New "Vintage" Framesets
09-06-09 | 11:59 PM
#26
Randomhead
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 25,930
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From: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
I'm not sure why but if anything bikes seem to have dramatically outpaced inflation. I bet $200 would have bought a really sweet frame in 1972. $1000 today won't get you anything close to it judging by what they are asking for these. Using the calulator, you would have to have paid $2500+ for bike in 1972 to equal a top of the line $12k - $14k pro bike today or almost $400 for one of these framesets. But IIRC a top of the line bike in 1972 went for around $500, maybe $700 for an all out full custom hand made touring bike like a Rene Herse. I think $2500 would have bought you a darned nice car back then.
Two data points: a Paramount went for just under $500 in 1975, and I remember the name Italian bikes going for $750 or so at that time. By 1980, you could easily spend $1500 at the top end on an Italian bike. So we are talking $2500 to almost $4000. Sure, the top end is more than that now, but you can do pretty well for $4k. And depending on your perspective, today's $1500 bikes are probably better bikes than the top of the line bikes from 1980. But I didn't say that in C&V
09-07-09 | 12:24 AM
#27
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,547
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From: Sunny Tampa, Florida
One of the things these prices are telling us is that we are getting our vintage steel for less than the intrinsic value. That is to say, it costs more to make than we are paying. That is not a permanent situation in any market. It is true that most new steel is positively elite in fit, paint and features compared to a lot of our old pipes. However, that doesn't change much since even a cheap new lugged steel frame goes for close to a grand.
I have no gift for investments or financial advice, but to me, the market says it's a good time to buy the best of the vintage stuff and sit on it. This "OMG he wants $300 for that handmade Italian frame" is going to look silly in a couple years.
I have no gift for investments or financial advice, but to me, the market says it's a good time to buy the best of the vintage stuff and sit on it. This "OMG he wants $300 for that handmade Italian frame" is going to look silly in a couple years.
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Still stupid and seriously neglected..
Still stupid and seriously neglected..
09-07-09 | 12:24 AM
#28
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From: I live in a rural canyon in unincorporated Los Angeles County
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09-07-09 | 12:34 AM
#29
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From: I live in a rural canyon in unincorporated Los Angeles County
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I have to admit to having sticker shock after ignoring bike prices since the early '80s.
Two data points: a Paramount went for just under $500 in 1975, and I remember the name Italian bikes going for $750 or so at that time. By 1980, you could easily spend $1500 at the top end on an Italian bike. So we are talking $2500 to almost $4000. Sure, the top end is more than that now, but you can do pretty well for $4k. And depending on your perspective, today's $1500 bikes are probably better bikes than the top of the line bikes from 1980. But I didn't say that in C&V
Two data points: a Paramount went for just under $500 in 1975, and I remember the name Italian bikes going for $750 or so at that time. By 1980, you could easily spend $1500 at the top end on an Italian bike. So we are talking $2500 to almost $4000. Sure, the top end is more than that now, but you can do pretty well for $4k. And depending on your perspective, today's $1500 bikes are probably better bikes than the top of the line bikes from 1980. But I didn't say that in C&V
Greg
09-07-09 | 12:48 AM
#30
Full Member
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From: I live in a rural canyon in unincorporated Los Angeles County
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One of the things these prices are telling us is that we are getting our vintage steel for less than the intrinsic value. That is to say, it costs more to make than we are paying. That is not a permanent situation in any market. It is true that most new steel is positively elite in fit, paint and features compared to a lot of our old pipes. However, that doesn't change much since even a cheap new lugged steel frame goes for close to a grand.
I have no gift for investments or financial advice, but to me, the market says it's a good time to buy the best of the vintage stuff and sit on it. This "OMG he wants $300 for that handmade Italian frame" is going to look silly in a couple years.
I have no gift for investments or financial advice, but to me, the market says it's a good time to buy the best of the vintage stuff and sit on it. This "OMG he wants $300 for that handmade Italian frame" is going to look silly in a couple years.
I gladly paid $600 for a pristine lugged 1974 Raleigh 531 Reynolds double butted frame hand built in Carlton...
...although I don't consider it an investment as much as a source of personal riding enjoyment.
Greg
09-07-09 | 02:39 AM
#31
Gear Hub fan
Joined: Nov 2008
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From: Reno, NV
Bikes: Civia Hyland Rohloff, Swobo Dixon, Colnago, Univega
In 1972 I bought a new Porsche 911T for $7500. Price the cheapest 911 today. The same is true for most cars. Increases have been much more than government CPI figures would indicate.
Much the same is true for bicycles and I suspect that a good part of the price increase has been due to the Dollar decreasing in value compared to other major currencies.
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Gear Hubs Owned: Rohloff disc brake, SRAM iM9 disc brake, SRAM P5 freewheel, Sachs Torpedo 3 speed freewheel, NuVinci CVT, Shimano Alfine SG S-501, Sturmey Archer S5-2 Alloy. Other: 83 Colnago Super Record, Univega Via De Oro
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09-07-09 | 06:38 AM
#32
Bianchi Goddess
Joined: Apr 2009
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From: Shady Pines Retirement Fort Wayne, In
Bikes: Too many to list here check my signature.
{Gruppo Bici N.A. is also planning to prepare vintage framesets under Bianchi, Coppi, Frejus, Ganna, Giardengo, Gloria and Legnano with consumer-supplied graphics; the company is pursuing license agreements with these companies.}
I was just skiming that article. this seems interesting you can have these brand names placed on a noname frame for 2000$ not a bad deal. I think they should just offer to to put the consumers name on it a brand/model
"Family_Belly" brand bikes LOL
I was just skiming that article. this seems interesting you can have these brand names placed on a noname frame for 2000$ not a bad deal. I think they should just offer to to put the consumers name on it a brand/model
"Family_Belly" brand bikes LOL
__________________
“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
09-07-09 | 10:15 AM
#33
Thread Starter
4.6692016090
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From: Monterey Peninsula, California
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{Gruppo Bici N.A. is also planning to prepare vintage framesets under Bianchi, Coppi, Frejus, Ganna, Giardengo, Gloria and Legnano with consumer-supplied graphics; the company is pursuing license agreements with these companies.}
I was just skiming that article. this seems interesting you can have these brand names placed on a noname frame for 2000$ not a bad deal. I think they should just offer to to put the consumers name on it a brand/model
"Family_Belly" brand bikes LOL
I was just skiming that article. this seems interesting you can have these brand names placed on a noname frame for 2000$ not a bad deal. I think they should just offer to to put the consumers name on it a brand/model
"Family_Belly" brand bikes LOL
:lolsps:
Nah, I think I'll stick with the real deal
:
09-07-09 | 03:17 PM
#34
Full Member
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From: I live in a rural canyon in unincorporated Los Angeles County
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Your Bianchi is downright beautiful... 
...simple timeless classic elegance.
It's no wonder they're trying to sell "copies".
Greg
...simple timeless classic elegance.
It's no wonder they're trying to sell "copies".
Greg
09-07-09 | 04:13 PM
#35
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Middle TN
Bikes: 2 Centurian Ironman, Rossin Genisis, Greenspeed GT3, Stowaway (wife)
Most nice framesets in the early 70's were in the area of $400 if my memory serves correctly. Some were a little less and some were a little higher. I believe a Paramount was around $375 in the late 60 's but took a big price jump in the early 70's. I think the Paramount tandom was $450 to 475. This was still a lot of money. GM skilled trades were making about $4 an hour.
09-07-09 | 04:25 PM
#37
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4.6692016090
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09-07-09 | 04:28 PM
#38
Thread Starter
4.6692016090
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From: Monterey Peninsula, California
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Most nice framesets in the early 70's were in the area of $400 if my memory serves correctly. Some were a little less and some were a little higher. I believe a Paramount was around $375 in the late 60 's but took a big price jump in the early 70's. I think the Paramount tandom was $450 to 475. This was still a lot of money. GM skilled trades were making about $4 an hour.
As an aside, the suggested retail for a full Super Record equipped Reynolds 531 Masi Gran Criterium was $1095.
stan
09-07-09 | 04:47 PM
#39
Bianchi Goddess
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 28,885
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From: Shady Pines Retirement Fort Wayne, In
Bikes: Too many to list here check my signature.
that is a beautiful Bianchi the chrome details are very nice.
__________________
“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
