Hi guys,
I'm hoping that someone far more knowledgeable about Colnago frames than me can help identify and date the frame that I bought this weekend. I believe that it is a 82ish Nuovo Mexico as it has a crimped down and top tube and obviously has the Mexico decal on the chain stay but what is throwing me off is the fact that there are 3 cable guides on the top tube which I have only seen on older Mexico models.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Chris

My guess is that your frame is a Nuovo Mexico Profil and I would also guess a 1983 build date (aerodynamic fork crown). I think 'Beppe' Saronni rode a very similar frame to win the 1982 World Champoinship.

I wonder if the 3 cable guides were a 'special order'? The two outer guides look wider spaced than you might see on a 2 cable guide bike giving more room for the middle guide. Or, perhaps the guides were added when the frame was re-finished some time in the past? I'm putting my money on a special build though.

Thanks a lot Gary!

Would I like to have this frame?

You betcha!

Are you planning on doing a build with that gorgeous frame? If so, what are you planning on using as far as components, wheels, etc. already has a nice looking stem and seat post in place, but I can't tell much about those. What is the scoop on this frame, as nice as it looks it would be neat to follow your build.

Bill

I believe it is newer than '83 as '83 had flat stay caps:
[IMG]P1000502, on Flickr[/IMG]

At least the cable guides are the same as were used in that era by Colnago.

BB cable guide configuration is different also:
[IMG]P1000536, on Flickr[/IMG]

Check this site out: https://www.velo-retro.com/colnagotline.html

Hi Bill,
Yes I am as this one is for my personal enjoyment and will get used on the few dry days that we get in Belgium over the summer! I plan on building it up reasonably authentically, I'm not going to go chasing pat years but will put a period full super record group on it and I have some Ambrosio NOS wheels already that will be taken away from another project . The campy headset is in good shape and stem and bars are 3T so they're all good to go. The seat post isn't original and is super long so I will probably replace that with a shorter super record one if I can find one at a reasonable cost although that won't be a priority obviously. It would be a pleasure to post pics of it all coming together!
Thanks
Chris

[MENTION=435524]chrismbrewer[/MENTION] - BTW Welcome to C&V. You are likely to thoroughly enjoy that frame set! Mine did not have all the Campy parts it should have. Over time I collected the missing pieces to get it to where it is today. Have fun with the build and keep us informed with pics etc. as you go.
[MENTION=168558]Drillium Dude[/MENTION] may be able to shed some light on this frame set as well. He has a Super he purchased in the UK several years ago and is quite knowledgeable. Here is an excuse to post a pic of my Superissimo!

[IMG]1983 Colnago Superissimo by Patrick Boulden, on Flickr[/IMG]

Welcome to The Club!

And to the forums.

OP's bike looks genuine and thinking 1983. Though, got me on the three vs. two cable guides. Would like to see more detailed pics. Dig the Zeus pinch bolt.


(Admit longtime admirer but no expert or of confirming some date of production. Though I've learned anything goes with the older Colnago's + the numerous copies out there adding confusion. I had one built in 1983, paint was pearl white, chrome stay's and fork -later stolen. Fit and ride was perfect and even though long gone, that fit is unforgettable. Funny to describe that way, but its the only bike that has done this.


Now have a '79 Super in the same color as SJX426 above, yet at first incorrectly dated the year. It is sort of fun figuring the clues but in the end, doesn't matter. Long as that one fits, its golden.)

OP's bike does not have a tube connecting the chainstays. The shape of this tube (barrel or spool) is a distinguishing factor when dating Supers. Maybe Mexicos did not have these?

They did not have CS bridges. It is often a feature overlooked when naming a model.
[MENTION=350383]crank_addict[/MENTION] said it well, it is nearly impossible to date these things with the variations not only from Colnago but by PO's. And finding a fit is everything along with geometry yielding the ride you want!

My Mexico doesn't have anything shoring up the stays, either. It's in almost the exact configuration as the OP's, just a different finish (mine has more chrome) and of course there are only two top tube brake cable guides.

I'm going to say this is 1983 or older. Probably repainted, definitely new decals (I've seen this set a lot in recent years, very distinctive in the way the font of the "Cs" in particular is glaringly off). Could easily have had rust issues with the top tube guides and these were replaced at the time of the repaint.

@SJX426: I believe during this time frame either flat or concave seatstay caps might have been used. Using up the old, phasing in the new, as it were.

Here's the best pic I have illustrating the lack of a chainstay bridge on my '83 Mexico:



DD

OP, can we see a couple pics of the driveside rear dropout? This pic you provided suggests something is going on there:



DD

Thanks everyone for all of the input.
@Drillium Dude you are spot on, I hadn't spotted it before the drive side drop out has been replaced (& not particularly sympathetically), here are some pics of drive and non drive side.
Why would you replace it and what do you recommend?
Cheers
Chris

It is interesting that the DO was replaced with one to accommodate the Portacatena part that were actually installed. See the second picture. That may be the reason why it was replaced. Speculation only. So is the rework brazed or welded? The third picture shows a void.

In anycase, it may well be a repaint explaining the third cable guide, as suggested. Personally, I think three are needed. The cable housing on mine does not line up straight on the tube but bows to the right.

[MENTION=124730]SJX426[/MENTION] thanks for the info, I had not heard of the Portacatena system before but after a quick google, it seems like a pretty innovative idea that I'm surprised didn't catch on.
I'm sorry but my knowledge of welding, brazing, soldering etc is practically not existent and i can't tell if the re-work is brazed or welded with the paint on. To my untrained eye, the just work looks "shoddy" and spoils the lines of the chain stay. Is it something I should think about having re-worked (if possible) or is it not worth it? Thanks again!!

Now that we can speculate / see what happened, I would leave as is. Further would install the Portacatena part + shifter. Whatever one thinks, I would make it a positive situation and rather is a part of the bikes storyline. A welcomed differential vs. other Nago's. Interesting and adds character.

(edit: Sorry to say the quality of work isn't tops + the painted dropout screw adjusters is really chapped stuff.)

Just to be clear, I brought up the rear DO issue because I'm always wary of repair work and it looked like something wonky was going on back there. The new pics show in great detail the repair - thanks, OP! Now, I'm not a framebuilder, but I hope one chimes in. I personally wouldn't trust that repair because it doesn't appear that enough brazing material was used. I see gaps.

At least this repair has proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the frame was repainted and any mods were most likely carried out then.

DD

@Drillium Dude brings up a good point as you do, that being that there is questionable workmanship that is hidden. Your decision but if it were my frame, I would seriously consider (great commitment huh!) stripping the paint around the DO to determine if it is welded or brazed.

If you cannot determine what it looks like, pics will help us help you. Just to help here is a normal DO/stay interface for Colnago of that time period.

[IMG]P9161252, on Flickr[/IMG]

I have not stripped a Colnago but I have stripped both a Pinarello and Trek. So here are some examples of a Brazed joint
[IMG]016_Trek Frame DS DO, on Flickr[/IMG]
[IMG]P1020842, on Flickr[/IMG]

An example of a silver solider joint on the DT cable stop braze on.
[IMG]085_PaTrek_front brake and tire saver, on Flickr[/IMG]