I have a bike in new shape and i need a rear changer. now i do not know alot about Campy so when looking at e bay etc., I do not know what the look of a Campy rear changer out of the 60's or 70's would look like.

Can you help?

Buy the way, I am going to use down tube shifters.

It should be either a Nuovo Record or a Super Record. The Nouvo was top end from the late 60's until Super Record came out in the latter 70's. Nouvo was made alongside Super into the mid 80's. I know there are people on C&V that can give you exact years. Check out www.campyonly.com. My understanding is that Nuovo is functionally very similar to Super, with the latter being slightly lighter because of titanium hardware. The Nuovo is all silver finished while the Super has some black anodized parts.

another resource

In the early 1960s, a high-end bike would have come with a Gran Sport:

Yeah, what he said.

50s and 60s, Gran Sport chrome rear derailler with the box front... early 60s they added the Record rear which looks the same as a Gran Sport but says Record and the Record front derailler, which looks like a Nouvo Record but with a cable stop built in the body.

Nuovo Record was an alloy bodied rear, came out late 60s, Super Record, early-mid 70s had a revised cage and some black parts, but they are functionally similar. So is the Nuovo Gran Sport by the way, a cheapened version of the NR.

Avoid the Valentinos, Veloxes and variants, a cheap stamped steel rear designed to bring Campagnolo to the masses that made Huret look highly functional.

And a dork disc too?

To avoid putting out the kind of misinformation that tends to be self-perpetuating, it is not true that a cable stop distinguishes a Record from a Nuovo Record front derailleur. They're all "Record" models, and in fact, there was overlap in the appearance of the cable stop/non-cable stop Record fronts. They were simply different modifications (among a number) to the basic design, as opposed to anything Campagnolo considered a new item.

What was it called when you bought a Nouvo Record Groupo?

Technically, you're probably right, in a catalog studying sort of way, but as I said before, I'm using the common language of the user of the time. In my opinion the Record front became the Nuovo Record front when they came out with the Nuovo Record double cable guide. Prior to that the Record used the Gran Sport cable guide, that's why it needed the stop built in. Removing the stop was "new", certainly newer than other modifications, whether they officially called Nouvo or not. There was no general access to catalogs in the 60s and 70s, nobody really cared, people just called the parts as to what group they came from. Even Campagnolo was inconsistent in how they labeled things. Maybe it all got lost in the translation from Italian to English.

When I say Record or Nuovo Record front, 99% of the people I've known around bicycles know what I'm talking about without confusion.

Yeah, I know, there ain't no Tipo hubs either, but that's what people call them.

You're welcome to split your hairs however you choose.

That's the first thing I removed after buying the bike.

A previous owner had geared it 58(!)-45 in front, with the original 14-16-18-20-22 Caimi freewheel, and the 21-tooth total drop (58-45+22-14) was a bit much for the Gran Sport, which is much happier with half-step gearing, such as my current 49-46 / 14-16-18-21-24-26. I suspect the dork disc was used to mitigate the risk posed by the burst of chain slack which accompanied any downshift in front.

(If anyone really wants a 6-bolt 157mm BCD 58-tooth aluminum chainring in good condition at a good price, PM me. I have already found a good home for the Caimi freewheel.)

I want to one of the webs listed and found this Campagnolo Nuovo Gran SportCampagnolo3500(Nuovo) Gran Sport1974 - 1985

I have one of these but it seems short to carry the chain amount I would like.

Here is what start this all. I had a 1st gen. Rally long cage on it, but the shifting was bad. I liked the look, but can't see riding it because of the shifting so I wanted to see if a better rear shifter was made that could fit into my 70's look.

I hope that helps further. Anybody knwowhat I could look for that would fit in and shift OK for club rides? A picture would be great.

The:
Campagnolo 980Campagnolo6011/009801980 - 1985
doesn't look bad. Could be a bit short. Could I find one of them and would it be better?

How much chain do you need to wrap? I've routinely run 14/28 freewheels with NR for over 30 years, even with triples.

The R, GS, NR, SR, and NGS are all effectively the same design and function more or less the same.

I will get back to you on this after going home this weekend and counting the teeth. It is a triple front, but I am unsure about the back at this time.

The secret is in the offset pulley cage pivot. In the original GS design, the pivot and the two pulley axles are all colinear, which provides significantly less chain wrap for a given cage length. As 1.5-step gearing began to displace half-step, Campagnolo found a clever way to wrap more chain.

Gran Sport has a different cage design and will not wrap up the same amount as the original steel Record RD, Nuovo Record (all generations), SR first-gen and Nuovo GS. At least, not without undertensioning it in the small-small combo, and likely grinding the forward pulley wheel into the cogs when shifting up the cluster.

Super Record second-generation has a revised pulley cage and parallelogram angle, and may take up more chain then NR. This said, I am not certain - don't quote me on it.

-Kurt

P.S.: The NR FD shown on your machine has an advantage, as the Campagnolo hanger adapter swings the parallelogram of the derailer farther forward then the built-in hanger of a Campagnolo 1010 dropout.

-Kurt