Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Proper tool for 3-notch headset ring?

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Proper tool for 3-notch headset ring?

Reply

Old 06-20-18, 05:16 PM
  #1  
nlerner
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,673
Mentioned: 180 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 894 Post(s)
Proper tool for 3-notch headset ring?

Anyone have an idea of what the proper tool is to remove this three-notch lock ring from an early 80s Japanese headset? I could use lock-jaw pliers and some padding, of course, but wondered what shop tool would have been in use back in the day.


Untitled
nlerner is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 05:51 PM
  #2  
zammykoo 
Senior Member
 
zammykoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 422

Bikes: Trek 510, Dahon Classic III, Specialized Tricross, Raleigh Technium 460

Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Maybe a bottom bracket lock ring wrench is what you need. This tool has an outer diamter of 46mm and 40mm at the ends of the teeth. If yours measures the same then it might work.

Park Tool HCW-5
https://www.parktool.com/product/cra...t-wrench-hcw-5
zammykoo is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 06:01 PM
  #3  
wschruba 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,320
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 386 Post(s)
Hozan's lockring wrench fits those with no problem.
wschruba is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 06:14 PM
  #4  
desconhecido
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,377
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 200 Post(s)
Serviced an identical headset yesterday. I've seen these headsets several times (less than a bunch) and have never had one that didn't unscrew by hand with just a rag to protect my hand from the edges. Putting them together doesn't require much tightness of that nut because the of the indexing feature of the threaded top cup and the indexing washer it meshes with. If you do end up using pliers, you wouldn't have to squeeze very hard -- the nut probably won't be very tight -- an it should be easy to do without damaging anything.
desconhecido is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 08:15 PM
  #5  
nlerner
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,673
Mentioned: 180 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 894 Post(s)
Oh, I got it off with a small plumber's wrench, so that wasn't a problem. I was more interested to know what tool was specifically designed for its removal. It's actually the second one I've had to deal with in a couple of weeks.

I saw references to the Hozan's wrench on various Google searches, so good to know it works. Seems I can order it via Amazon shipped from Japan.
nlerner is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 08:28 PM
  #6  
Charles Wahl
Disraeli Gears
 
Charles Wahl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: NYC
Posts: 3,445
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 158 Post(s)
It's the rare thread that has Neal Lerner seeking wrenching advice. I feel like I've seen a comet. Even more exhilarating: I pretty much knew the answer, and have one of those lockring tools.
Charles Wahl is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 08:35 PM
  #7  
Salamandrine 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,108

Bikes: 78 Masi Criterium, 68 PX10, 2016 Mercian King of Mercia, Rivendell Clem Smith Jr

Mentioned: 89 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1369 Post(s)
Originally Posted by wschruba View Post
Hozan's lockring wrench fits those with no problem.
+1, BITD in the shop I probably would have grabbed the Hozan.
Salamandrine is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-18, 08:48 PM
  #8  
79pmooney
A Roadie Forever
 
79pmooney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 5,796

Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder

Mentioned: 72 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1186 Post(s)
I'll bet the Pedros fix gear tool (the Trixie) would work. (It's spanner grabs fix gear lockrings far better than my lesser Park spanner and especially the 12t lockrings where the cog is not there as a shoulder. That headset lockring spanner notch looks a lot like the 12 tooth ones.)

It seems Pedros changed the plate stock of the Trixie to a thinner one. I have only the older ones which are very good tools. (I coveted the second one for years as it hung on a bikeshop display. Set up the Mooney fixed and finally had justification to "liberate" it. (The shop owner expressed surprise that a tool that good marked at $30 would sit there that many years. Was happy to see it go to a good home.)

Ben
79pmooney is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 04:45 AM
  #9  
nlerner
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,673
Mentioned: 180 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 894 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Charles Wahl View Post
It's the rare thread that has Neal Lerner seeking wrenching advice. I feel like I've seen a comet. Even more exhilarating: I pretty much knew the answer, and have one of those lockring tools.
Pic?
nlerner is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 06:09 AM
  #10  
mgopack42
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Central Valley, CA
Posts: 65

Bikes: 2013 Pinarello FP Quatro, 1994 Specialized Allez, cheap Scattante cross bike, Mid 80's Ciocc.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
here is what i use

mgopack42 is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 06:10 AM
  #11  
mgopack42
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Central Valley, CA
Posts: 65

Bikes: 2013 Pinarello FP Quatro, 1994 Specialized Allez, cheap Scattante cross bike, Mid 80's Ciocc.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
This one was ground down to use on BB adjustable cups lock rings as well. old VAR tool maybe(?)
mgopack42 is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 06:58 AM
  #12  
Lazyass
Senior Member
 
Lazyass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 7,816

Bikes: '17 Diamondback Podium E'tape Disc, '11 Focus Culebro, lots of vintage steel

Mentioned: 53 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1732 Post(s)
An AR15 spanner works. I know from experience. You can get them cheap.

Lazyass is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 07:10 AM
  #13  
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,318
Mentioned: 333 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1871 Post(s)
Park had a headset spanner, HCW10, with one end designed for notched headset lockrings. There were also several inexpensive, spanner style, multi-tools with this feature. A company called KAL had a hinged, hook spanner that was supposed to work for both headset and BB lockrings but I found it tended to slip. As previously mentioned, you can also use lockring pliers, available from companies like Hozan and VAR.
T-Mar is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 08:21 AM
  #14  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,417
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 424 Post(s)
Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
Park had a headset spanner, HCW10, with one end designed for notched headset lockrings. There were also several inexpensive, spanner style, multi-tools with this feature. A company called KAL had a hinged, hook spanner that was supposed to work for both headset and BB lockrings but I found it tended to slip. As previously mentioned, you can also use lockring pliers, available from companies like Hozan and VAR.
My VAR lockring pliers are of no use on a 3-notch ring
Grand Bois is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 09:04 AM
  #15  
Salamandrine 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,108

Bikes: 78 Masi Criterium, 68 PX10, 2016 Mercian King of Mercia, Rivendell Clem Smith Jr

Mentioned: 89 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1369 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
My VAR lockring pliers are of no use on a 3-notch ring
FYI by Hozan tool I was referring to the C205 double sided lockring tool, not the pliers. Every shop used to have one of these. One side has a hook sized for BB lockrings, the other side works for headsets.

Salamandrine is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 09:23 AM
  #16  
nlerner
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,673
Mentioned: 180 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 894 Post(s)
Well, I ordered three different tools (I'm a sucker for new bike tools) and will report back on effectiveness.
nlerner is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 10:03 AM
  #17  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,417
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 424 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Salamandrine View Post
FYI by Hozan tool I was referring to the C205 double sided lockring tool, not the pliers. Every shop used to have one of these. One side has a hook sized for BB lockrings, the other side works for headsets.

FYI I was responding to the last sentence in T-MAR's post.
Grand Bois is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 12:43 PM
  #18  
mgopack42
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Central Valley, CA
Posts: 65

Bikes: 2013 Pinarello FP Quatro, 1994 Specialized Allez, cheap Scattante cross bike, Mid 80's Ciocc.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
FYI I was responding to the last sentence in T-MAR's post.
Oh yeah,I have one of those as well... I always preferred the hinged style like i posted earlier unless i needed the leverage.
mgopack42 is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 01:55 PM
  #19  
noglider 
aka Tom Reingold
 
noglider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: West Village, New York City
Posts: 34,891

Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1973 Raleigh Twenty, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem

Mentioned: 354 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4167 Post(s)
There's nothing wrong with using those wrenches, of course, but when I don't have one nearby, I just use a big channel lock, and there's nothing wrong with that, either.
__________________
Tom Reingold, [email protected]
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 02:16 PM
  #20  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,417
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 424 Post(s)
If you don't care about damaging the part you might as well use a pipe wrench.
Grand Bois is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 03:33 PM
  #21  
mgopack42
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Central Valley, CA
Posts: 65

Bikes: 2013 Pinarello FP Quatro, 1994 Specialized Allez, cheap Scattante cross bike, Mid 80's Ciocc.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
I have even been known to use a hammer and a flat bladed screwdriver to start the ring spinning in the right direction.
mgopack42 is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 03:57 PM
  #22  
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 19,463

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1321 Post(s)
Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
you can also use lockring pliers, available from companies like Hozan and VAR.
Pliers only work on lockrings with an even number of notches. For a 3-notch ring like this, you need a hook spanner. The Hozan lockring tool is a double-ended hook spanner; the large radius end fits bottom bracket lockrings, while the smaller radius end fits these headset lockrings.

JohnDThompson is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-18, 04:48 PM
  #23  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,417
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 424 Post(s)
Originally Posted by mgopack42 View Post
I have even been known to use a hammer and a flat bladed screwdriver to start the ring spinning in the right direction.
I have used a piece of 1/2" copper pipe instead of a screwdriver. It does no damage.
I replace headsets that have wrench marks or chipped chrome.
Is my OCD showing?
Grand Bois is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-18, 05:29 AM
  #24  
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,318
Mentioned: 333 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1871 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
My VAR lockring pliers are of no use on a 3-notch ring
Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
Pliers only work on lockrings with an even number of notches. For a 3-notch ring like this, you need a hook spanner. The Hozan lockring tool is a double-ended hook spanner; the large radius end fits bottom bracket lockrings, while the smaller radius end fits these headset lockrings.
This is what I was talking about. They fit a triple notch headset lockring quite well.

T-Mar is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-18, 06:02 AM
  #25  
Lakerat
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 441
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 193 Post(s)
With lots of filing, I made an insert for my Sugino fixed cup wrench out of large washer. Lay the nut on the washer and mark for the slots, and hacksaw beside the teeth. Then file away for clearance around the nut. File flats on the outside so washer fits in the fixed cup wrench.
Lakerat is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service