Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

odd raleigh fork attachment hardware

Search
Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

odd raleigh fork attachment hardware

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 12-13-25 | 11:20 PM
  #1  
Thread Starter
Senior Member
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 505
Likes: 145
From: seoul korea

Bikes: 3Rensho SuperRecord Export, Bridgestones MB1 RB1 XO2, Colnago Super, Medici GranTurismo, Schwinn Paramount, Olmo Competition, Raleigh Portage, Miyata 1000, Stumpjumper, Lotus Competition, Nishiki Maxima, Panasonic DX6000, Zeus Criterium

odd raleigh fork attachment hardware

i've been overhauling vintage bikes for a long time. lots of bicycles. i've never encountered this particular fork attachment : looks like a flip down lawyer lip to capture the front axle?


brooklyn_bike is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 01:12 AM
  #2  
bulgie's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,701
Likes: 5,481
From: Seattle
Exactly. I don't think it satisfied the lawyers though, because it's not passive, it requires the user to do something. My guess is, most owners did not do it, probably ignored or removed the thing.
bulgie is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 01:44 AM
  #3  
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
10 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 511
Likes: 411
From: San Francisco - it used to be nice

Bikes: 1970 Alex Singer, 63 Hetchins, 75 Motobecane Townie, more . . .

Looks like it was influenced by the earlier, and IMHO much better design that Schwinn used as a safety feature.

Manufacturers were clutching for straws in that era to try and lower the number of Product Liability lawsuits.
vintage cellar is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 08:32 AM
  #4  
JohnDThompson's Avatar
Old fart
Titanium Club Membership
20 Anniversary
Community Builder
 
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 26,318
Likes: 5,226
From: Appleton WI

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Originally Posted by vintage cellar
Looks like it was influenced by the earlier, and IMHO much better design that Schwinn used as a safety feature.
Yes, it's a CSPC-required axle-retention device. And yes, Schwinn's design was much better.

JohnDThompson is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 08:35 AM
  #5  
JohnDThompson's Avatar
Old fart
Titanium Club Membership
20 Anniversary
Community Builder
 
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 26,318
Likes: 5,226
From: Appleton WI

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Originally Posted by bulgie
Exactly. I don't think it satisfied the lawyers though, because it's not passive, it requires the user to do something. My guess is, most owners did not do it, probably ignored or removed the thing.
All the CPSC-approved front wheel retention devices require user intervention to remove and reinstall the front wheel.
JohnDThompson is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 10:03 AM
  #6  
Chuckk's Avatar
Groupetto Dragon-Ass
20 Anniversary
 
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,026
Likes: 1,581
From: Lostin Austin, TX
You gotta hand it to the guy that realized that bending one tip on each side of the front dropout out would satisfy CPSC.
Chuckk is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 11:11 AM
  #7  
noglider's Avatar
aka Tom Reingold
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 44,124
Likes: 6,341
From: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA

Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem

I never had difficulty operating QR skewers but a lot of people do. I'm sure many of us have seen people who screw the skewer tight without flipping the lever. I taught a class for adults and was very explicit: "Test to see if it's adjusted right by flipping. It should be hard but possible to close. When you have it adjusted right, do not screw it tight; flip it closed." I showed it very clearly. And half my students screwed it tight anyway. Oy vey. And I suppose this is a reason thru-axles come on new bikes.

Given that we can't change human nature, I'll concede that the change is a good one. I don't wish a falling-off front wheel on anyone.
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is online now  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 02:57 PM
  #8  
steelbikeguy's Avatar
Senior Member
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,304
Likes: 4,800
From: Peoria, IL
Originally Posted by noglider
I never had difficulty operating QR skewers but a lot of people do. I'm sure many of us have seen people who screw the skewer tight without flipping the lever. I taught a class for adults and was very explicit: "Test to see if it's adjusted right by flipping. It should be hard but possible to close. When you have it adjusted right, do not screw it tight; flip it closed." I showed it very clearly. And half my students screwed it tight anyway. Oy vey. And I suppose this is a reason thru-axles come on new bikes.

Given that we can't change human nature, I'll concede that the change is a good one. I don't wish a falling-off front wheel on anyone.
I've seen people treat QR skewers like wingnuts too, and was a bit amazed. Perhaps I over-estimate the mechanical aptitude of the average person?

The through-axle does seem like a solution that satisfies people's urge to screw things together, but I've wondered if bikes with rim brakes wouldn't be better off with wingnuts? ... at least for those folks who are challenged by QR's? My first 10 speed was equipped with them, and for a Montgomery Ward bike, they were a bit exotic!! There's a bit of a compromise in the wingnuts, though. The wings weren't long enough, on average, to get much torque. OTOH, I still use a Hi-E hub with its little half-wingnut method of attachment. The wing is only a bit under 1" long, and it is adequate to hold the front wheel on.



Steve in frigid Peoria
steelbikeguy is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 05:26 PM
  #9  
bulgie's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,701
Likes: 5,481
From: Seattle
Originally Posted by steelbikeguy
I still use a Hi-E hub with its little half-wingnut method of attachment. The wing is only a bit under 1" long, and it is adequate to hold the front wheel on.
In Harlan's defense, he also sold a cutter for machining* a circular groove in the face of the dropout, for the slow-release to positively key into. I have the tool (I'm a toolaholic) but I have never used it! The only bike I had with the wing-skewer had chrome-plated dropout faces, and I assume the chrome would dull that cutter, like instantly. Even tool steel properly hardened shouldn't be used on chrome.

*Is it "machining" if you just turn the cutter by hand?



bulgie is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 07:05 PM
  #10  
steelbikeguy's Avatar
Senior Member
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,304
Likes: 4,800
From: Peoria, IL
Originally Posted by bulgie
In Harlan's defense, he also sold a cutter for machining* a circular groove in the face of the dropout, for the slow-release to positively key into. I have the tool (I'm a toolaholic) but I have never used it! The only bike I had with the wing-skewer had chrome-plated dropout faces, and I assume the chrome would dull that cutter, like instantly. Even tool steel properly hardened shouldn't be used on chrome.

*Is it "machining" if you just turn the cutter by hand?
Harlan must live in some sort of protective field... how did QR skewers end up having to add various mechanisms to make it nearly(?) impossible to hurt yourself with them, but Harlans half wingnut never caused him to get hauled into court?? Was he just too small for the CPSC to see? Or was it that the parts didn't have any manufacturer marks for the lawyers to find?
Or did you have to have some "expertise" just to order his stuff, unlike the random mom and pop that found their way into a Schwinn shop?

Of course, some folks with expertise were not fond of Harlan's work. I recall Larry Black at the 2018 CR gathering giving a talk about Harlan's pedal, with various digressions into some of the unusual things he saw when he visited Harlan's production space. It was quite the talk!




Steve in Peoria
steelbikeguy is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 08:59 PM
  #11  
noglider's Avatar
aka Tom Reingold
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 44,124
Likes: 6,341
From: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA

Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem

Wingnuts didn't work so well on rear wheels of bikes with horizontal dropouts. As you pedal, you can pull the wheel forward and jam it into your seat tube or chain stay. It's hard to get the wing nuts tight enough to prevent this. This, I believe, is why Campagnolo invented the QR skewer.
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is online now  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 09:53 PM
  #12  
steelbikeguy's Avatar
Senior Member
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,304
Likes: 4,800
From: Peoria, IL
Originally Posted by noglider
Wingnuts didn't work so well on rear wheels of bikes with horizontal dropouts. As you pedal, you can pull the wheel forward and jam it into your seat tube or chain stay. It's hard to get the wing nuts tight enough to prevent this. This, I believe, is why Campagnolo invented the QR skewer.
My experience with wingnuts was limited to that Montgomery Wards bike, and I don't recall any issues with them... but I wasn't putting a ton of miles on it. I wonder if any of our C&V friends have extensive experience?

Considering the general popularity of wingnuts for high end bikes for some time(?), I'm guessing that slippage wasn't a serious problem. If it was, it wouldn't have been that hard to just go back to nuts and a wrench. Tullio Campagnolo is said to have invented the quick release because he couldn't loosen a wingnut. No mentions of any slippage issues. If I had to guess, it might be the case that you had to really lean on those wingnuts to avoid slippage, thus making them hard to remove when dealing with cold temperatures??

Looking at Tullio's timeline again, I see that he came up with the idea in 1930. I think wingnuts continued to be used for some time after that, but don't currently have any data to support that hypothesis. I still find them interesting.

Steve in Peoria
steelbikeguy is offline  
Reply
Old 12-14-25 | 10:43 PM
  #13  
bulgie's Avatar
Senior Member
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,701
Likes: 5,481
From: Seattle
Yes pro racers used wingnuts with horizontal dropouts, so it's clearly possible to do them up tight enough for a pro.

The origin story (which might even be true...) of Tullio's QR says it was on Croce D'Aune, a pass in the Dolomites, where his fingers were too cold.
bulgie is offline  
Reply
Old 12-17-25 | 07:49 AM
  #14  
thinktubes's Avatar
weapons-grade bolognium
Titanium Club Membership
15 Anniversary
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,606
Likes: 3,306
From: Across the street from Chicago

Bikes: Battaglin Cromor, Ciocc Designer 84, Schwinn Superior 1981

Originally Posted by noglider
Wingnuts didn't work so well on rear wheels of bikes with horizontal dropouts. As you pedal, you can pull the wheel forward and jam it into your seat tube or chain stay. It's hard to get the wing nuts tight enough to prevent this. This, I believe, is why Campagnolo invented the QR skewer.
I found out that they don’t work well on front wheels whilst popping wheelies…
thinktubes is offline  
Reply
Old 12-18-25 | 02:56 PM
  #15  
John E's Avatar
feros ferio
25 Anniversary
 
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 22,397
Likes: 1,864
From: www.ci.encinitas.ca.us

Bikes: 1959 Capo Modell Campagnolo; 1960 Capo Sieger (2); 1962 Carlton Franco Suisse; 1970 Peugeot UO-8; 1982 Bianchi Campione d'Italia; 1988 Schwinn Project KOM-10;

Originally Posted by steelbikeguy
I've seen people treat QR skewers like wingnuts too, and was a bit amazed. Perhaps I over-estimate the mechanical aptitude of the average person?

The through-axle does seem like a solution that satisfies people's urge to screw things together, but I've wondered if bikes with rim brakes wouldn't be better off with wingnuts? ... at least for those folks who are challenged by QR's? My first 10 speed was equipped with them, and for a Montgomery Ward bike, they were a bit exotic!! There's a bit of a compromise in the wingnuts, though. The wings weren't long enough, on average, to get much torque. OTOH, I still use a Hi-E hub with its little half-wingnut method of attachment. The wing is only a bit under 1" long, and it is adequate to hold the front wheel on.



Steve in frigid Peoria
Ah -- the QR "skewer of death." I bought a pair of nice wheels with tubular rims and low-flange Campag. hubs and a hi-E front skewer. That thing is neither quick nor safe -- there were a lot of scary stories of skewer snappage. I switched to a conventional QR skewer and never looked back.

Fortunately, I have four ca. 1960 frames whose forks are devoid of gimmicks.
__________________
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
John E is offline  
Reply
Old 12-18-25 | 09:18 PM
  #16  
ShannonM's Avatar
Senior Member
5 Anniversary
Community Builder
Community Influencer
 
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 1,813
Likes: 1,478
From: Oakland, CA
I find that telling people straight out, "It's not a weirdo one-armed half-arsed wingnut." pretty much always works. You have to break through the fact that not only do Q/R skewers not work like how they look like they work, they don't work the way anything else the newbie has ever used works. And I do mean nothing. I can't think of anything that J. Random Larval Cyclist will have used that uses a side-turning camming clamp to pinch a thing into another thing.

We forget it, but quick release skewers are really friggin' weird.

--Shannon
ShannonM is offline  
Reply

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.