So, tell me, what is CR? I might want to go there.

Sure are, Charles - to quote from Claud Butler's 1935 catalogue description, "Special design (forks), 'HM' butted (tubing) straight blades with abrupt offset at tip." These were advertised as available in either "D" section to round, or 7/8th inch round tapered.

Mine are the tapered round ones, round section all through.

With the slack head angle and massive fork offset in what is still a (relatively) short wheelbase, the handling is smooth and not at all twitchy - but it descends as if on rails. Probably not so good for a sudden change of direction, but SO comfortable and relaxing to ride fast. Tracks straight, even uphill. Toe clip clearance is OK too! I've grown to love it already.

https://www.classicrendezvous.com/

To join their email list (40-70 emails a day)
https://www.classicrendezvous.com/CR_list_rules.htm
https://www.phred.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous

Your concerns are unfounded. Stone knows bikes. He's not a chopper/flipper. He's a class act professional with the best damn collections in the world. He knows what he is doing.

Don't F....with Mr. Stone

Just an asided-

Last fall I found a frame on E-bay, the oping bid on which I thought about twice what it should have been. I noticed in the Seller's other auctions he had stripped the enitre bike and was selling it piece- meal. I sent the seller an offer on the frame, but told him I wanted the entire collection; frame and parts. To make a long story short, I got everything but the cranks (they had already sold) for a tad what he was asking for the frame plus shipping. Mind you. this is a much more pedestrian bike than what Mr. Stone deals with, but it is nice to know that some folks are not just chopping things up for the sum of their parts.

Does anyone know what happened to the Sultan? Not trying to hijack this thread, just curious.

He has been away for a while. It's not the first time. He'll be back, I'm sure.

OK, so I've read this thread and I think what is happening is the "original v hotrod" arguments even if in relation to selling.

It seems like some people are a little fixated on what came originally on the frame and such when in reality many top bikes can be optioned any way you want when you first buy them. Components are just the collection of parts you choose to use. A dedicated rider is going to opt for the tip top while someone else is just fine with midrange, even if the frame is the same.
So....
What's wrong with selling the frame and then letting someone else option it out?
What's wrong with selling the parts so someone else can option a bike the way they want?

These parts are not being sold to scrap metal dealers! They are going to people with bikes or with parts etc. so what's the big stink? Parts may have come off of rusty frames or frames could have had broken parts etc. What do people do with old bikes they don't care about? Trash. Isn't it better that those get a second life instead of crushed?

I have an old BMW that had base model parts and I've optioned it up to the highest model just by getting them at junkyards. I'm glad junkyards exist and cars are not crushed immediately when they break down. I'm also glad I can sell off any desireable parts I find to people who are going to use them too.

That may be, but it's still sad to see a bike that managed to survive for 60 years broken down for parts.

That's what the thread is about.

I'm not against parting old bikes except when it's known to be all original and as it left the shop. Otherwise, it's well known that in the 40s and 50s most people in the UK bought frames and then built it up using parts they already had from their previous machine and then went on to replace those parts as they managed to lay their hands on better ones. Pretty much what most people here do, I think. A different period but I have an '82 Trek 730 that was only available from the maker as a frameset.

No, I don't resent what Stone does for a living and as many have pointed out, if it wasn't for his kind many of us would be up a gum tree with our projects - he provides an invaluable service. What stops me from buying anything from him is that he has never once answered a single request for further info on what he's selling, despite my having bought stuff from him. The last time I tried to contact him I sent him 3 further requests for a reply but to no avail. I don't care if he's flooded with email every day, that's just plain rude.

I think it was a 'badly needed' Stronglight crank removal tool that he was selling. I sat there as the seconds ticked away to the end of the auction, one click away from entering a bid, as it turned out quite a bit higher than what it ended up going for, but just couldn't bring myself to put my money in the man's hand. Now I always look through his auctions out of interest but really can't see myself ever buying from him. What happens if you buy something and it's not as described? No, not for me.

If it is not as described then there are actions you can take. Yes, buyer has to beware, pretty standard.
If people have ever had issue with anything I've sold i tell them to send it back to me and I'll refund the $.
I've never had a return. Sometimes people want something for nothing, but that's another story.

I do like to keep things original that deserve to be original unless there is a good reason for a swap, like fitment, breakage, bendage, smashage.

Just a note: I never said anything like that. I believe I said 'sad' and 'cringe.' If anything, seeing his auctions makes we wish I lived in the UK. Between all the old bikes under every haystack (or whatever they have over there...) and all the quiet country roads to explore...what a dream place for a biker!

And I've had the same experience with him you have - never answered an email. And the only email I ever sent him was in response to his request that you ask for more info if you want this item!

I think he is probably a lot more hard core than we are - certainly more than I am - and couldn't possibly deal with all the email he gets. Heck, I've gotten emails from people even less hardcore than I am - and I am faaaaaar from hardcore - that end up going back and forth and back and forth...sometimes a simple, short answer just doesn't work. It just leads to more questions. Sometimes you gotta separate the wheat from the chaff. Couldn't not do that at work.

As a member of the Veteran Cycle Club of New England, I get the monthly "News & Views" magazine put out by the VCC home base in the UK. Each issue has a classified section, and here are some postings from the April issue:

--1930 Humber Olympia gents, all black in very very original condition with bell and carrier. Ride away, 150GBP.
--Three Raleigh Lenton frames 21in, 22in, 23 in, 10GBP each.
--CWS Roadster, 25 3/4in frame, 28in wheels, original Sturmey Archer, Brass headbadge, original paintwork, shabby but rideable and used regularly for last 20 years. Price includes 3 spare tyres, 20GBP.
--Frame, Lenton 22in gents with fork and chain set, finish faded, 15GBP.
--1957 Raleigh Lenton Grand Prix, 23 1/2in frame and forks, restored, painted transferred lacquiered, 531 throughout, will make a very nice tourer, 130GBP.
--1950s Carlton track cycle, 22in frame on 26 x 1/14in wheels, Williams crank, 55GBP.

I think you can see that there's no shortage of vintage material for sellers to pick up and flip on eBay.

Neal

Huh- strange, I just checked ebay, searched sellers... both hilarystone and aviauto1925 show no items for sale...What am I doing wrong?

Oh, great. Now I'm crying.

Screw the chunnel. When are they going to build us a bridge?