Flange Grandi or Flange Piccole?
11-15-17, 01:50 PM
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Flange Grandi or Flange Piccole?
I'm building a new set of wheels for my 1973 DeRosa. I bought some NOS Campagnolo Epsilon tubular rims (yes, I know, they're too new). Now I just need to decide what hubs to pair them with. I've got a set of low flange NR hubs in great condition that I could use. I also have a high flange NR front hub and I could probably find a rear to match it. So I'm seeking opinions.
Which would you use and how strong would your preference be?
Which would you use and how strong would your preference be?
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11-15-17, 02:39 PM
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I'd build them to match the rims, ie Piccole.
That way when you decide to go period correct on the wheelset (rims included), you'll still have this complete wheelset to use on another frame.
[I kind of made the same decision on my '74 Italvega]
That way when you decide to go period correct on the wheelset (rims included), you'll still have this complete wheelset to use on another frame.
[I kind of made the same decision on my '74 Italvega]
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72 Frejus (for sale), Holdsworth Record (for sale) & special CNC / 74 Italvega NR (for sale) / c80 ?French? / 82 Raleigh Intl MkII (for sale)/ 83 Trek 620 (for sale)/ 84 Bruce Gordon Chinook (for sale)/ 85 Ron Cooper / 87 Centurion IM MV (for sale) / 03 Casati Dardo / 08 BF IRO / 09 Dogma FPX / 10 Vassago Fisticuff
11-15-17, 03:40 PM
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That's an interesting thought on keeping the rims and hubs period-matched.
This bike is giving me all kinds of things to think about in terms of period-correctness versus my other matchy-matchy preferences. I've got a set of wheels with red label Fiamme rims that I think may be period correct for the frame, but their laced to Gipiemme hubs. The Gipiemme hubs look good and I'm sure they'd be functionally satisfactory, but I really wanted to move everything to Campy. The rims I bought are from the mid-80's but they've got an orange stripe that matches the paint on the bike perfectly.
I kind of feel like with this bike getting things period correct holds a bit more weight than usual (though for me "usual" is "almost none"). On the other hand, rims are a consumable, right? Decisions, decisions....
This bike is giving me all kinds of things to think about in terms of period-correctness versus my other matchy-matchy preferences. I've got a set of wheels with red label Fiamme rims that I think may be period correct for the frame, but their laced to Gipiemme hubs. The Gipiemme hubs look good and I'm sure they'd be functionally satisfactory, but I really wanted to move everything to Campy. The rims I bought are from the mid-80's but they've got an orange stripe that matches the paint on the bike perfectly.
I kind of feel like with this bike getting things period correct holds a bit more weight than usual (though for me "usual" is "almost none"). On the other hand, rims are a consumable, right? Decisions, decisions....
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11-15-17, 03:47 PM
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Picolle - stylistic match.
As far as strength between the two goes, there are some who would argue vehemently for one vs the other. If there is a difference, it's so minor compared to so many other things as to be akin to religious dogma.
As far as strength between the two goes, there are some who would argue vehemently for one vs the other. If there is a difference, it's so minor compared to so many other things as to be akin to religious dogma.
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11-15-17, 08:32 PM
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Rims are a consumable but they're also hi-viz, so I always try to find something that matches visually even if it's not a vintage part.
11-16-17, 12:29 AM
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I was really expecting a lot more support for the high flange hubs. Going with the low flange certainly would be the easier option. Hmmm....
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11-16-17, 09:09 AM
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Go with the setup that will make you want to ride them. Couple of years ago I built up a set of high flange hubs to new Pacenti wide polished box section rims. Great wheels. They have been run extensively on pavement as well as at L'Eroica CA and Cino Heroica. Nobody has ever mentioned the age disparity between the hubs and rims, in fact they'll gotten a lot of compliments.
I really dig the looks of the high flange hubs but wanted a super strong versatile freewheel wheelset that could take anything from 25's to 32's.
I really dig the looks of the high flange hubs but wanted a super strong versatile freewheel wheelset that could take anything from 25's to 32's.
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11-16-17, 09:27 AM
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But I have a set of low flange too, laced to Red Labels, and they're fine wheels.
How's that for non-commital? I sound like a politician....
11-17-17, 03:18 AM
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11-17-17, 05:25 AM
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What??? Only 2 wheels?
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I'd have to see the bike and the hubs and rims. But I bet if you build them well strength won't be an issue.
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11-17-17, 05:33 AM
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From a functional point of view, it really does not matter all that much, in my opinion. But I do love the look of high flange hubs and, given the choice, would go high flange every time, as is the case on most of my vintage steeds, including my PX10E...
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11-17-17, 07:52 AM
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The Pro Peloton that year was mainly low flange.
It is a Pro Bike, low flange.
On bikes with half chrome forks and stays...High Flange. Styling.
It is a Pro Bike, low flange.
On bikes with half chrome forks and stays...High Flange. Styling.
11-17-17, 08:53 AM
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What??? Only 2 wheels?
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When I bought my first lightweight bike way back in the tail end of last millennium, before the 3/4ths point of last century, the affordable Peugeots were the UO-8 and the even more affordable AO-8. Their catalogs and every published thing I could find seemed to proclaim proudly that the UO-8 had the desirable high-flange hubs and the AO-8 had the desirable low-flange hubs. I never did sort out the difference other than one was high and the other low. Okay, those low-flange hubs had nutted axles, but it was a feature seemingly not related to the flange size.
I saw almost no high-performance bikes at the time. Years later and transplanted to a different city and region I began to see nicer bikes. They invariably had low-flange hubs so I associate(d) low-flange with performance. Not that it made any difference, but was just a visual association. Even later I began to see high-flange high-performance hubs, invariably on vintage'y 70's bikes. So I guess it's just as style thing, and perhaps temporal feature too.
So go with what looks right to you. If that doesn't settle the question, go with what looks good (which isn't necessarily the same was what looks right). If that doesn't settle the question, go with what you already or is least expensive.
I saw almost no high-performance bikes at the time. Years later and transplanted to a different city and region I began to see nicer bikes. They invariably had low-flange hubs so I associate(d) low-flange with performance. Not that it made any difference, but was just a visual association. Even later I began to see high-flange high-performance hubs, invariably on vintage'y 70's bikes. So I guess it's just as style thing, and perhaps temporal feature too.
So go with what looks right to you. If that doesn't settle the question, go with what looks good (which isn't necessarily the same was what looks right). If that doesn't settle the question, go with what you already or is least expensive.
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11-17-17, 12:47 PM
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Go with the setup that will make you want to ride them. Couple of years ago I built up a set of high flange hubs to new Pacenti wide polished box section rims. Great wheels. They have been run extensively on pavement as well as at L'Eroica CA and Cino Heroica. Nobody has ever mentioned the age disparity between the hubs and rims, in fact they'll gotten a lot of compliments.
I really dig the looks of the high flange hubs but wanted a super strong versatile freewheel wheelset that could take anything from 25's to 32's.
I really dig the looks of the high flange hubs but wanted a super strong versatile freewheel wheelset that could take anything from 25's to 32's.
11-17-17, 03:24 PM
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This is pretty solid advice. I thought just having the discussion would help me figure out what I actually wanted, like when you flip a coin and while it's in the air you realize which way you're hoping it will come down. Not this time, though. I think I've firmly decided which way I wanted to go four or five different times as I read through this thread. If I go with low flange I can save myself the trouble of hoping something I get on eBay is as good as it looks. That's today's decision. Maybe I should take measurements and order spokes before I change my mind again.
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11-17-17, 06:01 PM
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I'd go with low flange. They're appropriate for high grade, lightweight, road bicycles of all eras. High flange, on the other hand, has a narrower range of application.
However, I have been somewhat influenced on this matter. When I first became seriously involved in cycling, all the top models from the mass manufacturers came equipped with high flange hubs. Conversely, the first examples that I saw from small volume craftsmen like Colnago, Cinelli, De Rosa and Masi, all had low flange hubs. It left a subliminal impression at the time, that low flange hubs were just a little more prestigious.
However, I have been somewhat influenced on this matter. When I first became seriously involved in cycling, all the top models from the mass manufacturers came equipped with high flange hubs. Conversely, the first examples that I saw from small volume craftsmen like Colnago, Cinelli, De Rosa and Masi, all had low flange hubs. It left a subliminal impression at the time, that low flange hubs were just a little more prestigious.
11-17-17, 07:48 PM
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I'd go with low flange. They're appropriate for high grade, lightweight, road bicycles of all eras. High flange, on the other hand, has a narrower range of application.
However, I have been somewhat influenced on this matter. When I first became seriously involved in cycling, all the top models from the mass manufacturers came equipped with high flange hubs. Conversely, the first examples that I saw from small volume craftsmen like Colnago, Cinelli, De Rosa and Masi, all had low flange hubs. It left a subliminal impression at the time, that low flange hubs were just a little more prestigious.
However, I have been somewhat influenced on this matter. When I first became seriously involved in cycling, all the top models from the mass manufacturers came equipped with high flange hubs. Conversely, the first examples that I saw from small volume craftsmen like Colnago, Cinelli, De Rosa and Masi, all had low flange hubs. It left a subliminal impression at the time, that low flange hubs were just a little more prestigious.
My first road bike had Campagnolo Record High Flange, first race wheels also as I found a pair of hubs for $32.50, price won the day. Money was very dear. After I got a bike shop job, low flange for race wheels save for the track and a high flange pair of Nuovo Tipos I won in a race.
Then came 32 hole… felt like 36's with less weight and more cool factor.
11-18-17, 09:24 AM
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I would go with whichever hubs the bike came with. Rims are replaceable items, so if they aren't exactly a match, oh well. That being said, I run high flange on both of my vintage bikes, and love the look. Be careful, though. I got a wheelset from a friend when building my Super Course. After around 1200 miles, while cleaning, I found two cracks in the web between the holes on the flange on the rear. The bike rode fine, no wheel wobble, but I found a hub on ebay and had it respoked. All good now.
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11-18-17, 11:19 AM
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Polished high flange!
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11-18-17, 11:34 AM
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11-18-17, 12:15 PM
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De Rosa + low flange ftw. On certain other bikes high flange look better to me.
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