Is my Raleigh a Paramount?
 

I picked this bike up today off of Craigslist. Bad pictures. Called it a Raleigh USA Team. Pictures were non drive side and dark. A forum member looked close and posted it up on the eBay Craigslist thread highlighting the Chrome lugs. The decals do not match the frame. It has a Raleigh USA headbadge but the brake bridge does not match an International and the chrome socks do not match either. Came with a Campagnolo Triple , headset and seatpost. The bike looks to me like a Schwinn Paramount P 15? Serial number on left rear drop is K73123. Sorry for the bad pictures.


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What is the equipment complement aside from what you mentioned? Has Campy dropouts? How is the head badge attached? Seat post diameter? Any tubing decals?

Serial number decypher, anyone?

Tubing decals just say 4130 Chro Mo. It has a compliment of Raleigh USA decals. Campagnolo drop outs and fork ends. Dia Comp long reach calipers. Not sure how the headbadge is fastened yet? Did Raleigh USA make a Nervex chrome lugged bike with chrome socks in the 80`s? This frame does not look like a 1970`s Raleigh? I do see a spot of Opaque Blue in one of the chips. The serial number is were the Paramount Serial number is located, did Raleigh put it there as well?

Decals are newer, Seems like a respray. Looks just like the P15 I picked up a while back.

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Definite Arnie product.

Poor thing has certainly led a rough life.

Whoever did this to it should probably be prosecuted...

Hope it is your size Steve so we can follow your work with it.

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In 1973 the serial was located on the left rear dropout.

Yours would be the 123rd scheduled frame for the month of 1973 corresponding to "K" leaving out "I". (Sorry, time change has fried that part of my brain.) Determine the Manufacturing Date

Oh, and congratulations! Great score and save!

Original Campy factory triple crank, quick release seatpost binder where the "big bolt" used to be, Campy headset and chrome Nervex fancy lugs = Bingo! we have a winner. Who did this to it and where are the pitchforks?! :mad:

Excellent call on the Paramount. As an owner of a '74, everything screamed Paramount, and a P15 (like mine) at that. Crazy! I do like the color, oddly enough. The decals etc trying to dissuade others and/or the owner from thinking it is one? Is this one amazing trolling effort? I was certainly muttering WTF under my breath when looking at it. Regardless, you now have a Schwinn Paramount!! What do you want to do with it? Restore it to its rightful decals, just ride it, think on it for a while, ???

It certainly has all the hallmarks of a P15. Pull the fork and see if there is the same serial number stamped into the steering tube.

As a comparison, check my '71 P13 rear brake bridge to yours. Of course the P13 was lower and closer to the wheel, but they were built and brazed the same.

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Someone either didnt know what it was when they repainted/re-decal'd it, or simply liked Raleigh better than Schwinn, I'm guessing. Hats off to you for spotting it OP, I sure wouldnt have. Nice find for sure. Hopefuly you got it for a song?

Looked at some 1970's Paramounts this afternoon. I'd say that it's an early 70's P-15 Paramount.

Around 1972, Nervex Professional crowns like on this ersatz Raleigh had been discontinued. That's why I came up the that date.

The paint looks to be in pretty good shape, are the decals under the clear coating?

I am envious, these are the most fun types of finds...

yeah holy cow! what an awesome find! what did you pay if i may ask?

its incredible to imagine everything this bike has been through.... how did such a nice bike end up in the hands of people who obviously didn't have a clue. a lot of rough times, a lot of secrets. i think you have an obligation to take care of her now.

Poor bike, someone had an identity crisis they projected on to the bike. I’m in the “good for you” camp too.

Bill

One doesn't ask that.

Sure, one does. ;)

Lugs and fork crown match this '72 P15-9. A friend's '73 has a different crown. Pulling the fork may yield more clues, including how the headbadge is attached and whether the serial number matches.

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"I'd rather have what I don't need than need what I don't have." -Fred Sanford

"It's better to know me and not need me than to need me and not know me." -- George "King" Stahlman, bail bondsman


Nice P-15. I was sorely tempted by a green P-15 during last year's bicycle fix-up for charity project at the Del Mar Fairgrounds.* I cleaned and tuned it up, installed new brake pads and tires, and put it out on the display floor for some lucky charity recipient to receive, instead of pulling off the wheels and stashing it in the trunk of my car.


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*San Diego area BF members -- PM me if interested in volunteering this December. We collect used bicycles and clean and repair them for local needy children and adults. We usually end up with 300 to 500.

Definitely a diamond in the rough! This ought to give you something to work on during the winter. :)

So what is the plan?
At first glance, it seems like you'd want to get the rear brake cable stop (on the top tube) brazed back on. Seems like this, along with the other rust, would call for a paint job.. or a good job of touch-up painting.

How's the chrome? There's plenty of rust on that poor bike, so I'm guessing that the chrome has suffered too.

Let us know what your plans are, and how things work out! Everyone deserves a bike with shiny chromed Nervex lugs!


Steve in Peoria

[MENTION=353902]Steve Whitlatch[/MENTION] - yr size, yes? Nice grab - the possibilities intrigue the mind.

K73123 is the 123rd Paramount frameset scheduled for production during the month of October, 1973. It appears to be a P15-9.


Why the heck would anyone paint a Paramount to look like a Raleigh? :foo:

Good eye, Steve!

(And good job, "Are You Looking for One of These...?" thread!!) :thumb:

Didn't want to paint it to look like a Varsity. It's called self-respect.

Thank you all for your responses and confirmation that it is a Paramount. I remeber saying a few weeks back that the only way I could own one again is if I purchased one for someone that had no clue what it is. Well looks like that has come true. I just imagined it would be an old man who had one hanging in his garage since 1973 all covered in cob webs. :)

I stripped off the parts and found that it was indeed originally Opaque Blue. It is my size as well. This will be my most extensive project if I decide to go through with a full restoration. I have Schwinn Rando bars and the proper Weinmann Brakes that would be original to this model. I got period correct wheels as well.

The chrome lugs are perfect, crown looks great, chrome on the forks is a bit scratched but shines. The rear chrome is dull. Looks like it was hit with coarse steel wool. I used aluminum foil and WD 40 to clean it up a bit but it needs to be polished up a bit.

I used some steel wool on some rust spots and it does not seem to be deep. That is a plus. Will need a respray because, well, what good is there riding an ugly Paramount?

I am not sure how much it will cost to fix the top tube cable stop? Any rough estimates anyone?