look at it from a Campy perspective, it's what was original.

Well I suppose that would explain the headset I tapped out being marked "OMAS Italy"

Sheldon's Headset Crib Sheet
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/cribsheet-headsets.html

Is saying the Cups are 30.2mm (same as ISO) and the Fork Crown race is either 26.5mm or 27.0mm.
additionally that crib sheet says "I.S.O or JIS Sized Headsets Can be Used"

Can I just get an ISO sized headset for the cups and simply use the Fork Crown race that I've got on there? (its in ok shape for now)

but This bike was full Dura-Ace when new.

OK.. just thought I'd put it out there, as long as you astute enough to take it all into account...... I've cheated my way around h.sets, that's another story.

Shimano was used as OE, many Team frames were sold also.
Though DuraAce was OE, the H.Sets were Campy. At the time, no others were worthy I believe. the Tange tubesets used on the Pros & teams were truely Euro dimensions. Unlike even the Hi-Mid range ones that used Tange sets ( even the 912s, and other JPN. built hi-enders) REMEMBER yours IS an '84 NOT later. In 1984 things hadn't quite been sorted-out yet. Just after, ISO & other stuff was more clearly defined, it's a language thing sort of. The Tange tubeset on your bike was unique.

oh don't get me wrong.. I'll take all the help and advice I can get.

According to the 1984 catalog the Team Miyata is spec'd with full Dura-Ace, Shimano ends, "Italian Size" headset, Campy Shifter Bosses and "Miyata Cr-Mo" DB tubes.

You're on the right track and we're on the same page. I've seen diagrams of Ital. vs ISO types, design difs.(internally) Besides, if it all becomes a bit much, I'll oblige by relieving you of the frame so I've got your back.

I'm a little confused. I thought Miyata made their own tubing.

Then I looked closely at the fork for this bike, and just as old and new said...its TANGE tubing. well at least the steerer tube is.

I brought it down to the LBS tonight and it needed a 27.0mm fork crown race, to which he was adamant, and I trust this dude, that it would take a Tange Levin 1" headset. and used the Tange stamped Steerer tube as further proof. We shall see wednesday.

Yes. Otherwise, it's not hard to mill the fork crown seat to 26.4 if the shop has the tools. Might save you some time in the long run.

Its time to set SheldonBrown to the side......

I see no reason why a conventional 30.2mm/27.0mm headset wouldnt fit. If I recall correctly I've rebuilt/built and repaired more Teams than I could possibly remember. There's nothing odd or unusual about them.

wa..wa.. wa.. what! Someone call the religious right we have a blasphemer in our midst :lol:

Okay, that's what everyone's saying, but I'm not convinced that's the way to go; or at least, I'd call that Plan B. For Plan A, here's what I'd do:

Remove and/or neutralize the rust chemically. Fashion a new cable guide from thin steel or brass. It won't be perfect, but make it as good as possible, using riffler files or whatever it takes. Epoxy that onto what's left of the old guide. After the epoxy has completely set, go back over it with the files again, clean up the glue, make the glued joins look as good as possible. Make sure you can fit cable housing through the hole! Now paint the guide the same color as the frame.

If this doesn't work, you can still go to Plan B.

If Plan A and Plan B don't work, you can always got to Plan C, complete restoration.

funny, I've been referencing his "headset crib sheet" kinda wondering how accurate it is


What kind of conventional headset is 30.2mm/27.0mm? JIS? ISO?


I'm pretty sure This is what my LBS ordered for me. linky which according to all measurements should work.



Rudy, do you think that cable guide repair could be done similarly with a soldering iron? I should be fine with epoxy though... I mean they build whole bikes out of it now :lol:

IMHO a 'conventional headset' has 30.2mm cups and either a 26.4mm or 27.0mm crown race. A headset with 30.0mm cups is JIS and NOT 'conventional'.

To say a headset with a 27.0mm fork race is a JIS heasdet is a misnomer in my opinion.

I wouldn't go near it with a soldering iron. It might be fine, but I wouldn't do it. As I understand it, you'd need a BIG soldering iron (like they use for stained glass work, not for electronics) and even so you're not going to get the frame hot enough for any kind of solder to stick well enough. But, I emphasize: what do I know!

My thinking is: if you dissolve away all the rust, you'll be left with a porous surface to which the epoxy will stick just fine. The fix will not be "good as new," but if done right you can have something that works and looks okay without any further compromise to the originality of the frame.

rhm , good idea, consistant with those of us not rec. soldering to sove a tiny problem and create a bigger one, possibly that of paint work. Those frame used muti-coated finishes, electrostatically applied no less.

JB Weld or other met. based epoxy types create "metal", if they work to recontruct an ear on an exh. manifold, they'll work on the cabl.holding tip on a frame.
I'd thought about it, you said it. So you do in fact know.

I am a babe in the woods with all this Headset stuff... If I went to buy a new threaded headset do you just say "Gimmie a 1" threaded headset" and they say "Do you want a 26.4 or 27.0mm crown race" ?


For example when I go to build this bike up properly over the winter and I want to use really nice components...Lets say I want a new Campy Record Threaded headset. Is that gonna be a 'conventional headset' size and I'll just specify what size crown race I want? Will that be the same case if I go with a new Shimano threaded headset?

The link for the 30.2/27.0 headset shows it being 'out of stock'. It seems as though most modern headsets have settled at the 30.2/26.4 standard. If you ask for a new 1" threaded headset that is probably what you're going to get. I'm not saying 27.0 isn't available but it is much less common than 26.4. If your new headset doesn't come in 27.0 just mill the crown seat down to 26.4. It's a common operation and your LBS should be able to do it or find someone who will.

Re the cable stop - you MUST stop the rust. It's already bubbling up under the paint on the tube so trying to fix this problem without damaging the paint is not really an option IMO.

www.jensonusa.com has h.sets, still doesn't reconcile in your mind what you believe is correct. I know of a man who just did it, I'll try to ask, get the brand too.
I could say, let the LBS help you, as you'd mentioned going but perhaps they too are uninitiated regarding you spec. bike so I won't play that heany handidly.

Yeah, I like rhm's epoxy fix, but if you really want to do it right, you should get it to a frame repair/repaint shop. They should be able to either file down or pop off the old cable guide, blast or sand the rust, and repaint the area for what you would spend timewise trying to pull a DIY.

Of course, this would mean having such a shop in your area. Anybody know of one out thattaway?

The LBS is helping me on the Headset issue..they're actually pretty good with Vintage stuff. I'd imagine they ordered this headset as it comes in either 26.4 or 27.0mm crown race and is the exact make, model and price they are charging me. http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...d+Headset.aspx

Well they got the right headset, Its installed and lookin good. So I went to fit up some wheels from one of my other 700c bikes (this frame is designed for 700c) and the 700x35 tires on Sun CR-18 rims were far too fat to fit in the frame. Even the rims seemed kind of wide.

I've got a nice narrow set of mavic hoops just waiting to be laced...guess I need to go hub huntin now.

So I've finally got everything I need to get this bike on the road. Freewheel is here, new chain, cables, housing, shifters, brakes, levers...the works.

I got down to taking care of the rust on the top tube cable guides. Turns out that besides the nasty lookin front guide, there is surface rust bubbling under the paint around all 3 guides.

I went at em with a set of files and filed off the bubbling paint and surface rust down to shiny metal. I had to file down about a 3mm radius around each guide to root out all the cancer.

After filing I masked everything off and sprayed them with rustoleum Rust Converter primer to make sure the problem doesn't come back immediately, then top coat with 3 or 4 coats of the closest match Rustoleum Blue I could get.

The results aren't bad...from 10 feet away its a nearly perfect match, closer and you notice my current problem. The areas I repainted are now built up higher than the rest of the paint.

How Can I fix/cover that up?


http://lh4.ggpht.com/_C_ZmRsQylO0/S9...0/IMG_1333.JPG

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_C_ZmRsQylO0/S9...0/IMG_1331.JPG


some shots of the whole thing...still have some more parts to put on but whats on there is staying. Mavic Open 4CD rims on Dura-Ace 7401 hubs (freewheel, not freehub), SR Crankset, SR Handlebars, fricken sweet SR Stem, SR Laprade seatpost, Suntour friction Barcons, 2nd Gen Suntour Superbe RD, new Tektro calipers, new Cane Creek SCR5 Levers, new Tange Levin Headset (Standard size w/27.0 fork crown race)

Waiting to go on is a matching Superbe FD, new 7 Speed HG Freewheel, and newish SR Chainrings to replace that single black one.

I'm gonna have it accented with Yellow....Tires are black with a yellow stripe down the middle, Cable Housing waiting to be cut is Yellow, Toe Straps are Yellow, bar Wrap is yellow Cork. I hope I didn't overdo it with the yellow...

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_C_ZmRsQylO0/S9...0/IMG_1335.JPG

I'll probably build the bike up over the next day or two minus the rear brake line...just gotta wait for the paint on the Cable Guides to cure (I'll give it til friday)

Any recommendations on what to do to clean up around the edges of where I painted? Polishing Compound around the edges to smooth it down? Wet Sanding?
Should I just make a decal with a cutout for the guide in the center to cover it?

Hey, that is looking pretty good!

First of all, make sure the paint is really dry, completely cured, etc. How long ago did you do this? You should probably wait another month or two... but of course I would never have the patience for that.

But yes, as you suggest, wet sanding, 1500 or 2000 grit paper from pep boys and the like. I'd mask the surrounding area with a thin plastic tape, like strapping tape, for most of the process. When the new paint is down almost to the level of the old, remove the mask and do the polishing compound.

:D Thanks! Its nice to hear someone other than myself think it looks Ok :)

Yeah its definitely not even close to totally cured... I sprayed the last coat at around 8pm last night and its been rainy and cold all yesterday and last night...so its not even close to cured.

And like you said, I certainly don't have 2-3 months worth of patience although it does sort of make me wish I had done this over the winter rather than now.

The wet sanding with 1500-2000 grit won't harm the existing Original paint? I haven't done much of this kind of touch up work before