due ruote 

Cross posting this from the Mechanics SF; maybe someone here knows the answer.

Am I correct that if I want to mount Campy NR levers on Silver bar-end pods, they need to be levers meant for dt braze-ons, and not the ones from a clamp-on unit?

The product description is a bit ambiguous - it seems to imply they need to be braze-on levers, but then it says "Campy dt shifters from the 1970's, no problem". That is in fact what my banded shifters are.

Michael Angelo 

Yes, DT shifters would work just fine on Silver Bar end pods. Index Campagnolo Shifter would not.

daf1009

I believe that braze on ones are simpler to use on these pods...but...I think you can remove the levers themselves from a clamp on unit...and they are basically the same...I think...although others more knowledgeable than I will certainly weigh in here...

SJX426 

I dont' think the basic levers are different between clamp on and braze on sets.

Sir_Name 

If memory serves, the difference between the clamp on and braze on assemblies is in the washers, not the levers. The clamp incorporates a washer (or spacer) that is a separate piece for the braze on assembly. I think.....

rootboy 

Won't the standard Campy levers be a tad long? A pair of levers from the Campy barends would be nice to have, eh?
But those can't be common. I think I have only one.

due ruote 

Thanks for the replies.

The issue I'm wondering about is the washers. I don't own any levers for braze-ons, but the clamp-on ones I have only contain a couple washers. The exploded photos I see online for the braze-on ones have many bits that mine don't have.

Rootboy, it's true that the levers would be longer than the old Campy bar ends, or Suntour for that matter. But I don't think significantly longer than the new Silver ones, or Simplex. These pods are in fact made for mounting dt shifter levers, so it can't be that uncommon.

I'm kind of on the fence on these anyway. My Campy levers are drilled out and pretty, but they are prone to slippage. I'm also a fan of bar-ends, and I wouldn't mind having another inch on the drops. I might just go ahead and use some Suntour barcons I have, although this is on my Team Champion which is all Campy. But I already put some Noodle bars on it, so maybe I should just keep sliding down the slope. My main concern is riding the bike, after all.

rootboy 

Darned good concern. This sentence in their description leaves me scratching my head;

"So, get these pods here only if you have down tube shifters that mount onto brazed-on shifter bosses without special spacers specific to that particular model shifter."

Seems to me you'd need the "specific" washers supplied with Campy braze-on mount shifters…wasn't in nylon?… to keep the lever centered on the boss on these. Levers from clamp on shifters wouldn't work without that spacer.

rootboy 

I'll look but I don't think I have any of these nylon spacer/washers. Never had a braze on lever bike.
But someone here may have some.

icepick_trotsky 

Never?! That's impressive.

rootboy 

No. But that's only because I only have 4 bikes.
And I'm fond of the ones from before braze-ons existed, AFAIK.

JohnDThompson 

The main difference is that the stop-plates (parts 611/2 and 600/2) are separate pieces in the braze-on version, but permanently attached to the mounting band on the clamp version:



The OP may need to source the stop plates separately (those from other manufacturer's braze-on levers often swap in easily, e.g. Zeus, Ofmega, SunTour, etc.), or destructively remove the ones from his clamp-on shifters.

JohnDThompson 

Good point. I think the OP would also need a pair of the 0190/4 and 190/6 washers.

If it were me, I'd use a set of Simplex retrofriction levers instead, or those ratcheting "Silver" levers from Rivendell:

Sir_Name 

Looks like the 'pods' linked in the original post include a spacer that acts as those stop plates, no? Tough to tell exactly what's needed w/o measurements.

Not quite sure what to make of this, but think it has more to do with lever assemblies that do not include washers, etc as part of the assembly:
"If the shifter mounts onto a steel frame using just that round spacer with the square hole and the bent foot-stop, the aluminum one that virtually all pre-indexed, brazed-on style downtube shifter used, then ok."

due ruote 

Thanks everyone for the valuable input. I just came to the same conclusion after removing my shifters and comparing the guts to pics of the braze-on variety. I would need to source the nylon washer that goes between the shift lever and the braze-on. Perhaps the ghost shifting I've been experiencing with these levers would go away with the nylon washer in place; I don't know. In the end I might just have the same imperfectly functioning but "correct" shifters in a new location.

On balance, I think I will just try the Suntour barcons I already have. They are a little chunky but they work well, and don't require any shopping.

[edit] Just to make this clearer in case someone else has the same question, here are a couple pics. As far as I can tell, to make this work I would need the two sets of parts at bottom right in the first pic. The stop would replace the gold colored washer that comes with the pods in the last pic. The nylon washers would go between the pod and the levers. I am assuming the outside washers from my banded levers would work without alteration/modification/addition of parts.

The simplest thing would probably be to buy a set of levers for braze-ons, rather than attempt to source the individual parts. They don't seem to be terribly expensive on Ebay.

rootboy 

Due Ruote. No, you couldn't fit that nylon washer into your band mount shifters, which have that circular metal plate just outside the "stop plate, which the inboard side bore of the shift lever rides on. If that makes sense. The nylon washer in the braze on variety took the place of that metal piece in the band/clamp on shifters.

If you are experiencing ghost shifting with your set, I would think new spring washers might be in order, if you can find them. Part number 174 in the above diagram.

due ruote 

You misunderstood my post. I meant that the nylon washer would be used with the bar-end pods, not with my dt band.

You might be right about the ghost shifting. I took the shifters apart, wiped everything clean, and put some beeswax on the parts before re-assembling. That seemed to help, but didn't fix it entirely.

rootboy 

Or…try this; If you turn the "friction adjusting wing nut" down all the way tight, can you still move the levers? If so, the inside of the bore on the lever may be worn to the point that the wing nut clamping assembly can't do its job. Perhaps a very thin washer placed inside the bore might help tighten things up. Like a brake caliper thin washer. But new 174 spring washers might help too.

Or, maybe try a little less lube in the assembly? Just tossing out thoughts here…

rootboy 

Ah. I see. Given this sentence, it was sort of easy to misunderstand;
"Perhaps the ghost shifting I've been experiencing with these levers would go away with the nylon washer in place;"

I don't believe your ghost shifting problem would transfer over to the pods. It's in your current assembly somehow.
Unless, of course, the inside bore on the inboard side of your levers is worn to the paint that they can't be tightened up against the washer and assembly. That's a possibility.

rootboy 

However, given the somewhat "infinite" adjustment, tightening, the thumb screws are capable of…if the levers don't move when the bike "ghost shifts" , the problem is probably "down stream" from the levers. Cable, etc. Just 2 cents, FWIW.

due ruote 

Thanks rootboy, and sorry about the lack of clarity.

Your suggestions are good ones and I could probably sort out the ghost shifting thing with a little persistence, but I think I'll try the barends anyway. I have them on a couple bikes and like them, and the little extension they provide will make the drops a bit more comfortable.

I'll post a picture on the classic rides thread when I'm done so the purists can scorn me.

rootboy 

Great, D.R., but…do you have the little nylon washers? or, a work around?

Grand Bois

My 1959 Carlton had braze-ons for Cyclo shifters. I thought they came later, too.

due ruote 

No, the work around is to use my Suntour shifters.

If I decide later that I must have Campy, I'll just buy the pods and a set of braze-on shifters from Ebay. They seem to be plentiful and not too spendy.

JohnDThompson 

I suspect you'll be happy with the SunTour bar-ends. Campagnolo's friction shifters were always (IMHO) one of their more mediocre products. I've swapped them out for Simplex retrofriction levers on my bikes.