I have a mid 80s Zebra touring bike, currently running Shimano Thunderbird/Eagle derailleurs and 333 down tube shifters.

1. I am replacing the downtube shifters with Sunline bar mounted friction thumb shifters.

2. I have a spare Shimano Deore LX triple crankset/bb with 50/38/26 chainrings to replace the original cottered 52/40 double crankset, will the existing Eagle FD work until I can find a suitable replacement? when it comes time to replace should i get a Deore LX/Xt or try to find a Vintage 600 triple FD? keeping in mind the Sunline thumbies.

3. I am planning on keeping the 27" wheels as i have purchased a new 27" wheelset and Conti Gatorhardshells. I also had purchased a new 14-28 5 speed freewheel. when it comes time to upgrade the RD should I get a matching LX/XT or again try to find a vintage 600 or something like it? again keeping the thumbies.

4. last question...i have a new 5 speed SRAM chain, should i keep this or look into a newer, narrower chain? i have a spare 9 speed wippermann lying around but upon searching the internet i hear that it will not last very long on a 5 speed/friction set up.

thanks in advance!

I don't have your answers, but looking at the chainline, rear axle spacing and FD on my vintage Japanese bike I suspect you are going to have problems swapping in more modern components.

But I was intrigued you said it's a '80s bike...? With cottered cranks, Shimano 333 and Thunderbird FD I think you are talking '70s components, perhaps early '70s. I'd guess your '80s Zebra might be an early '70s Zebrakenko. Anyway, I would leave it as is, put my upgrade money into a more modern speced bike.

I've commuted on an early '70s Japanese 10 speed with with the original hubs, 333 drivetrain and brakes for years - it's been a perfect daily rider.

thanks, i may be wrong with the year of the bike. im just going on what i was told by others. the headbadge wasnt recognizable and theres no info on a "zebra" 10 speed except references to zebrakenko but non of them are clear.

as far as issues, could you elaborate?

im tinkering with this because i already have a carbon framed bike with a custom build cassette/compact crankset combo and a retro italian with a sti/custom cassette. i wanted to make this heavy bike more climbing friendly, expecially with the panniers full. as long as the thunderbird/eagle derailleurs can work with the triple conversion then it will get me up the hills i need to just to get home. theres a bunch of vintage parts floating around ebay still so i could get nicer condition replacements when i get to the point of restoration.

You've picked a very poor candidate for upgrade. That would indeed be a 70's bike, and a very low quality one - not "vintage." The FD is very unlikely to work with a triple. No idea on the travel of the t-shifters, thus on whether compatible. Rear derailleur quality not that important with a five speed, but you need triple/large cog capable. I'd normally suggest a completely different bike or frame, but you've already purchased based on that one.

Time for a dose of reality.

`Anyone posting answers on this forum should know that these friction thumb shifters will have enough "travel" to pull off a 3x5 set-up. If there's too much travel, the rd's limit screws will take care of that "issue". There are no valid worries re: the cheap friction shifters with a 3x5, and the OP's concerns about whether these would work with older LX/XT or Ultegra derailers are unnecessary; they will work with any of those.

-As the OP has already guessed the current derailers will not have the capacity for a triple ring set-up. Get a triple FD designed for max rings of 50t or more(road or early MTB, then), and a RD designed for a triple (in Shimano-speak, gs "midcage" will suffice if you stay with the 14-28 freewheel---sgs "long-cage" if you go with a bigger cluster.)

-My concern with the new wheelset is mostly to do with rear spacing; your bike is likely spaced at 120mm; what is the new rear hub spaced at?

-As for the chain, I' suggest getting a new, cheap, 6/7/8speed chain and cutting it to fit your application perfectly. If your 5speed sram chain is long enough, you could use that....

Reminder: the OP is asking about strategies for converting his bike to a triple with friction thumb shifters; at no point did deuce ask if this bike is worthy of upgrading. The fact that folks here try to dissuade the OP from upgrading his (her?) bike due to its age and original msrp is rude. To suggest that it might not be modern enough for a 3x5 (!!!!Seriously? seriously???) or that the thumbies can't pull a 5 speed cluster is just daft.

Let's think before we post. And, the conventional "wisdom" of not upgrading or modifying inexpensive bikes need not come unless relevant (eg, the OP asks if the upgrades are worthwhile.) If you've gotta stray off-topic, you might as well be polite about it...

A reminder:

Agree

Here I don't agree because a lot of posters are quite naïve about the value of their bike and what it will take in both money and expertise to upgrade/update it. Yes, we can sometimes be pretty blunt as to how we phrase our concerns but the "dose of reality" is often needed.

Just do it! My general philosophy for projects like this is: If I already own parts, I'll bolt them up and see if I can make them work.

1. Those friction thumb shifters will make almost any derailleur work. It may not shift as slickly as a modern system with all matching parts, and you'll have to fish around for the sweet spot where you get no derailleur rub, but it'll work. All those matching parts issues only came up with the advent of index shifting.

2. Somebody brought up the chain slack with a triple crankset issue. In real life that's all but non-issue. Most riders only use the granny chainring with the largest 2 or 3 rear cogs. If that's you, the chain slack issue won't come up while you're riding. Problem solved.

I think that tinkering with a cheap old bike like this is an excellent opportunity to learn about how bikes work. If (when) you make a mistake, think of it as tuition in the school of bicycle mechanics.

Why? In this case, the OP already has the bike, the triple crank, the replacement wheels, the cheap friction shifter, a couple chains to choose from (and chains are consumables anyway, regardless of which bike)... all s/he needs are some triple-compat derailers, which can be had for less than it costs for me to fill my gastank. The OP isn't about "should I put SRAM Force on my 70s-era Zebrakenko"... it was about "how can I finish up this low-buck triple conversion". Fact is, we're talkin' about a person who wants to put a modest amount of money into a bike that s/he already rides and apparently enjoys.

My "reality check" was towards those who suggest that, b/c the bike is not very valuable, somehow the thumbies won't shift and the mid-80s mtb triple won't fit the frame.

The guy who wants to put some $10 shifters, a take-off crank, and $25 worth of used derailers on his old touring rig does not, imo, require a reality check at all.

Hehe, I can find lots of nearly new bikes for what it costs to fill most gas tanks these days!

Yes, you are absolutely right in this particular case. The OP isn't trying to make a silk purse out of his bike.

When it comes time to upgrade the RD I wouldn't even go as high as LX/XT unless I got a screaming deal on it. Alivio or Altus (even Tourney)would certainly be a fully functional upgrade from the TBird/Eagle and at lower cost.

Used LX rear derailers can be had for peanuts. That being said, almost any RD with enough capacity will do. (And, yes, a short cage will do as well if you're conscientious about gear combos, but I've always felt that one ought to set up a bike in such a way that, should you lend it to some sort of dunce, the RD won't tear off when they try to shift to big/big, and the chain won't drag the ground when they try to shift small/small....)

Reality Indeed

Re: t-shifters - My error, it was early in the a.m. and mind briefly disconnected between thumb shifter and 5 speed - was thinking at the moment he was considering upgrading to more speeds and therefore a wider cluster. Some derailleur/thumb shifters don't play well together, and in any case I simply said I could not offer an opinion.

As for "dissuading," I merely posted my opinion, and recognized he was already fairly committed to a path. As per my signature I try not to tell people what they "should" do. I don't see that I or anyone else suggested it is not modern enough for a 3x5. Methinks someone is reading in a bit too much.

My vintage tourer, vintage because it worked and I saw little reason to upgrade, short of a whole different bike..

13-34t 7 speed , freewheel on a hub with an axle that doesn't bend or break*,

and a 110-74 crank with 50,40,24t chainrings .

*Phil Wood then Bullseye..

Friction bar end shifters.. cantilever brakes, drop bars ..


whole bike change > Rohloff Hub in A Koga Miyata WTR, fully equipped as a tourer,
when it left the assembly shop in NL. (Trekking bars and the Grip shifter..)

Not to pull that police baton from your hand; I think it is valuable to offer a little 'voice of experience' to those jumping into projects like this one. Those of us that have re built old bikes have opinions about whether we regard the effort as time and money well spent. Hearing posters opine that it may be wise to 'think again' is certainly relevant whether you wish to read it or not. As I read it, there is one rude and inappropriate post in this thread, guess who..

IF you have a claw type RDER, about the only new replacement you can find is a Shimano Tourney.

Haha, good one... I'm not the one who told the op his bike isn't worth $30 and some effort. This isn't a rebuild, it's a cheap and straightforward modification to a bike that the OP already uses. Telling the OP it's not "worthwhile" answers a question that wasn't asked, and it happens frequently on here.

There's no accounting for taste; investments in bikes intended as "riders" rarely make a return-on-investment in terms of market value, but tossing a few bucks at making that bike a triple is something that the OP has already decided is worth his time/money/effort. I happen to agree, although that question wasn't asked, either.

Actually, nobody did - and it's a bit rude to keep implying things that others did not say in order to make a point.

Not entirely true. You can buy a claw adapter and use any direct mount derailleur you choose: https://harriscyclery.net/product/var...r-claw-963.htm

The description of the part hardly inspires confidence.

I had an early 70's Takara 10 speed with Suntour. The screw hole location didn't match the Shimano claw mount, so I had to drill a new one or else file away a lot of the claw "opening".
The bike now has the Tourney RDER, friction shifting a 9 speed cassette.

+1 on answering unasked questions. Newbies presumably come here to get an experienced opinion. I would have no problem being told my plan is a little weird (happens more than I'd care to admit). If you don't like the opinion, don't go with it.

thanks guys for the opinions, even the somewhat negatvie ones.

a little background, i have mostly experience with newer road bikes, no mountain bike experience, and almost no older bike experience. i am confident on my mechanical ability to get the project complete, what i need is a little direction so to narrow my search and need to purchase/experiment/purchase/experiment.

referring to some of the posted questions:

the frame and new wheelset are 126mm, anyone know if i have to redish if i move to 6/7speed? the cog selection is better with the 6/7 speed freewheels.

older mountain fd's have a 50t+ capacity? thats nice to know, if so, then i dont need to drop the large chainring size down the line

as far as fd/rd goes, as i search i will look for the largest capacity i can find and then get the largest cog freewheel i can find, to make life easy with loads. the bike does have a claw type rd now, i have no issue using a tourney if it has the capacity. i will take a look into the adapter claw option, i have heard they made adjustments difficult for some though.

the money issue isnt and issue although i would like to keep this one on a lower tier, just buying used parts and using up take offs and spares. this one is just a "for fun" project, mostly used for groceries, bike camping, errands, etc, keeping in mind that i have to ride this 30lb tank uphill to get home. main concern would be making it reliable, making it pretty would be way way down the line. my other bikes have 50/34-13/30 on a carbon frame and 53/39-14/30 on a italian steel frame but are a million times lighter, this the desire for a extra low granny on this one.

thanks again.

I wouldn't sweat it that much, the part is specifically for this application. I've used old claws from suntour derailleurs with shimano derailleurs and it worked fine. The Tourney derailleur is an option, but there are other options.

If someone is like "I have this bike, and some different shifters, and a triple crank, and some replacement wheels that I wanna install... what kinda cheap stuff can I use to make it work?" and ppl are like "no, don't not worth it", I think the implication is clear, to the point where it barely qualifies as being merely implied....

From this thread:
An unsolicited negative opinion of the bike in question

Another opinion, again negative, and also unsolicited... coupled with a boldface falsehood... whatever the level of quality is, that bike certainly is vintage.

Hypothetically speaking, if you cam on here and said your wheelset for your Navara was toast, and you needed a new one, you might be taken aback if someone responded with "scrap the Novara and buy a bike worthy of a new wheelset." Obviously, you wouldn't likely need advice on your Novara's wheels, nor would you likely see that response if you did post that... but, surely, you could see how such a response might be insensitive, rude, or just plain mean-spirited, right?

(sigh)
No, not "like" at all. Neither I nor the previous poster said "don't." It's the difference between giving an opinion and giving commands.

vs. a solicited negative opinion? (joking) Seriously, I have enough respect for people who ask for advice to assume that they can use their own judgement in deciding how to value opinions. Thus I give my opinions honestly and straightforward, without couching them. When I go too far I acknowledge doing so.

Yes, it's my informed, experienced opinion that the bike is low quality in comparison to most other bikes available, even in that time frame, during which thousands of bikes passed through my hands. In my opinion the term vintage is useless if it applies to anything that is older than a certain year. Opinions based on ones own values are neither true nor false.

No, actually I would not. If the poster offered useful advice as well my response would be to ask why the poster felt the bike was not "worthy."

If honest disagreement or frank opinions disturb you I can assure you that one can find mostly unqualified acceptance of all projects and opinions on bicycletutor.com. In fact if one directs someone to a bike shop as the best option, or questions in any way the practicality of a project an email from a moderator may be received that the post is "not in the spirit of the forum." I received one such email after I advised (correctly) that the advice given by another poster was both incorrect and potentionally dangerous.

Heya, I've converted plenty of bikes at the local co-op along similar lines to what you are doing right now. Shimano made tons of bottom-pull triple front derailleurs for mountain bikes and hybrids through the 80s and 90s. They still make a few today, the Claris triple FD should work for you and is only around 25$... pretty decent. A co-op should have something in their FD bin that would work as well... and even something like this DNP could work if you're looking to save money. Front derailleurs are still basically just chain pushers and very forgiving when they aren't being asked to index with a shifter.

Since your new wheelset is 126mm I'd bet it's made for a 6/7 speed freewheel and would just have the frame re-spaced (or cold-set). It's not terribly hard to do yourself if you're able-bodied... since your frame isn't made of heat treated ultra-thin tubing it's an ideal candidate for this.

I'd also suggest using a shimano tourney with a claw adapter, they're also pretty low-cost and reliable enough if they don't get abused. They're also made to be compatible with shimano's "mega range" or whatever they call the 14-34 freewheels they sell, which would give you some low gears for climbing. If you decide to use a different freewheel with tighter gear spacing then you can opt for a claw-adapter and use whatever rear derailleur you'd like.

Since you're putting on a new freewheel and a new(ish?) crank, I'd really spend the 10$ and put a brand new 7 speed chain on.