norskagent

I'm building up a set of wheels w/ 70s campy high flange track hubs - the rear hub has threading on one side only, so will I need to dish? Or no dish like a flip flop hub?

John E

I believe you should build it undished, but this is very easy for you to determine this empirically. As you lace up the spokes, eyeball the rim to be centered relative to the two ends of the axle. For initial alignment, I sight down through the rim's valve hole to see if the hub's snap-on oil hole cover (if present) lies directly in front of the far side of the rim. Set the complete, untensioned wheel in the frame backwards and forwards, and fine-tune the spoke lengths so that the rim sits centered on the frame in both orientations. Now bring the spokes up to proper tension, and you are good to go.

norskagent

Thanks! The hubs have no oil port hole but I will work something out -

dbakl

Flip the wheel in the stand as you true and center the rim between the lock nuts. I believe a track wheel does have some dish.

norskagent

I'm not sure of my front chainline measurement yet, but it's an old track frame. Don't know if the BB I have for it is sized for track or gears.

Scooper

As dbakl notes, there will be dish.

Chainline diagram from Campagnolo catalog 16:

norskagent

What does the "B" dimension "sprocket width" define? On the diagram, it looks like it's from the inside of the dropout to the outside of the hub barrel? Sheldon says to measure from dropout to center of cog -

"Measure the distance from the inside of the rear fork end (or the outside of the axle locknut) to the middle of the sprocket".

dbakl

Looks like cog seat of hub to outside cone locknut to me.

Scooper

That's what it looks like to me, too. It could be that Saint Sheldon's definition is just different from Campagnolo's.

pax139

I just ordered parts to build a wheel with old Campy high flange record track hubs, the same as yours most likely. It does need a dish on the rear hub. It's not much though.
For me, I am doing a 4cross on a 36 hole hub with DT Swiss RR1.1 rims. I needed 295mm spokes for one side and 297 mm spokes for the other.
Hope this helps

norskagent

Thanks, I was going to do 3 cross w/ the same DT Swiss rims. My spoke lengths figured to be 284 and 286 I think.

dbakl

Hmmm, I've always used 293 front and rear, for Camp high-flange 3x to 700c or sewup...

Maybe the tighter dish is requiring shorter spokes.

Scooper

The ERD can vary quite a bit between rims even if they're both 700C rims.

unworthy1

and just to sidetrack the thread a little: I've always had to subtract at least 1mm (sometimes more) from the numbers the spoke calculators provide. I usually try 2 or 3 calculators to see how they compare with the same dimensions input and then take the shortest spoke numbers but buy even shorter; they all seem to ere on the plus side in my experience (YRMV).

Scooper

I do that too. If a spoke is half a millimeter too long, you'll bottom out the nipple on the threads before achieving the desired tension. I always round down.

Charles Wahl

Spocalc and Sutherland's agree that Record track high-flange hubs should be dished 44 mm from wheel center to left flange, 31 mm from wheel center to right flange. Sutherland's says that left locknut to left flange is 16 mm, right locknut to right flange is 29 mm, for 120 mm dropout spacing.

Deanster04

see if you can borrow a dishing tool and check the wheel just as you would a standard wheel. I have my 1963 track bike with several sets of wheels and all rear wheels ARE dished to center the wheel in the frame. You will need to verify your chain line to make sure the BB/axel and cranks are matched to the bike. Chain line is critical on a track bike as there is nothing to take up chain slack like the DR on a regular bike. If your chain line is wrong on a track bike you will wear out chains, cogs, and chain rings rapidly.

norskagent

apparently the search feature here doesn't work for topic titles...
anyway, I started building the wheels last night, so far so good.
However, I noticed the rear axle of the campy track hub is slightly longer on the drive side.
When placed in the rear dropouts of my track frame, the drive side axle nut engages fully when tightened, but the non-drive side axle nut has some threads exposed when tight. Why would the axle be offset like that?

dbakl

Adjust the cones so the extra axle is equal on both sides. Operator error...

norskagent

I thought there would be a way to equalize it but I wasn't sure. The front hub axle is fine, just checked.

Antipodes

+1 on that! I've tried the DT Swiss calc. and a few others and they always seem to give imprecise lengths, typically at least 1 or 2mm too long. I use online calculators to get in the ball park, and then trial and error for the correct length.