I bought a Sugino MW-68 bottom bracket to use with an early Superbe crank on my Griffon. The cups and spindle are in good shape. It came with loose bearings. Is there any reason to prefer caged bearings over loose other than the challenge of keeping loose bearings in place during assembly?

No there is not, but I've never seen a Japanese OEM BB from the '60's onward w/ loose bearings.
Used I'd be very careful to get the bearing size/number correct.

-Bandera

Ditto-just pack em in with grease.

It's easier to install and harder to lose bearings.

Glob those BB cups full of nice, sticky grease, and pop them in. You should be fine

-Kurt

Caged bearings are superior to loose and there is no point unless you just want to be really really old school . Lots of conjecture about being able to install more loose balls versus a cage , but that is all that it is. Those cages arent there for a cost savings, they maintain properly spacing

Uncaged bearings can carry more load, unless the cages are designed to minimise bearing spacings ala Campagnolo. For example good quality MTB suspension pivot bearings are full complement with no cage. Caged bearings are cheaper (usually less balls) and easier to assemble than loose balls so manufacturers are always going to use them, they aren't going to pay somebody to place balls one by one with the chance of getting the numbers wrong.
Cartridge type roller bearings (except for full complement) have cages because of the way they are assembled. The balls are placed together in the outer race, the inner race inserted then the balls evenly distributed and the cage fitted to maintain spacing so the bearing doesn't fall apart. This is a different situation to a bottom bracket. Full complement bearings have indents in the side of the races so the balls can be inserted one by one with the indents lined up.

Suntour also made caged bearings that could take 11 to a side. I'd run them loose 11 to a side rather than use a cage that only takes 9.

[MENTION=410984]Trevtassie[/MENTION]

I am going to assume you are aware that many engineering studies have been performed concerning this very topic. Yes there is definitely manufacturing efficiency and cost savings in using caged balls , however they are also better at what they do.

There is a lot of information available out there concerning this very topic. As I said earlier if you want to use them because it makes you feel better being a traditionalist fine, there is no performance benefit to be realized however .

+1; keyword sticky. For those who like to use waterproof marine grease, I found (by chance) that Liquid Wrench brand marine grease (reddish [almost Shimano] color) is definitely stickier than the other brands you typically find at a FLAPS or home store.

Thanks for all the responses. The spacing argument seemed like it would be worth investigating, so I hunted around a bit to see what Jobst Brandt had to say about the topic. In this rec.bicycles.tech thread, he wrote:

Hmmm. Sir Sheldon disagrees:

Unfortunately, we can't ask either Jobst or Sheldon.

I do have some Campy caged bearings, not in front of me, though what I've read suggests they probably hold 11 bearings. The reason for buying the Sugino was that I lacked a suitable Campy spindle. This bb was cheap enough that even if I didn't use the cups and bearings, I'd have a spindle I could use. I think I will try 11 loose bearings and see how it goes. Unless the ride is so magical that I sell every other bike I own and start riding 20k miles per year, based on what I've read I rather suspect there will be little effective lifetime wear difference between 9 caged, 11 caged or 11 loose bearings.

And in all likelihood, they're probably still arguing about it .... up there .....

Probably, but they can look around to see how many angels are currently dancing on the heads of pins.....

-Bandera

Campagnolo bottom bracket bearing retainers hold 11 balls each. Other companies also used 11-ball retainers, and replacements are available. These will work with pretty much any bottom bracket that uses 1/4" balls:


https://www.biketoolsetc.com/index.c...m_id=US-GR1411

Sealed.

I have a few suginos that take 11. I use them on the fixed cup to make my life a bit easier and run loose on the adjustable.

Insert 'This is Spinal Tap' meme here:

You can't say that here. Can you? 🤔😉

I for one, am unaware of any engineering studies which demonstrate that caged bearings provide any advantage other than ease of assembly over loose ones. Could you link to a couple of them?

There are advantages in high speed bearings, especially to do with grease retention and friction between the balls when centripetal forces come into play . There aren't any high speed bearings on a bicycle, derailleur pulleys maybe get into the bottom end of medium speed bearings. There's probably not even that much point using ceramic bearings, they are actually designed for extremely high speeds, where the lightness of the rolling elements means less angular forces on the outside race.

OK, I installed the Sugino MW-68 with Campagnolo caged bearings. Thanks for the inputs. I suppose next time I need to replace the bottom bracket on this bike I can go "full [MENTION=381793]gugie[/MENTION]" and source a Phil bottom bracket.

Will the Vice President of engineering at a company which builds precision manufacturing equipment do?



The above comments were taken from a technical article titled " The Benefits of Caged Balls: Boosted Lifetime and Reduced Noise" By Wally Logan - Vice President of Engineering - Motion Solutions.


I have read countless articles and technical studies and have yet to find a single one that advocates loose bearings as being superior for most applications where caged bearings are used. I am not against you or anyone else using loose balls because it makes you feel better, but it does not outperform quality caged ball bearings .

It might but it will not out perform a quality caged bearing assembly.

Best of both worlds -- full-complement caged bearings. Sounds like a winner all around.

Awww, but that's too easy. Then whad'a we going to talk about? What kind of grease to slather those bearings in ?