smd4

In this hobby/sport, "alignment" means something very specific concerning the frame. I would hope most owners don't align their own frames.

As for Italian bikes, it's simple. Let's go back to my touring bikes example: Italians don't make touring bikes. They make racing bikes. Pure and simple. They've been doing it a long time. They're laser-focused on it. BITD, if you wanted a pure thoroughbred racing bike, you'd often go Italian.

Don't worry--you're not the only one here who feels it's just marketing hype. Just ask Atlas Shrugged. But I'm not sure marketing has much to do with it. I never saw an ad for Cinelli frames/bikes in any of the popular magazines back in the day. They didn't need to advertise.

Japanese bikes were copies. Not bad, mind you. Probably the best frames robots can make. But unless you see your bike purely as a tool, and not something more--an object d'art, embodying true craftsmanship (I know the name of the guy that built my frame)--then you just might not be able to grasp what an Italian frame embodies--and why they continue to command higher prices.

We have a really cool Monet print above our piano. It's a high-quality print, professionally framed. People really like it when they see it.

It pales in comparison to the original work.

Again--stop worrying about why Italian bikes cost more. You obviously prefer Tri bikes, or older, more laid-back bikes. That Gitane--aside from the saddle angle--is a real looker. You clearly know what you like, and that's really important in this hobby. Why is it so important for you to "figure out" why some bikes cost more? Unless you're in this from an investment standpoint--and that's fine if you are, but don't expect to get any return on your investment, no matter what you buy.

You keep saying that you wonder what you're "missing." If you know what you like, why is this so important? Is it FOMO? My son, an artist, likes artwork that simply doesn't appeal to me. I'm sure some of it is priceless. Do I go around all day asking "I wonder what I'm missing? Is there something to that artwork I don't get? Is it just marketing hype?" Of course not. I know what I like, and have zero interest in why something else might be considered more valuable.

Hondo6

Really? Some gentlemen from a Japanese firm called "3Rensho" - namekly, Yoshi Konno, Masahiko Makino, and Koichi Yamaguchi - and probably some others might take issue with that characterization.

The early 3Renshos were indeed very similar to Cinellis - Konno took Cinelli frames left in Japan after the 1964 Olympics apart to learn how to build frames. The later ones? I'd say not really - but YMMV.

No, I don't own one. But I'd love to have one in my size with 126mm or 130mm rear spacing.

Hondo6

Bingo.

FWIW: interestingly enough, one of the things BMW manufactured after World War II that allowed them to survive as a corporation was . . . bicycles.

Atlas Shrugged

They had style you have to give them that.

smd4

Could be an ad for stems or bar tape, for all we know.

Atlas Shrugged

smd4

Cool ad. What year is that?

Atlas Shrugged

I am not a Cinelli expert, but the early eighties for SLX in the other Italian bikes manufactured back in the day.

smd4

That ad is a bit repetitive, isn't it?

panzerwagon 

That looks like the one-time columbus cromor mens sana frame from 1989 (same as mine).

Wildwood 

Just for the record,
Old Italian bike companies like Bianchi, Frejus, Olmo have been producing a wide range of bicycles for well over a century. What they export to other markets does not reflect the range of production. Italian artisans clearly needed to focus on the high end bikes to be financially viable.

CliffordK

I've put a lot of miles on an old Colnago Super. Probably around 1968/1969 year. They're nice bikes for bikes of the era. But, so much has moved on since then.

By the 80's Colnago had begun with different lines experimenting with tubing shapes and sizes which makes for some of the more iconic models.

I'm not sure there would be a huge difference between Colnago, Bianchi, or one of several other brands. Especially as one moves from the introduction of the Super around 1968 to the late 70's and early 80's. Do all bikes converge.

I just picked up a Nishiki Pro that I'll have to tune up and try out.

Classtime 

Lets please stop calling the Ironman a laid back tri-bike. 73-73 is not laid back and 1m wheelbase for large frames is pretty tight.

repechage

post of the day.

smd4

Who said such a thing??

repechage

there were oblique distortions and sweeping generalizations as to design conventions of different nationalities of bikes and type. Yeah, not absolutely direct but employing the distributive property.

smd4

Why is it so difficult to just say, “no one?” It would have been a helluva lot easier than typing all that mumbo-jumbo.

Classtime 

Who said this when the OP says he really likes and prefers his IM?

smd4

Where does that say “laid back tri-bikes??”

Answer: it doesn’t.

smd4

Here you go, Classtime— here are a bunch of words that you can re-arrange into some other phrase or sentence with which you can be offended:

slack, tri, trail, relaxed, long, lively, sluggish, bike, heavy, touring, mellow.

I’m sure it’ll be just as easy to twist these words around as it was the words in my earlier statement.

AdventureManCO 

You know, I've got an Ironman, AND a PX-10, AND a Gitane, just like the OP. The only thing I'm missing is the Colnago, and the OP doesn't like his...

Kabuki12

perhaps it will fit you better than it fits the OP. To me, the way it’s set up does not do any bike justice.

repechage

The irony was lost for you.

many of the handling and ride response descriptions in this thread are indeed word salad.

jethin

Personally I don’t think the marque or the builder matters much at all. How well a bike rides is really up to how well it’s built up and how well it suits its rider. The rest is hype and marketing.

But what would we do here without endless debates over how good a certain brand or steel is?

smd4

Plus, you have one other bike the OP doesn’t have…