Maddox

I recently obtained a mid-70's Acer-Mex Windsor Track Profesional (yes, "the poor man's Cinelli"). Columbus tubing, 165mm Pista cranks with 42T chainring, Cinelli Milano/Pista bar/stem, Fiamme sew-up rims with the high-flange NR hubs, etc...

Aside from some aged grease and a headset and bottom-bracket that don't seem to be original (and will most definitely need replacing), it's in great condition.

I'm doing my best to do a faithful & period-correct restoration on it...and running into some significant confusion on the bottom bracket. When I got it, it had Shimano 36x24T cups (Shimano's italian-thread model), and a 68x107 spindle (which is, according to all information I can gather, an English-size spindle).

Can anyone help me figure this out...all of the Italian-threaded sealed-bearing BB's I can find (Miche, Campy, etc) have a 70x107 spindle, will that work for me? If I make the move from 68x107 to 70x107, will I run into problems when I try to mount the cranks?

Sorry for the no pics thing...my camera is on the fritz, but I'll try and post some photos for documentation (and proof) asap.

mudboy

Sounds like perhaps the bottom bracket threads got stripped at some point, and it was re-tapped to Italian. If you want to use an Italian BB, just put a 1mm shim on each side of the BB when installing the cups.

Pete

Otis

The Windsor should have an Italian threaded BB shell. It's possible that it was faced heavily and ended up being too narrow for a 70mm axle.

First thing to do is measure across the BB shell and see how wide it is.

If it is closer to 68mm than 70mm, just do what the previous person did and use Italian threaded cups with an English length axle. You can mix and match a period Campy just like somebody did with the Shimano (although it will cost more to do it now).

Honestly if the Shimano set up you have offers the correct chainline, has enough adjustable cup out for the proper adjustment on the lock-ring, and is in good shape I see no reason to change it. It will look a lot more "correct" than any cartridge set-up that you are considering.

unworthy1

Seems to be intentional, here's a quote from a guy who sold and serviced them at a LBS in Tulsa, OK:

"Oh, by the way, some of their frames were Italian threaded, but with a 68
mm bottom bracket width, something you'll want to watch out for!"

this also applies to the sister brand Carabela, too.
another trivia factoid: they also came with BSC threaded 68mm shells in later iterations, mainly in the late '70s to early '80s, when they could also be made with Tange tubing, Shimano or Suntour dropouts and forkends, and JP components.

Maddox

Many earnest thanks for the informative replies. You kind gentlemen are why I love CV.

The BB doesn't show any obvious signs of having been re-tapped. Though it was not made in Italy, the Acer-Mex brand was supposedly started by an ex-Cinelli guy - which could explain the threading. The shim idea is one I hadn't thought of. Thanks.

I would consider forgoing the expense of a new sealed bottom bracket and just reusing the Shimano, but there's one big problem: The frame has two elongated holes drilled-out on the underside of the bottom bracket (in the name of saving weight, of course). With the exposed bearing cages in the cups on the underside of the frame, there was an incredible amount of filth inside the cages and along the spindle when I got the bike - much more than I'd be comfortable introducing to the interior of the frame and bottom bracket.

Trust me, I would rather keep the original than try and upgrade to something brand new and sealed, but I just don't see how that would be wise given how much crud would fly into the underside of the BB...

I guess my next step is to measure the shell, figure out how much space I have to work with. Thanks again for the responses - any more info on the Acer-Mex Windsors is welcome!

Maddox

I had no idea there was a sister brand! And, thanks for the quote from a guy who serviced them - that's immensely helpful. If you have any information on dating of 70's/80's AcerMex bikes (serial number or otherwise), please let me know. I'm having trouble placing an exact date on mine - dropouts are Shimano but tubing is Columbus, and everything else is either Campy or Cinelli (except the Concor San Marco Superleggera Saddle). It's really a splendid specimen, I'm really pleased with its condition.

unworthy1

If yours has Shimano ends but Columbus tubing, it sounds like it might be from mid-to-late '70s, but that's just a guess. I don't have much to help you with serial number deciphering, but the archives of Classic Rendezvous has info from many sources. Go to search.bikelist.org and plug in "windsor" or "carabela" then select either "all" or just the Classic Rendezvous archives...happy reading...
Those slots in the BB shell are nothing unusual, and not intended just to save weight: they are vents to allow water (whether from rain, sweat or condensation) to drain out of the BB shell. As you note, the downside to this feature is that dirt can enter the BB and so the bearings need to be protected. The typical item used before sealed BB units came into vogue was a simple plastic accordion-pleated tube. Campy, Shimano, Tange, Suntour...they all had them. You could also make a "homebrew" protector out of a strip of aluminum can, rolled up and inserted between the cups... works best when carefully measured and cut precisely.