Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Barcons for the win.

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Barcons for the win.

Old 10-11-22, 09:38 AM
  #26  
USAZorro
Se˝or Member
 
USAZorro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hardy, VA
Posts: 17,439

Bikes: Mostly English - predominantly Raleighs

Mentioned: 64 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1271 Post(s)
Liked 695 Times in 430 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Not sure what year but they came with barcons later. It also says 12 speed on the chainstay.
1977 was a watershed year for the Super Course. They dropped chrome, went with Sun Tour and Bar Cons. I know they also transitioned to integrated top-of-toptube cable guides in the 1980s in general, but they also discontinued using the name too. I hadn't known of the model with these details before this thread.
__________________
In search of what to search for.
USAZorro is offline  
Likes For USAZorro:
Old 10-11-22, 10:26 AM
  #27  
RCMoeur
Cantilever believer
 
RCMoeur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 398
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked 447 Times in 198 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Fun stuff

One of my favorite suntours.
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
RCMoeur is offline  
Likes For RCMoeur:
Old 10-11-22, 11:15 AM
  #28  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by RCMoeur View Post
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
And this one is a long cage which helps me age ungracefully!
52telecaster is offline  
Likes For 52telecaster:
Old 10-11-22, 12:39 PM
  #29  
daverup 
Senior Member
 
daverup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Michigan USA
Posts: 709

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 202 Post(s)
Liked 557 Times in 282 Posts
52telecaster You must have won all of the good deal bikes this summer in your area!
daverup is offline  
Likes For daverup:
Old 10-11-22, 12:52 PM
  #30  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by daverup View Post
52telecaster You must have won all of the good deal bikes this summer in your area!
It's been a bit ridiculous. Time to let a few go!
52telecaster is offline  
Likes For 52telecaster:
Old 10-11-22, 01:02 PM
  #31  
Sedgemop 
Senior Member
 
Sedgemop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Chicago
Posts: 710

Bikes: '69 Raleigh Sports '72 Peugeot PX-10 '75 Motobecane Le Champion '82 Motobecane Grand Jubile '85 Trek 830

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 168 Post(s)
Liked 237 Times in 149 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
The b15 is just about toast. I have two others an love them. The Raleigh is lighter than I thought and the weinmann sidepulls are pretty effective.
The late 70's Super Course is underrated, Surprisingly quick and responsive. I'll have another one one day.
Sedgemop is offline  
Likes For Sedgemop:
Old 10-11-22, 01:12 PM
  #32  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by Sedgemop View Post
The late 70's Super Course is underrated, Surprisingly quick and responsive. I'll have another one one day.
I have a 73 I enjoy but this one feels sportier and more competent. Almost like a competition.
52telecaster is offline  
Likes For 52telecaster:
Old 10-11-22, 01:15 PM
  #33  
beicster 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Berea, KY
Posts: 1,041
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 324 Post(s)
Liked 210 Times in 145 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Does this bike include ishiwata stays and fork? It is certainly light.
The catalog says the fork and stays are
manganese alloy.
__________________
Andy
beicster is offline  
Likes For beicster:
Old 10-11-22, 01:16 PM
  #34  
Sedgemop 
Senior Member
 
Sedgemop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Chicago
Posts: 710

Bikes: '69 Raleigh Sports '72 Peugeot PX-10 '75 Motobecane Le Champion '82 Motobecane Grand Jubile '85 Trek 830

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 168 Post(s)
Liked 237 Times in 149 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
I have a 73 I enjoy but this one feels sportier and more competent. Almost like a competition.
Yeah, it's definitely an entry level racer by the late 70's.
Sedgemop is offline  
Likes For Sedgemop:
Old 10-11-22, 01:20 PM
  #35  
Kabuki12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,697
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 645 Post(s)
Liked 1,481 Times in 866 Posts
Originally Posted by RCMoeur View Post
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
YEP!!! That is an amazing derailleur. My first light weight bike , a Kabuki Diamond Formula came with a corn cob and one of those. I lived on a sail boat and rode that bike(still have it) many many miles , we did not drive a car for over two years and we both worked full time. Salt air and everything was thrown at that thing and when I was out and about I passed all those expensive European bikes up with my Japanese racer! I still have the derailleur but I have since built up the Kabuki with Campagnolo Record .
Kabuki12 is offline  
Likes For Kabuki12:
Old 10-11-22, 02:15 PM
  #36  
79pmooney
Senior Member
 
79pmooney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 11,503

Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder

Mentioned: 119 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3992 Post(s)
Liked 2,879 Times in 1,872 Posts
Originally Posted by RCMoeur View Post
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
I raced my first season on a triple and VGT Lux long cage RD. Club races simply as is. Open races I'd set the inside FD limit to double. Rear shifting was excellent. (I ran a 13-19 5-speed and made a short as possible claw hanger from 1/4" aluminum plate.) The Cyclone on my true racing bike the next year felt better but was equaled in the task by that cheap one!
79pmooney is offline  
Old 10-11-22, 03:21 PM
  #37  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by beicster View Post
The catalog says the fork and stays are
manganese alloy.
So poor man's 531
52telecaster is offline  
Likes For 52telecaster:
Old 10-11-22, 07:45 PM
  #38  
The Golden Boy 
Extraordinary Magnitude
 
The Golden Boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waukesha WI
Posts: 13,339

Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT

Mentioned: 81 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2485 Post(s)
Liked 1,351 Times in 766 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
So poor man's 531
I've thought about that (I had an 84 Trek 420 made of Tange Mangaloy)

None of the makers of manganese alloy tubing really tried to position themselves in the same ball park as 531. As I understand Mangaloy and Ishiwata Mangy and Miyata's Mangalight were all classified as carbon/manganese alloys rather than manganese/molybdenum alloys. As such- they're "better" than hi-ten, but "beneath" CrMo.

In Trek terms (*VERY* generally from 70s/early 80s)
200/300- Hi-Ten
400- CMn w/ Hi-Ten stays and fork
500-CrMo
600- 531 frame with CrMo or CMn stays and fork
700- 531 frame with 531 stays and fork
900- Columbus SL/SP

(yes, the 200/300/400 designation kind of went through changes- and the 600 series was CMn early, then CrMo later until 400 series bikes were built like that in 86... but we're talking generalizations here and the rough idea of the weight/prestige of the tubing) (and yes, "better" is in quotes for a reason)



__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*

Commence to jigglinĺ huh?!?!

"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
The Golden Boy is offline  
Old 10-11-22, 08:18 PM
  #39  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by The Golden Boy View Post
I've thought about that (I had an 84 Trek 420 made of Tange Mangaloy)

None of the makers of manganese alloy tubing really tried to position themselves in the same ball park as 531. As I understand Mangaloy and Ishiwata Mangy and Miyata's Mangalight were all classified as carbon/manganese alloys rather than manganese/molybdenum alloys. As such- they're "better" than hi-ten, but "beneath" CrMo.

In Trek terms (*VERY* generally from 70s/early 80s)
200/300- Hi-Ten
400- CMn w/ Hi-Ten stays and fork
500-CrMo
600- 531 frame with CrMo or CMn stays and fork
700- 531 frame with 531 stays and fork
900- Columbus SL/SP

(yes, the 200/300/400 designation kind of went through changes- and the 600 series was CMn early, then CrMo later until 400 series bikes were built like that in 86... but we're talking generalizations here and the rough idea of the weight/prestige of the tubing) (and yes, "better" is in quotes for a reason)



Ty man!
52telecaster is offline  
Likes For 52telecaster:
Old 10-11-22, 09:14 PM
  #40  
Ruethedaze
Unholy roller
 
Join Date: Oct 2022
Location: Pittsburgh pa.
Posts: 6

Bikes: Gios Professional, Nishiki Cresta GT, Carlton Raleigh Gran Course

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 1 Post
Just the other day I went to buy a 20 dollar tange champion Japanese schwinn super sport for the suntour barcons.. going to use most of the components for a touring bike I'm building for my girlfriend. The guy was so happy I knew a few things about his old bike that he ended up giving me a trek (my gfs size!) 520 frame and a NOS suntour cyclone derailer. Great day. So yes barcons for the win.
Ruethedaze is offline  
Likes For Ruethedaze:
Old 10-11-22, 10:41 PM
  #41  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by Ruethedaze View Post
Just the other day I went to buy a 20 dollar tange champion Japanese schwinn super sport for the suntour barcons.. going to use most of the components for a touring bike I'm building for my girlfriend. The guy was so happy I knew a few things about his old bike that he ended up giving me a trek (my gfs size!) 520 frame and a NOS suntour cyclone derailer. Great day. So yes barcons for the win.
I didn't know super sports had tange champion... Great bike!
52telecaster is offline  
Old 10-12-22, 12:12 AM
  #42  
Dirt Road Blues 
Junior Member
 
Dirt Road Blues's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Location: Eugene, OR
Posts: 131
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times in 36 Posts
Any bike that's sporting Suntour barcons is worth at least 45 bucks!
Dirt Road Blues is offline  
Likes For Dirt Road Blues:
Old 10-12-22, 08:46 AM
  #43  
daverup 
Senior Member
 
daverup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Michigan USA
Posts: 709

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes.

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 202 Post(s)
Liked 557 Times in 282 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Not just kidding either except it has the helicomatic hub. If I keep it I'll build new wheels.
I do think you probably have the lower end helicomatic hubs on that Trek. They have suffered more failures due to small ball bearings and gaps at the cone that allow grit in to help them self destruct. I do have a few of these that are undamaged and seem just fine with light usage and periodic cleaning.
The higher end 700 helicomatics were found on some Treks and have some differences as pointed out by JohnDThompson in this post,
Maillard Helicomatic hub question
The labyrinth seals, bigger ball bearings, and better cones make them much better.
The 6 speed helicomatic freewheels I have work pretty well with Shimano indexed shifters as well.
daverup is offline  
Old 10-12-22, 10:57 AM
  #44  
shoota 
Senior Member
 
shoota's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Stillwater, OK
Posts: 8,011
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1817 Post(s)
Liked 631 Times in 427 Posts
Those Treks make nice STI, 700c conversions
__________________
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
shoota is offline  
Likes For shoota:
Old 10-12-22, 11:37 AM
  #45  
tkamd73 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Menomonee Falls, WI
Posts: 1,712

Bikes: 1984 Schwinn Supersport, 1988 Trek 400T, 1977 Trek TX900, 1982 Bianchi Champione del Mondo, 1978 Raleigh Supercourse, 1986 Trek 400 Elance, 1991 Waterford PDG OS Paramount, 1971 Schwinn Sports Tourer, 1985 Trek 670

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 565 Post(s)
Liked 870 Times in 457 Posts
Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
I didn't know super sports had tange champion... Great bike!
Yup, 84 Supersport with Tange Champion.
tkamd73 is offline  
Likes For tkamd73:
Old 10-12-22, 02:26 PM
  #46  
52telecaster
ambulatory senior
Thread Starter
 
52telecaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 5,480

Bikes: Bob Jackson World Tour, Falcon and lots of other bikes.

Mentioned: 68 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1691 Post(s)
Liked 2,485 Times in 1,196 Posts
Originally Posted by shoota View Post
Those Treks make nice STI, 700c conversions
They are just great framesets period. I love 700cs on them with fenders and 35s.... Oh and barcons of course.
52telecaster is offline  
Likes For 52telecaster:
Old 10-12-22, 04:45 PM
  #47  
randyjawa 
Senior Member
 
randyjawa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada - burrrrr!
Posts: 11,386

Bikes: 1958 Rabeneick 120D, 1968 Legnano Gran Premio, 196? Torpado Professional, 2000 Marinoni Piuma

Mentioned: 204 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1286 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,437 Times in 804 Posts
Long have I been a fan of Barcon shifters. The Suntour Barcon...


in my mind is much superior to the Campagnolo version...


But the absolute best Barcon that I have ever used are fitted to my Jamaican Bianchi. Indexed and offers a perfect shift, without hunting for that sweet spot, every time...
__________________
"98% of the bikes I buy are projects".
randyjawa is offline  
Likes For randyjawa:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.