You gotta love the triple up front on this one :)

All this raises some important questions:

How come when you make a bike out of Carbon fiber Reinforced Polymer it's made of "carbon", but when you make a flyrod out of CRP it's made of "graphite"?

And aren't they both actually made of reinforced polymer?

And how come flyrods that you don't want spooking the fish are made with transparent colored polymer so the carbon fiber is sparkly, but bikes that you want visible are painted so you can't see the carbon fiber gleaming through the polymer?

And why can't we trap carbon from coal-fired generators in bike frames and flyrods instead of underground?

Yeah, no love for classic French randonneuses?

You say po-tad-o, i sat po-tah-o.

That said, I would be interested to get two comparable pros and have them race - one on a TDF-quality bike from 1979, one on a TDF quality bike from 2009. The only modifications would be to have an 11 tooth gear on the back and to have bar end shifters on the '79. Be interesting to see exactly how much faster one would be over the other.

A while back there was a thread on here somewhere that some bike racers did something quite similar to this.

IIRC, top speed and cllimbing weren't an issue. The biggest difference was high speed mountain decents. With the newer bike's stiffer frame and better brakes, the racers were able to decend with more confidence and went noticably faster.

Cornell University also did a study, I think, and it took almost 5 lbs to make a noticeable difference in performance.

Guys, I just have to reject the notion that innovations that suit competitive cyclists represent improvements, or even incremental steps on the way to the peak in cycling evolution.

Bicycles are not currently evolving towards that peak. The closest we have come, so far, was the Moulton 4-speed of 1963: full suspension, internally geared hub, small wheels, ample luggage capacity, etc: http://www.hembrow.eu/mymoulton.jpg (that's not mine, just one off the web). It is far from perfect; it can be improved by giving it a wider range hub, aluminum rims, functional brakes, dynamo LED lighting, etc. The geometry can be tweaked as well, perhaps with slightly larger wheels for better stability; and so on.

Bicycle evolution can never reach its peak until derailleurs are a thing of the past.

That's interesting. A clear advantage there.

With flyrods, graphite is now the standard, but there are still some hand-builders using fiberglass for it's slower action. But bamboo is still the favored material. Personally, I like cane for lightweight 5'6" and 6'8" rods, but have sold every 8'6" 6wt. cane rod I've ever bought, as well as some high end graphite rods, cause they just aren't as pleasing to use as an inexpensive old Cortland pack rod I've got that just has the sweetest action.

For guitars, rosewood, mahogany, maple, koa with a spruce, cedar, redwood, or mahogany top remains the standard, despite the availablility of high quality and very weatherproof graphite guitars. I've played a couple graphite guitars, and they have a unique and acceptable sound. My ear prefers all-mahogany guitars.

Nascar racers use carbon composites because the strength:weight is better than fiberglass.

And the new Boeing Dreamliner will use composite in it's fuselage because the strength:weight and durability are better than aluminum.


While the state of the art in aviation and autoracing tech is out of reach for the average Joe/Josephine, near anybody can put together a high tech modern racing cycle and push self and machine to the limits every sunny weekend. I can dig that.

If I were building a bike from scratch, an 8-speed rear hub and a dynamo front would definately be a part of it.

Just like autos, bicycles evolve in the direction of what people want to buy, not towards what makes sense. One would be hard-pressed to make a case for the 4-door 4WD 4-ton V8 shorty bed pickup being the culmination of automotive technology. But they sure are popular around here.

Wow. Are we a little vintage Road Bike centric here or what!!!
When did we peak?? Forget it, Mountain bikes have not hit their peak yet. The advent of quality, light weight dual suspensions is still relatively new. Specially designed downhill frames are relatively recent designs. I don't think innovation in MTBs has reached the top yet.
As for road bikes, while new technology has slowed down, I think we are about to see another explosion as light weight internal hubs replace derailers.
However, I would agree with the OP that hybrids have reached their peak. :rolleyes:

Well, if we pretend that bicycle development has a single, well defined objective, then we can clearly state that the peak was... whenever we'd like in our happy little world of make-believe.

I definitely do not understand the 4 door short box pick-up craze. What's that all about? Carrying bags of potting soil? The beds not big enough for much else.