Maximum Irony Achieved
11-12-18 | 09:49 AM
#26
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Really? I was hoping it was either the pads, the rims, or the cables. Whatever it is, the braking is scary bad right now. I actually walked down a couple of steep hills because they were so weak.
I do have a set of Potenza brakes I could put on there. Maybe that with a Racing T drivetrain. I hate to give up the Synchro indexed shifting though. I was actually pretty impressed with how well that worked.
I do have a set of Potenza brakes I could put on there. Maybe that with a Racing T drivetrain. I hate to give up the Synchro indexed shifting though. I was actually pretty impressed with how well that worked.
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11-12-18 | 10:25 AM
#27
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Really? I was hoping it was either the pads, the rims, or the cables. Whatever it is, the braking is scary bad right now. I actually walked down a couple of steep hills because they were so weak.
I do have a set of Potenza brakes I could put on there. Maybe that with a Racing T drivetrain. I hate to give up the Synchro indexed shifting though. I was actually pretty impressed with how well that worked.
My Bottecchia was originally equipped with Campy DT Synchro indexed shifting. I loved them.
11-12-18 | 11:05 AM
#28
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From: Soviet of Oregon or Pensacola FL
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Andy, I like the monoplanars, have them on several bikes and they are capable of locking up the wheels, so less hand effort is what you get from double pivot. I think more power just makes it easier to lock up, and once you're in a skid, what then?
The Campy switch to double pivot brakes plus the monoplanar migration through the years from Chorus all the way down to Mirage made them available NOS and in VG used condition at bargain prices for a while, so it was a no brainer back in the early 2000's, when I built my bikes.
New pads will make a big difference and there are better pads available now than when they were new. Don
The Campy switch to double pivot brakes plus the monoplanar migration through the years from Chorus all the way down to Mirage made them available NOS and in VG used condition at bargain prices for a while, so it was a no brainer back in the early 2000's, when I built my bikes.
New pads will make a big difference and there are better pads available now than when they were new. Don
11-12-18 | 11:18 AM
#29
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From: Berkeley, CA
Bikes: 72 Cilo Pacer, 72 Gitane GT, 72 Peugeot PX10, 73 Speedwell Ti,l, 75 Peugeot PR-10L, 80 Colnago Super, 81 Zinn, 85 ALAN Cross, 85 De Rosa Pro, 86 Look 753, 86 Look KG86, 89 Parkpre Team, 90 Parkpre Team MTB, 90 Merlin
That’s a really neat bike. Congrats on the cool score! I always liked the red polka dot look, but not being much of a climber myself, I’d be out of place in a KOM Jersey. That bike on the other hand, I’d be glad to ride. 
Do keep working on those brakes. They’re not always ineffective. I have those same Chorus monoplaners on my Look and they stop well. I can easily lock up the rear, and I’m using original pads. Try sanding off a little with a file to expose some fresh rubber. And double check the quick release at the lever isn’t open. Mine tend to stop better when adjusted fairly close to the rims (though they look fairly close already in the photos).
Do keep working on those brakes. They’re not always ineffective. I have those same Chorus monoplaners on my Look and they stop well. I can easily lock up the rear, and I’m using original pads. Try sanding off a little with a file to expose some fresh rubber. And double check the quick release at the lever isn’t open. Mine tend to stop better when adjusted fairly close to the rims (though they look fairly close already in the photos).
11-12-18 | 11:30 AM
#30
Matt Pendergast
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From: North Bend, Washington State
Bikes: 1937 Hobbs; 1977 Bruce Gordon; 1987 Bill Holland; 1988 Schwinn Paramount (Fixed gear); 1999 Fat City Yo Eddy (MTB); 2018 Woodrup (Touring) 2016 Ritchey breakaway
That bike makes me smile, Andy. Love it!
11-12-18 | 12:14 PM
#33
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Yeah, that's the one from the Paceline forum post I linked. Apparently the owner was having it refinished by Serotta and, like me, wasn't entirely comfortable with the KoM designation so he had them change it up a bit. Near as I can tell that one started life identical to mine.
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11-12-18 | 12:20 PM
#34
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I think it's original. I've found evidence of at least one other, described in this Paceline thread: https://thepaceline.net/forums/showthread.php?t=117821
The dots appear to be decals, but they're under a sort of sparkly clear coat that covers the entire bike and also the stem. The other thing I should have pictured is the rear stays. It has "S-bend" chainstays. Supposedly this makes it stiffer. I think that also may be part of the "Colorado Concept."
I actually thought about you while I was out riding it today. I didn't push it much because the brakes are barely functional (almost hit a couple walking their dogs because of that), but the first time I went up a hill I definitely noticed the response. I don't know if that was the Colorado Concept doing its job or the new bike euphoria doing its job. Either way, it reminded me of the way you described your Casati (and my brief parking lot experience with it). You'll have to come down and try this sometime and see what you think. The 24T cog on the freewheel might not be to your liking, but I'm sure I can find a corn cob to put on there for you.
As for the gearing, if I put a 14-28T freewheel on it, it will match what's on my Gios. I've got a plan to keep riding on that until I can handle at least moderate hills. I want to test the theory that I'm weak because I never push a big gear. I suspect that I'll find that I'm weak because I'm too old to build new muscle, but you never know until you try.
The dots appear to be decals, but they're under a sort of sparkly clear coat that covers the entire bike and also the stem. The other thing I should have pictured is the rear stays. It has "S-bend" chainstays. Supposedly this makes it stiffer. I think that also may be part of the "Colorado Concept."
I actually thought about you while I was out riding it today. I didn't push it much because the brakes are barely functional (almost hit a couple walking their dogs because of that), but the first time I went up a hill I definitely noticed the response. I don't know if that was the Colorado Concept doing its job or the new bike euphoria doing its job. Either way, it reminded me of the way you described your Casati (and my brief parking lot experience with it). You'll have to come down and try this sometime and see what you think. The 24T cog on the freewheel might not be to your liking, but I'm sure I can find a corn cob to put on there for you.
As for the gearing, if I put a 14-28T freewheel on it, it will match what's on my Gios. I've got a plan to keep riding on that until I can handle at least moderate hills. I want to test the theory that I'm weak because I never push a big gear. I suspect that I'll find that I'm weak because I'm too old to build new muscle, but you never know until you try.
Today I am beginning to enjoy 24 and even 26t cogs out back. My knees appreciate them, too
Too old to build new muscle? Is that a thing - because if it is, I'd not heard that before. Maybe that's why I don't necessarily get stronger, just faster, with accumulated miles.
Lastly, those brakes will work perfectly well if they're set up correctly and the pads are supple. I run them on my Davidson with the Ergo 8-speed and have never had a problem with braking. While not dual-pivots, they still have better modulation than the older Record calipers.
DD
Last edited by Drillium Dude; 11-12-18 at 03:56 PM.
11-12-18 | 12:29 PM
#35
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It also says "mountain" not "mountains." I just need to figure out which mountain I am king of. Perhaps Col d'Kaylor as [MENTION=381793]gugie[/MENTION] suggests. I picture a scenario like a couple of years ago when Taylor Phinney went out in a breakaway on stage 2 and got the KoM jersey for a day. He led a group of four riders over two cat 4 climbs and went on to finish 146th on the stage but got the polka dot jersey at the end of the day. I think I could manage the recreational group ride equivalent of that.
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11-12-18 | 12:44 PM
#36
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Thanks to everyone who has encouraged me to keep working on the current brakes. I think I'll replace the pads first then the cables and eventually the rims if nothing else works. All those things need to be done eventually anyway and everything but the rims will be cheap. I didn't see anything obviously wrong with the monoplaner design, but given that people used to choose Deltas over these I had a lingering doubt. I guess some people just don't like stopping.
I generally come down on the "less hand effort" side of this argument. I understand that maximum braking power is generally limited by tire traction. I feel like I can modulate better with a lighter touch. That said, I have been satisfied with single pivot Nuovo Record brakes, so it sounds like I ought to be able to make these work. I really don't think I can lock the wheels with things set up as I have them now though. I did sand off the surface of the pads and made an attempt to clean the rims. That didn't help much. New pads will probably make a bigger difference.
I generally come down on the "less hand effort" side of this argument. I understand that maximum braking power is generally limited by tire traction. I feel like I can modulate better with a lighter touch. That said, I have been satisfied with single pivot Nuovo Record brakes, so it sounds like I ought to be able to make these work. I really don't think I can lock the wheels with things set up as I have them now though. I did sand off the surface of the pads and made an attempt to clean the rims. That didn't help much. New pads will probably make a bigger difference.
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11-12-18 | 02:25 PM
#38
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11-12-18 | 02:30 PM
#39
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It's actually even more unusual than that. The seat tube and down tube are tapered. They're both 28.6 at the top but around 36 mm at the bottom bracket. I believe this is standard for Serottas of this period (~1987). If I understand correctly, this is the "Colorado Concept" tubing that is (I think) unique to Serottas.
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11-12-18 | 02:31 PM
#40
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11-12-18 | 04:46 PM
#41
PeopleCode delaminator
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From: Round Lake. NY
Bikes: 1986 Trek 310 Elance, 1997 Schwinn HydraGlide, 1987 Trek Antelope 800, 2003 Haro F4, 198? Allsop Offroad Climber, 198? Raleigh Eclipse, 2008 Diamondback Venom
Announcing to the world that I'll be the last one up.
(I'm over 250 pounds. Hillclimbs of any duration are NOT my friend.)
11-12-18 | 04:55 PM
#42
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From: www.ci.encinitas.ca.us
Bikes: 1959 Capo Modell Campagnolo; 1960 Capo Sieger (2); 1962 Carlton Franco Suisse; 1970 Peugeot UO-8; 1982 Bianchi Campione d'Italia; 1988 Schwinn Project KOM-10;
My (Schwinn) King of the Mountain(s) mountain bike is red, white, and blue (see signature), perfect for national holidays.
On a road bike with a 42T inner ring up front, I like a 26T large cog in back for hills. The very common 52-42/14-16-18-21-24 combination is a bit too tall for me.
On the subject of Campag. brakes, I have early-generation sidepulls on my Bianchi. They were terrifyingly ineffective with Shimano pads and long-reach Modolo brake levers, but they work well with KoolStops and Shimano (I know, no style points on an Italian bike) aero brake levers.
On a road bike with a 42T inner ring up front, I like a 26T large cog in back for hills. The very common 52-42/14-16-18-21-24 combination is a bit too tall for me.
On the subject of Campag. brakes, I have early-generation sidepulls on my Bianchi. They were terrifyingly ineffective with Shimano pads and long-reach Modolo brake levers, but they work well with KoolStops and Shimano (I know, no style points on an Italian bike) aero brake levers.
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Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
11-12-18 | 05:02 PM
#43
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I was a mechanic, high end assembler, and occasional salesperson at a Serotta dealer from @'88 to 2000. The quality of those bikes is impeccable, yours may have been custom ordered because the CSI (custom option lugged frames) were sometimes hybrids of fillet and lugged construction when needed to get the customer's needed geometry. Often the main triangle joints were what some builders call "bi-laminate"--one socket cut off the lug and replaced with a fillet. The builders who did that neat **** were Kelly Bedford and Dave Kirk. Lueky you!! You could lower the gearing by changing the crankset and leaving the rear shifting alone--the friction downtime shifter is omnivorous, it'll work with any crankset you want it to work with.
11-12-18 | 05:26 PM
#44
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If you are planning to overhaul it at some point, please share a pic of the BB shell mitering. Just looking at this pic of the shell without sockets makes me drool with anticipation regarding what the joint looks like from the inside
DD
DD
11-12-18 | 05:44 PM
#45
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I'm pretty curious about that myself. It's got a cartridge bottom bracket that's spinning smoothly, so I don't really have a compelling reason to take it apart at this point but I might do so anyway just to see what's in there.
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11-12-18 | 07:58 PM
#46
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11-13-18 | 11:40 AM
#47
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No offense to anyone here, but I would venture to guess that many of us are incapable of giving our bikes the full measure of what they were built for. Certainly true of me.
I would look at that as an exceptional bike with a really cool paint job, and enjoy the heck out of it.
That said, your thread title made me laugh.
I would look at that as an exceptional bike with a really cool paint job, and enjoy the heck out of it.
That said, your thread title made me laugh.
11-13-18 | 12:29 PM
#48
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No offense to anyone here, but I would venture to guess that many of us are incapable of giving our bikes the full measure of what they were built for. Certainly true of me.
I would look at that as an exceptional bike with a really cool paint job, and enjoy the heck out of it.
That said, your thread title made me laugh.
I would look at that as an exceptional bike with a really cool paint job, and enjoy the heck out of it.
That said, your thread title made me laugh.
Now a 77-78 KZ 1000 at the dragstrip, that's another story.
11-13-18 | 01:39 PM
#50
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I'm definitely enjoying this one. I'm often impatient about getting a bike on the road and so usually throw together parts bin builds to try it out. Recently I've been a bit more patient about that. In fact, I've got a Raleigh Competition on my workstand right now that I bought almost two months ago and haven't ridden yet. Not so with the Serotta. The day I brought it home I leveled the saddle, put on fresh tires, sanded the brake pads a little, and took it out for a ride. I didn't even have to change the saddle height.
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