Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Barcons for the win.

Search
Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Barcons for the win.

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 10-11-22 | 10:26 AM
  #26  
RCMoeur's Avatar
Cantilever believer
Titanium Club Membership
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Nov 2021
Posts: 3,121
Likes: 4,779
From: Phoenix, AZ
Originally Posted by 52telecaster
Fun stuff

One of my favorite suntours.
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
__________________
Richard C. Moeur, PE - Phoenix AZ, USA
https://www.richardcmoeur.com/bikestuf.html
RCMoeur is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 11:15 AM
  #27  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by RCMoeur
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
And this one is a long cage which helps me age ungracefully!
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 12:39 PM
  #28  
daverup's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 1,670
Likes: 1,975
From: Michigan USA

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes.

52telecaster You must have won all of the good deal bikes this summer in your area!
daverup is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 12:52 PM
  #29  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by daverup
52telecaster You must have won all of the good deal bikes this summer in your area!
It's been a bit ridiculous. Time to let a few go!
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 01:02 PM
  #30  
Sedgemop's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
10 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,740
Likes: 3,741
From: Chicago

Bikes: '69 Raleigh Sports '72 Cinelli Super Corsa '78 Motobecane Le Champion '84 Schwinn High Sierra '85 Trek 830 '88 Merckx Team ADR Corsa Extra

Originally Posted by 52telecaster
The b15 is just about toast. I have two others an love them. The Raleigh is lighter than I thought and the weinmann sidepulls are pretty effective.
The late 70's Super Course is underrated, Surprisingly quick and responsive. I'll have another one one day.
Sedgemop is online now  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 01:12 PM
  #31  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by Sedgemop
The late 70's Super Course is underrated, Surprisingly quick and responsive. I'll have another one one day.
I have a 73 I enjoy but this one feels sportier and more competent. Almost like a competition.
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 01:15 PM
  #32  
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,486
Likes: 684
From: Berea, KY
Originally Posted by 52telecaster
Does this bike include ishiwata stays and fork? It is certainly light.
The catalog says the fork and stays are
manganese alloy.
__________________
Andy
beicster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 01:16 PM
  #33  
Sedgemop's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
10 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,740
Likes: 3,741
From: Chicago

Bikes: '69 Raleigh Sports '72 Cinelli Super Corsa '78 Motobecane Le Champion '84 Schwinn High Sierra '85 Trek 830 '88 Merckx Team ADR Corsa Extra

Originally Posted by 52telecaster
I have a 73 I enjoy but this one feels sportier and more competent. Almost like a competition.
Yeah, it's definitely an entry level racer by the late 70's.
Sedgemop is online now  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 01:20 PM
  #34  
Senior Member♣️
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 4,075
Likes: 3,004
Originally Posted by RCMoeur
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
YEP!!! That is an amazing derailleur. My first light weight bike , a Kabuki Diamond Formula came with a corn cob and one of those. I lived on a sail boat and rode that bike(still have it) many many miles , we did not drive a car for over two years and we both worked full time. Salt air and everything was thrown at that thing and when I was out and about I passed all those expensive European bikes up with my Japanese racer! I still have the derailleur but I have since built up the Kabuki with Campagnolo Record .
bfuser5783920 is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 02:15 PM
  #35  
79pmooney's Avatar
Senior Member
10 Anniversary
Community Builder
 
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,159
Likes: 5,284
From: Portland, OR

Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder

Originally Posted by RCMoeur
I raced with a VX short cage. The Campy boys in the pack in the pack laughed (sometimes literally), and my Superbe-equipped teammates took gentle pity on my "plight". But that thing shifted reliably every time it needed to, and was only a trivial weight difference from the far more unaffordable componentry. Great derailleur - which is what you can say about nearly every rear one made by Maeda (although the plastic cage on the Alpha 2000 on my commuting bike is fixin' to fail soon.)
I raced my first season on a triple and VGT Lux long cage RD. Club races simply as is. Open races I'd set the inside FD limit to double. Rear shifting was excellent. (I ran a 13-19 5-speed and made a short as possible claw hanger from 1/4" aluminum plate.) The Cyclone on my true racing bike the next year felt better but was equaled in the task by that cheap one!
79pmooney is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 03:21 PM
  #36  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by beicster
The catalog says the fork and stays are
manganese alloy.
So poor man's 531
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 07:45 PM
  #37  
The Golden Boy's Avatar
Extraordinary Magnitude
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 14,081
Likes: 2,135
From: Waukesha WI

Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT

Originally Posted by 52telecaster
So poor man's 531
I've thought about that (I had an 84 Trek 420 made of Tange Mangaloy)

None of the makers of manganese alloy tubing really tried to position themselves in the same ball park as 531. As I understand Mangaloy and Ishiwata Mangy and Miyata's Mangalight were all classified as carbon/manganese alloys rather than manganese/molybdenum alloys. As such- they're "better" than hi-ten, but "beneath" CrMo.

In Trek terms (*VERY* generally from 70s/early 80s)
200/300- Hi-Ten
400- CMn w/ Hi-Ten stays and fork
500-CrMo
600- 531 frame with CrMo or CMn stays and fork
700- 531 frame with 531 stays and fork
900- Columbus SL/SP

(yes, the 200/300/400 designation kind of went through changes- and the 600 series was CMn early, then CrMo later until 400 series bikes were built like that in 86... but we're talking generalizations here and the rough idea of the weight/prestige of the tubing) (and yes, "better" is in quotes for a reason)



__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*

Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!

"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
The Golden Boy is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 08:18 PM
  #38  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by The Golden Boy
I've thought about that (I had an 84 Trek 420 made of Tange Mangaloy)

None of the makers of manganese alloy tubing really tried to position themselves in the same ball park as 531. As I understand Mangaloy and Ishiwata Mangy and Miyata's Mangalight were all classified as carbon/manganese alloys rather than manganese/molybdenum alloys. As such- they're "better" than hi-ten, but "beneath" CrMo.

In Trek terms (*VERY* generally from 70s/early 80s)
200/300- Hi-Ten
400- CMn w/ Hi-Ten stays and fork
500-CrMo
600- 531 frame with CrMo or CMn stays and fork
700- 531 frame with 531 stays and fork
900- Columbus SL/SP

(yes, the 200/300/400 designation kind of went through changes- and the 600 series was CMn early, then CrMo later until 400 series bikes were built like that in 86... but we're talking generalizations here and the rough idea of the weight/prestige of the tubing) (and yes, "better" is in quotes for a reason)



Ty man!
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 09:14 PM
  #39  
Unholy roller
 
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 6
Likes: 3
From: Pittsburgh pa.

Bikes: Gios Professional, Nishiki Cresta GT, Carlton Raleigh Gran Course

Just the other day I went to buy a 20 dollar tange champion Japanese schwinn super sport for the suntour barcons.. going to use most of the components for a touring bike I'm building for my girlfriend. The guy was so happy I knew a few things about his old bike that he ended up giving me a trek (my gfs size!) 520 frame and a NOS suntour cyclone derailer. Great day. So yes barcons for the win.
Ruethedaze is offline  
Reply
Old 10-11-22 | 10:41 PM
  #40  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by Ruethedaze
Just the other day I went to buy a 20 dollar tange champion Japanese schwinn super sport for the suntour barcons.. going to use most of the components for a touring bike I'm building for my girlfriend. The guy was so happy I knew a few things about his old bike that he ended up giving me a trek (my gfs size!) 520 frame and a NOS suntour cyclone derailer. Great day. So yes barcons for the win.
I didn't know super sports had tange champion... Great bike!
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-12-22 | 12:12 AM
  #41  
Dirt Road Blues's Avatar
Junior Member
Titanium Club Membership
 
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 165
Likes: 163
From: Eugene, OR
Any bike that's sporting Suntour barcons is worth at least 45 bucks!
Dirt Road Blues is offline  
Reply
Old 10-12-22 | 08:46 AM
  #42  
daverup's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 1,670
Likes: 1,975
From: Michigan USA

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes.

Originally Posted by 52telecaster
Not just kidding either except it has the helicomatic hub. If I keep it I'll build new wheels.
I do think you probably have the lower end helicomatic hubs on that Trek. They have suffered more failures due to small ball bearings and gaps at the cone that allow grit in to help them self destruct. I do have a few of these that are undamaged and seem just fine with light usage and periodic cleaning.
The higher end 700 helicomatics were found on some Treks and have some differences as pointed out by JohnDThompson in this post,
Maillard Helicomatic hub question
The labyrinth seals, bigger ball bearings, and better cones make them much better.
The 6 speed helicomatic freewheels I have work pretty well with Shimano indexed shifters as well.
daverup is offline  
Reply
Old 10-12-22 | 10:57 AM
  #43  
shoota's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
10 Anniversary
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,852
Likes: 716
From: Stillwater, OK
Those Treks make nice STI, 700c conversions
__________________
2014 Cannondale SuperSix EVO 2
2019 Salsa Warbird
shoota is offline  
Reply
Old 10-12-22 | 11:37 AM
  #44  
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
10 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,952
Likes: 1,239
From: Menomonee Falls, WI

Bikes: 1984 Schwinn Supersport, 1988 Trek 400T, 1977 Trek TX900, 1982 Bianchi Champione del Mondo, 1978 Raleigh Supercourse, 1986 Trek 400 Elance, 1991 Waterford PDG OS Paramount, 1971 Schwinn Sports Tourer, 1985 Trek 670

Originally Posted by 52telecaster
I didn't know super sports had tange champion... Great bike!
Yup, 84 Supersport with Tange Champion.
tkamd73 is offline  
Reply
Old 10-12-22 | 02:26 PM
  #45  
52telecaster's Avatar
Thread Starter
ambulatory senior
5 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,451
Likes: 4,515
From: Peoria Il

Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.

Originally Posted by shoota
Those Treks make nice STI, 700c conversions
They are just great framesets period. I love 700cs on them with fenders and 35s.... Oh and barcons of course.
52telecaster is offline  
Reply
Old 10-12-22 | 04:45 PM
  #46  
randyjawa's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 12,565
Likes: 2,739
From: Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada - burrrrr!

Bikes: 1958 Rabeneick 120D, 1968 Legnano Gran Premio, 196? Torpado Professional, 2000 Marinoni Piuma

Long have I been a fan of Barcon shifters. The Suntour Barcon...


in my mind is much superior to the Campagnolo version...


But the absolute best Barcon that I have ever used are fitted to my Jamaican Bianchi. Indexed and offers a perfect shift, without hunting for that sweet spot, every time...
__________________
"98% of the bikes I buy are projects".
randyjawa is offline  
Reply

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.