I make them for myself as well. I order "best quality" corks from "WidgetCo" (the forum will not allow me to post links until I have at least ten posts) and grind them to shape on a bench mounted belt sander. This works shockingly quickly and it's easy to burn right through them - expect a short, steep learning curve! Once I have them shaped into the appropriate rectangles (I keep a factory rubber pad on hand with which to compare) I cut in the bevels with a coarse hand file. It now takes me a couple of minutes per block, and I only screw up about ten percent of them.

(I had considered the "composite" corks but was afraid that whatever material is used to hold them together would melt onto the rims. It is interesting to hear that another poster uses them. I will have to give them a try.)

Thanks! That widgetco site looks pretty neat for other things too. I was in Lisbon a year ago and was tempted to buy a big block of cork at a cork store but passed. I'm currently visiting my newborn, first grandson in Switzerland. My son is a mechanical engineer (those genes passed me by) with a shop in his basement. I brought an old seatpost that fits the wine corks well along with bobsyourbike pdf, some brake pad holders and some cork bottle stoppers for a father/son project, which we were just discussing over breakfast. I"m sure I have the necessary tools at home but it will be more fun this way.

Did anybody manage to snag the S-Works Hell of the North for $49.97 at Incycle? I found them through this thread here in C&V but was out and about; they were gone when I had the time.

They do still list the S-Works Tracer in stock, here. Practically free shipping, too (starts at $50 so even if you're getting only one, just toss in a pack of patches or whatever to qualify).

Speaking of corks, and on a related note, but still within the Totally Tubular milieu:
When I was first riding, a neat trick was to put a small bottle cork in the ferrules of your rims and cut it off flush, to provide a uniform surface to glue the tire to, and also to keep glue out of your ferrules. An additional benefit was, it pre-loads the nipples and keeps them from unwinding. It's a great trick even today. My 1950 Paramount track bike came with wheels that were corked like this from new. So when I did the complete spa treatment on this bike, I wanted to shine up the hubs, rims, and spokes, so took them all apart and did that, and built them back up even with the original spokes, which shined up surprisingly well. And then re-corked the rims. Knocked them in and shaved off the excess with a razor blade. I have most of that bag of corks left if anyone wants to try this. Say $10 for two wheels worth. Take a look

1950 Paramount Track | Flickr

My first coach had raced in the 1940s - and his father raced in the 1920s! - and he told me to always cork my rims and "key" the rim bed (which just meant putting deep scratches across it to give the glue something to stick to.) I stopped doing it decades ago, but your post sure brings back some memories.

I never believed in that business of scratching the rim. You aren't adding enough surface area to ever make a difference. Best is to get the rim as clean as possible like I did above so glue will do its job. Or tape in my case. Tires are very difficult to get off with Tufo tape. I consider that a good thing. I can get them off easy enough when I want to, but they are never coming off on their own.

Maybe back in the old days with glue made of who knows what, tires rolling off was a problem, but today's adhesives are extremely strong.

Bob Freeman

I have never had an issue any of the various brands of tubular cement (mastic). I preferred some brands over others, and part of that was no doubt based on familiarity with working with them. I lament the loss of the “red” cements like Clement and Vittoria as they were very good at building a “base” of adhesive on the rim. As long as the adhesive is clean and not too old-both of these items are key- I find it to be the preferred surface to get a good bond. You also don’t want too much of a buildup of glue. To achieve the best bond you want the right amount of glue, not too much or too little. It’s rarely discussed, but technique in mounting is key. I find it best to mount the tire a few minutes after applying a layer of glue….not too wet and not too dry. I can’t describe it further as it is something that must be seen and felt….The time that it takes to reach the proper point is dependent on both temperature and humidity. Also, after mounting and straightening the tire, it is EXTREMELY a important to inflate fully (like 100 psi) and roll the tire against the floor surface while pressing down to firmly press the basetape against the rim surface. Distribution of glue on the rim surface is very important. It’s hard or impossible to do this by squeezing the glue out of a tube alone. I prefer a brush, like an acid brush yo make sure that the coverage is complete from edge to edge of the rim mounting surface. Many people run a bead down the center of the rim and depend on the tire to squish the glue. That is both inadequate and sloppy. For it to work it also misses the correct tackiness of the mastic for proper adhesion. For these reasons, I generally use glue from a can and usually thin it a bit to get the viscosity right for good coverage. Over the years, I have used the following brands of cement: Clement, Vittoria (both red and amber), Continental, Wolber, Gommitalia, Pastali, Panaracer, Tubasti, Vredestein, Challenge, and probably a few others that don’t come to mind. Of the ones available today, my favorite is Tubasti which some people find difficult to use. It’s also important to set the freshly mounted tire/wheel aside after mounting for curing…using my method, I find that overnight/8hours is enough for maximum strength. So, those are some semi random thoughts on my own technique. Any method that achieves a good bond is valid and there are plenty of others. I like to say that there are as many methods of mounting tubulars as there are religions, and only a few each involve the handling of poisonous snakes.

To the above, I was taught to use a dowel rod or broom handle and roll a freshly mounted but deflated tire over the length of the rod to really give the glue an even squish. Then overinflate the tire to cure. Many ways to skin a cat and all that, but something to add.

Was overjoyed last year when I got my Roberts and found a set of NOS Mavic Argent-8 rims for it 28h. I like light wheels. I've ridden it a dozen times and it feels great. But yesterday I swerved to miss a pothole and of course steered my rear wheel right into it and destroyed the rim. The liability of light weight rims. I'd like to replace it with a Argent-10 for a little more strength, since it will match the looks. Anyone have one in 28h? NOS or mint?
Bob Freeman

Psimet2001 Sorry for the late reply...have not been on thread in awhile.

I purchased used a few years ago so do not know how long the tire had been glued. And then the wheel sat in the garage in Central Texas for another couple years. The glue was petrified and shredded the tire coming off. Should have used a heat gun to try and loosen first. The glue was extremely hard and the temps outside were hot so the solvents evaporated quickly...not able to soak very well. The MS and n-butyl acetate have cleaned it up pretty good. Life events have gotten in the way so have not completely finished...only bits of shiny glue left to do. The wheel stares me in the face everytime I walk into the garage. I assume Continental glue used as that is what came with the bike when I purchased.

OOF!…Just as an outside chance, maybe check with Ben’s Cycles as perhaps there was one or several in the Euro Asia treasure trove…
I used to build the wheels for my teammates. Mavic GP 4s were the standard rim by the mid 80s for us. One teammate in particular, who was not particularly heavy at 150 lbs, got me to build him a set of race wheels using GL330s. Everything worked out fine and he was using them as his primary race wheels for several months. He liked the way they felt enough for him to get a set of GEL 280s and he showed up at my house one evening with the rims and a pair of matching 28 hole Campy hubs (we were all racing on 32 spoke wheels, save for time trials). I expressed my reservations, but built the wheels. He christened the wheels at a downtown criterium. The race was the usual manic NASCAR on two wheels and about ten laps in we were alongside one another long enough for him to tell me how much he loved the wheels. No more than two laps later as we were coming out of a corner, I saw that the field was about to overtake him riding slowly off to one side with a visible bump…bump…as he soft pedaled. It turns out that he went over a utility cover that was a bit recessed and the impact was just too much. Despite all of that, there is NOTHING that feels quite like a set of lightweight tubular wheels with matching lightweight supple tires…I hope you can find a suitable replacement rim…

I've had GEL 280s, Ambrosio Cronos, and Fiamme Yellows and Ergals since the late 70s, my racing days. I rarely weigh over 150 lbs and "ride light" so I've had really good luck with them. In more recent years I've built even lighter wheels including a couple pairs of 24h and one pair of vintage 20h (Scheeren Weltmeisters). This was pure dumb luck to crash the Mavic yesterday. I was distracted by something off the road and when I looked back there were the potholes. The winter wasn't harsh here but it was very wet at times and it's taken a toll on some roads.
Bob Freeman

I always was jealous of folks who could get away with light wheels. I raced at 158 pounds, but as a 6'1" sprinter, and trashed several GEL 280s before I wised up. I could get away with 330s, barely, with at least 32 spokes. Mostly I counted on GP4s and SSCs with 36 holes.

I have a pair of 27mm Challenge Elite tubular tires. I stretched them on some rims, hung them from a hook, then promptly forgot about them for a couple months. This morning, moving stuff around, I needed to reclaim the hook for something else. The tires seem (using an educated thumb) to probably still be holding about 80psi. What are the tubes in those puppies made of? I have no normal butyl tubes which would hold air pressure that long.

I used to run Vittoria Rubino 28mm tubulars (butyl 80psi) and they would stay up for a couple of months.
But I always inflate the bike I'm taking our so I don't know exactly what pressure they got down to.

My Vittoria Corsa 28mm (latex 80psi) lost 10 psi in a day last week.

Challenge claims a "budget" butyl tube, which I assume means "thick".

And I'll bet even with a couple of months of stretching, it'll still be too tight.

About like my Vittoria Corsa tubulars.

I don't think even Vittoria Rally tubulars hold air this well.

Whatever they use, they do hold pretty well. I have some ERE tubulars that also come from Lion Tyre like Challenge, and they hold air pretty well too. Tufo probably hold air the best. They are "tubeless" meaning the whole tire is the tube.

I saw some tubulars marked "Panracer Practice Tubular".

Are these for use only on trainers, or are the road tires that are just heavier (and cheaper)???

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Just bought the same tires from TrackSuperMarket (Japan). They're called training tires. Heavy at 270 gms.

Road tires for training rides.Note that they do NOT have removable valve cores.

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lankytwo and top506
Are they a stronger tire or just a cheaper tire (or both?)

I use the Panaracer Practice and consider them the best tire in that price range. (It's worth noting that price tags are all over the place. When I find them for under $60, I stock up. $80 to $90 seems more common, which is a bit too much in my opinion, and the places selling them for $100-$120 are off their rockers.)

They tend to be straighter and rounder than all but top-shelf handmade tires, and they mount fairly easily - overly-tight tires are a pet peeve.

I haven't found them more or less puncture resistant than other tires in this class. They do seem to last a bit longer; I suspect one reason for the excess weight is a somewhat thicker tread.

They are just basic tires. Panaracer makes good stuff. Not really in the caliber of say, Vittoria or Veloflex, but good sturdy tires. Panaracer has made these for more than 40 years. I was warehouse manager at Sekai in the late 70s and we sold a lot of them under their "Sekai-Deluxe" label. A good go-to tire for riders who couldn't afford the good stuff. West Coast Cycle also sold them under their CyclePro brand.
Bob Freeman