Grenaded a freewheel tool...
#1
Grenaded a freewheel tool...
Found a random wheel with a Sachs LY 96 freewheel, M700 high flange MTB hub. Freewheel frozen, but salvageable, and figured the hub was definitely worth salvaging.
Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!
Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!
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#3
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 1,378
Likes: 876
Bikes: a couple
Found a random wheel with a Sachs LY 96 freewheel, M700 high flange MTB hub. Freewheel frozen, but salvageable, and figured the hub was definitely worth salvaging.
Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!

Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!

Park tool stands behind their product with a lifetime "you bought it, you got it" guarantee.
They say they are forged, I say they are cast. I'd bet money on it.
#4
Hoards Thumbshifters

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,211
Likes: 430
From: Signal Mountain, TN
Bikes: '23 Black Mtn MC, '87 Bruce Gordon Chinook, '08 Jamis Aurora, '86 Trek 560, '97 Mongoose Rockadile, & '91 Trek 750
Found a random wheel with a Sachs LY 96 freewheel, M700 high flange MTB hub. Freewheel frozen, but salvageable, and figured the hub was definitely worth salvaging.
Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!
Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!
#5
Full Member


Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 434
Likes: 296
From: North Seattle
Bikes: Davidson ’81
I’m normally a Park hater but that’s a Shimano TL-FW30 in the picture.
#6
Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 2,985
Likes: 1,852
From: Long Island, NY
Bikes: Trek 800 x 2, Schwinn Heavy Duti, Schwinn Traveler, Schwinn Le Tour Luxe, Schwinn Continental, Cannondale M400 and Lambert, Schwinn Super Sport
That tool does have a thin wall on it. And that is some damage on the tool. Wow. It was hardened. That is for sure.
All I can say is try it again with a new tool or bring it to a bike shop and see if they have better luck.
Heat often helps as well. If things get to the point that you break another tool, dismantle the freewheel so that you can heat up the only inner part of the freewheel without heating up the rest of the freewheel and try it again. Keep cycling the heat until it gives. It will come off.
All I can say is try it again with a new tool or bring it to a bike shop and see if they have better luck.
Heat often helps as well. If things get to the point that you break another tool, dismantle the freewheel so that you can heat up the only inner part of the freewheel without heating up the rest of the freewheel and try it again. Keep cycling the heat until it gives. It will come off.
Last edited by Velo Mule; 01-08-23 at 06:34 PM. Reason: Because I missed the fact that Francophile said that he did the bench mount method.
#7
That tool does have a thin wall on it. And that is some damage on the tool. Wow. It was hardened. That is for sure.
All I can say is try it again with a new tool or bring it to a bike shop and see if they have better luck.
Heat often helps as well. If things get to the point that you break another tool, dismantle the freewheel so that you can heat up the only inner part of the freewheel without heating up the rest of the freewheel and try it again. Keep cycling the heat until it gives. It will come off.
All I can say is try it again with a new tool or bring it to a bike shop and see if they have better luck.
Heat often helps as well. If things get to the point that you break another tool, dismantle the freewheel so that you can heat up the only inner part of the freewheel without heating up the rest of the freewheel and try it again. Keep cycling the heat until it gives. It will come off.
I still have the wheel. I'm actually going to try heating the freewheel, and hit it from the backside with PB to cool it, sometimes that'll wick penetrant up between the metals as it cools. I just don't know if I want to risk exploding another tool. Definitely not going to throw my Bicycle Research version, even though it's thicker-walled and I think he machines from solid block vs. cast+harden, I don't want to grenade it also.
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#9
For S&G, I ordered a couple off the old scammerzon site. One from VANICE, and another from Bikehand. I wanted to try the BW brand, looked similar to the VANICE, the longer body looks appealing. Will see how it goes.
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#11
Senior Member


Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 21,876
Likes: 3,757
Found a random wheel with a Sachs LY 96 freewheel, M700 high flange MTB hub. Freewheel frozen, but salvageable, and figured the hub was definitely worth salvaging.
Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!

Hit it with some PBB to loosen up the freewheel and sit overnight. Freewheel started to spin once the grease dissolved, but the freewheel wasn't budging off the hub with standard force and a 24" adjustable wrench. Slapped my Shimano fw tool in the vice and gave it a couple torques... SMASH! Shattered to many small bits.
I bought this one on Amazon a couple years back to replace my Bicycle Research tools. Knowing Amazon, it's entirely possible it's not even legit, there's so many knockoffs on there anymore.
Anyone seen similar? I've definitely put more force into others. No clue why this blew to bits. Yes, I was definitely spinning the correct way!

#12
Senior Member


Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,761
Likes: 1,546
From: Ouest Seattle
Bikes: Mercian King of Mercia, Surly Long Haul Trucker,81 Fuji Gran Tour SE, 83 Fuji S12S LTD, Voyageur 11.8 chrome, , Voyageur 11.8
In the iffy advice dept, I use a very low powered air impact gun on some stuff like this. My big one would do what just happened, blow the tool apart. My really low power one with air adjustment dialed down sort of beats/vibrates the stuff apart without damaging the tool. You really have to know your air tools to do that. YMMV
#13
Senior Member

Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,612
Likes: 921
From: So Cal, for now
Bikes: 1974 Bob Jackson - Nuovo Record, Brooks Pro, Clips & Straps
BUMMER!
I had a Campagnolo crank removal tool shear in half, if that counts. It broke right at a stress riser which coincided with where the wall was thinnest.
At the time, I was devastated. Obviously, I am still disturbed by it.
I do still have the "peanut butter wrench" that went with it when I purchased the pair.
I had a Campagnolo crank removal tool shear in half, if that counts. It broke right at a stress riser which coincided with where the wall was thinnest.
At the time, I was devastated. Obviously, I am still disturbed by it.
I do still have the "peanut butter wrench" that went with it when I purchased the pair.
#15
In the iffy advice dept, I use a very low powered air impact gun on some stuff like this. My big one would do what just happened, blow the tool apart. My really low power one with air adjustment dialed down sort of beats/vibrates the stuff apart without damaging the tool. You really have to know your air tools to do that. YMMV
Those Campy PB wrenches are the best. I dunno what the hell I'd do without mine. Out of all the tools I own, it and my Campy t-handle are king. I could live without half my tools just having a pair of PBs and one t-handle.
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#16
my guess (and I'm not a metallurgist, not even on TV) is this was just "bad luck" due to the tool being thin-walled, cast steel (and prone to having some hidden defects in that casting process) then heat-treated to make the splines "harder" but the entire tool more brittle, which is a trade-off.
If this had been made by forging and then finished machining it may not have "exploded" but probably cost a great deal more and there are still other ways a tool can fail (broke my heart when a beloved VERY thin-walled Phil splined FW tool "collasped" on me! But my replacement, same tool, has held up).
If this had been made by forging and then finished machining it may not have "exploded" but probably cost a great deal more and there are still other ways a tool can fail (broke my heart when a beloved VERY thin-walled Phil splined FW tool "collasped" on me! But my replacement, same tool, has held up).
#18
Senior Member


Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,511
Likes: 4,929
From: San Jose (Willow Glen) Ca
Bikes: Kirk Custom JK Special, 86 De Rosa Pro, '84 Team Miyata,(dura ace old school) 80?? SR Semi-Pro 600 Arabesque
) i was about to put the exact comment in
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Life is too short not to ride the best bike you have, as much as you can.
Life is too short not to ride the best bike you have, as much as you can.
#19
Senior Member


Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,190
Likes: 5,326
From: Portland, OR
Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder
I look at those hubs and those removers and simply think that's collectively poor design to have one of the most highly torqued tool used on a bike to have that little material at the key spot. And yes, a delicate balancing act between hardness and strength with the real answer being more material.
Both Park and Shimano make good tools. But designing (or not designing and simple following along and making) FWs and hubs that require that thin a tool - well we really need a new metal that is substantially stronger and brittle failure free than steel. Or live our lives dedicated to the notion that FW threads will always be properly greased and not sit for years and decades, then removed. Or just accept that every once in a while, those tools break. (A good reason to clamp them in a vise and turn the wheel with both hands vs using a big wrench. Much less exciting. You don't slam your hands into things.)
Both Park and Shimano make good tools. But designing (or not designing and simple following along and making) FWs and hubs that require that thin a tool - well we really need a new metal that is substantially stronger and brittle failure free than steel. Or live our lives dedicated to the notion that FW threads will always be properly greased and not sit for years and decades, then removed. Or just accept that every once in a while, those tools break. (A good reason to clamp them in a vise and turn the wheel with both hands vs using a big wrench. Much less exciting. You don't slam your hands into things.)
#20
Senior Member


Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,190
Likes: 5,326
From: Portland, OR
Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder
#21
Old fart



Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 26,411
Likes: 5,350
From: Appleton WI
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
I look at those hubs and those removers and simply think that's collectively poor design to have one of the most highly torqued tool used on a bike to have that little material at the key spot. And yes, a delicate balancing act between hardness and strength with the real answer being more material.
Both Park and Shimano make good tools. But designing (or not designing and simple following along and making) FWs and hubs that require that thin a tool - well we really need a new metal that is substantially stronger and brittle failure free than steel. Or live our lives dedicated to the notion that FW threads will always be properly greased and not sit for years and decades, then removed. Or just accept that every once in a while, those tools break. (A good reason to clamp them in a vise and turn the wheel with both hands vs using a big wrench. Much less exciting. You don't slam your hands into things.)
#22
Senior Member


Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,761
Likes: 1,546
From: Ouest Seattle
Bikes: Mercian King of Mercia, Surly Long Haul Trucker,81 Fuji Gran Tour SE, 83 Fuji S12S LTD, Voyageur 11.8 chrome, , Voyageur 11.8
Know your compressor, you mean? You could just dial down the regulator for less kick, right? I contemplated throwing my electric IH on it, but the only impact socket I have in that size is 1/2" and my IH is 3/4" drive. I lack an impact reducer for that stepdown. I thought about whipping out my butterfly IH to feather it out. I can't seem to find that damn thing. I found my impact chisel. Not sure where my butterfly went. So much of my stuff is boxed right now...
Those Campy PB wrenches are the best. I dunno what the hell I'd do without mine. Out of all the tools I own, it and my Campy t-handle are king. I could live without half my tools just having a pair of PBs and one t-handle.
Those Campy PB wrenches are the best. I dunno what the hell I'd do without mine. Out of all the tools I own, it and my Campy t-handle are king. I could live without half my tools just having a pair of PBs and one t-handle.
#23
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 1,596
Likes: 865
From: SW Florida, USA
Bikes: Yes
Last edited by Hondo6; 01-09-23 at 08:19 PM.
#24
Senior Member


Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,190
Likes: 5,326
From: Portland, OR
Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder
Other, thicker-wall tools were available for the Atom/Regina/Zeus splined interface, but those often required removing axle locknuts to seat the tool. In the case of Phil hubs, this wasn't possible, which is why they produced their extra-thin remover tool. That tool became popular with other hubs as well, since there was no need to remove the locknuts to seat the tool.
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#25
Senior Member


Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 14,190
Likes: 5,326
From: Portland, OR
Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder





