou bicycle elitists" when exactly what we told you would happen, happened.BTW, discontinued doesn't mean the warranty is automatically void. Did you ever bother to look up the original manufacturers warranty or call Giant? Maybe the product is discontinued because it was recalled for problems with the frame cracking?
From Giant USA's website:
Giant Bicycle, Inc. ("Giant") warrants the frame and rigid fork of each new Giant brand bicycle and Giant brand frameset to be free from defects in material and workmanship for as long as the original purchaser owns the bicycle.
09-14-12, 12:11 PM
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The OP's attitude makes me laugh and I kinda hope he has screwed himself out of the warranty by trying his reta... mentally-challenged repair. But if he does get a satisfactory resolution to his problem, I guess that would make me happy, too.
09-14-12, 12:12 PM
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OP, if you're not here for advice, what are you here for? To berate the userbase of bikeforums.net?
Is this some bizarre JB Weld marketing program?
Is this some bizarre JB Weld marketing program?
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09-14-12, 12:20 PM
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09-14-12, 12:31 PM
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This thread reminds me of a physics-challenged friend who snapped a snow-ski in half, then went from ski-shop to ski-shop, trying to find a ski mechanic who would glue the two halves back together for him.
Him: "They just want to sell me new skis."
Me: "Uh...correct; That is because you need new skis."
Him: "They just want to sell me new skis."
Me: "Uh...correct; That is because you need new skis."
09-14-12, 12:45 PM
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Duct tape is no longer the universal end-all in the temporary repair world. Zip ties are making quite a dent in the field and I'm surprised no one suggested using all three elements for the suggested repair. Would it be possible to use zip ties to hold duct tape over the JB Weld?
09-14-12, 01:11 PM
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(in case in anyone missed it)Frame is fornicated. Frames do not respond well to halfassed attempts at repair. Few frame are worth fixing as opposed to replacing. If you feel the need to repair a frame with a tube o' glue, please video the results and post here for others to enjoy.