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28" wheels

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Old 04-09-10, 04:09 PM
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28" wheels

I found a pretty clean old Raleigh with rod brakes and wheels that look like 28" diameter. I see very little written about this wheel size. What should I know? I also found a very old Rudge 3 speed. Who knows these bikes?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/frankth...04271/sizes/l/
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Old 04-09-10, 04:40 PM
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I would guess they are 27" wheels but I have limited knowledge as well

edit : looks likes there were 28s I wonder if there are tires
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Old 04-09-10, 04:41 PM
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http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html
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Old 04-09-10, 04:42 PM
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You got yourself a fine British roadster. Could be a Superbe, but most likely is a Tourist model. Harris Cyclery carries 28 inch tires for a reasonable cost.
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Old 04-09-10, 05:32 PM
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28" tires are old British roadster-sized tires, largely unused on modern bikes currently in production (except for vintage styled Pashleys and other new-vintage bikes). Old English city bikes were usually equipped with either 26x1-3/8" (Raleigh Sports, later Superbe) or 28" tires (exclusively for their roadster models with more slack frame geometry).

That bike is a seriously great find, especially with the period-correct Brooks saddle. SHARE THE STORY! Where'd you get him???

+1 to the recommendation to deal with Harris Cyclery - they have the largest amount of info on those tires, and they maintain sheldon's site for cyclists everywhere (which is a darn good reason to support 'em).
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Old 04-10-10, 01:12 AM
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Looks definitely like a 28" wheeler. The wheels look "shiny" - are they Stainless, or chromed and in good nick?

Quite late model, judging by the style of the decals and the red wheel nuts.
What is the date stamp on the 3 speed hub?

the Schwalbe delta cruiser is a nice 28" tyre - in cream or black
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Old 04-10-10, 11:59 AM
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yes, that is a DL1 roadster, with 28 x 1-1/2" wheels. the ISO sizing for this tire is 40-635. based on the details of the bike in your photo, i would peg the year between 1970 and 1972.

you can readily find tires in this size, and my favorite is the schwalbe delta cruiser, in creme. here's a picture of my DL1 with those tires, taken yesterday:

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Old 04-11-10, 12:07 PM
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It's a Raleigh DL-1 "Tourist" They are 28 x 1 1/2" wheels. Tires are readily available. It's one of the "holy grails" of vintage bikes for many people. I have two of them, one is exactly the same as yours. It's probably from the mid to late 1960's.
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Old 04-11-10, 12:09 PM
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By the way, it looks like it is in great condition. try using black Kiwi shoe polish to wax the frame. It'll polish up very nicely.
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Old 04-12-10, 04:49 PM
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This has all been a bit weird. I make aluminum racing MTB's (many years of this) and really had no interest in vintage bicycles. I have made parts for Brough Superior, Vincent and BSA motorcycles in the past and recently a friend dropped off about 100 lbs. of Wentworth spanners, sockets, taps and dies. I wasn't sure I would ever need them.

Just two weeks ago someone dropped off a 51 Schwinn panther in pretty poor shape. I tinkered a bit, took it apart and sent the frame to paint and started peeking in barns and looking a bit for parts. I went to a local used bike seller to try to find some S2 wheels and found several of these brit bikes quite by accident. They are priced around $200.00 each so I started doing some research (here) and Sheldon's sites for info.

It seems that I have found several roadsters, a few sports and something I likely didn't earn, a Raleigh Golden Arrow club racer with a K series hub that would put it around 1930 or so.

I have fallen completely for these bikes, they are amazingly light and still completely functional and beautiful after sitting for many years. The same guy has perhaps 20 vintage brit bikes including a stunning candy red lightweight single speed, at tleast two Rudge (pre Raleigh) and a Phillips (pre Raleigh)

I am not sure I won't get all of them somehow...

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Old 04-12-10, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by southpawboston View Post
yes, that is a DL1 roadster, with 28 x 1-1/2" wheels. the ISO sizing for this tire is 40-635. based on the details of the bike in your photo, i would peg the year between 1970 and 1972.

you can readily find tires in this size, and my favorite is the schwalbe delta cruiser, in creme. here's a picture of my DL1 with those tires, taken yesterday:

Is that a drum brake on the front in addition to the rod brakes? How is it actuated?
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Old 04-12-10, 09:30 PM
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I have fallen completely for these bikes, they are amazingly light and still completely functional and beautiful after sitting for many years. The same guy has perhaps 20 vintage brit bikes including a stunning candy red lightweight single speed, at tleast two Rudge (pre Raleigh) and a Phillips (pre Raleigh)

I am not sure I won't get all of them somehow...
Umm...where do you live? I'm sure there's a lot of us who'd like to relieve the guy of his burden.

As for 28 x 1 1/2" tires: as people have said here, Kendas and Schwalbes are pretty easy to find around the Internet. Harris sells 28 x 1 1/2 tubes, as well, but I've always been just fine with 27 x 1 1/4s.

Look around this forum and you'll find a lot of people singing the praises of the Raleigh DL-1 (a.k.a. Tourist). They're not lying -- it's a fantastic ride. Very smooth and comfortable -- and actually quite fast, with the big wheels and the relatively high gearing of the Sturmey-Archer AW 3-speed. I ride mine to work most days (when it's not raining). The only possible disadvantage is the rod-pull brakes, which are very weak by modern standards, even under ideal conditions, and pretty close to worthless when wet. (Great conversation starters, though.) It's important to keep the wheels well trued -- if they're at all out of round, you'll know it when you try to brake. If the rims are stainless, as opposed to chrome, you're in luck -- on mine, the chrome plating has come off in several spots, making the braking pretty nasty. But the rims in your photo look great! Jump for it, I say.
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Old 04-13-10, 05:02 AM
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Southern Vermont. I really love the bike Southpaw posted. nice..
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Old 04-13-10, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by ftwelder View Post
It seems that I have found ... something I likely didn't earn, a Raleigh Golden Arrow club racer with a K series hub that would put it around 1930 or so.
That's super cool! I love those Lauterwasser handlebars. Is the fork a replacement? And what's that (wooden?) thing on the downtube? More photos, please?

I want to know more about the other 20 bikes the guy has... I don't suppose there's any Normans among them?

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Old 04-13-10, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by ftwelder View Post
Southern Vermont. I really love the bike Southpaw posted. nice..

Too far for me...but go for it, I say.

Dan B.: I think that's a Dynohub generator you're looking at, not a drum brake. I could be wrong, though.
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Old 04-13-10, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart View Post
Is that a drum brake on the front in addition to the rod brakes? How is it actuated?
it's a sturmey archer dynohub, a hub-driven light generator.
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Old 04-13-10, 03:53 PM
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Well, today I took the plunge and purchased an old Rudge roadster. Below is a link to the images. I did a bit of research and if you will indulge me a bit , I will take a guess. It seems that the Sturmey Archer hub is the first place to go to date one of these old girls (there must be a hub/pub joke in there somewhere) anyway, the hub was stamped poorly (I would guess an in-process tooling failure, knowing a bit about manufacturing) and there is no numbers, only "AW" and the second company logo. ( I have seen the first gen on that Arrow). It doesn't say "three speed" either. I would say 1936, first run of the AW. The frame number is "AG 76875" and the bike has black cranks. I have read that the black cranks were war-time so that would be '39. The last year of Rudge whitworth (proper). The "A" prefix on the frame number is also said to be a true Rudge. I guess it could be a "sweepie" that was built after the material restrictions began and used whatever parts were available. Hence the mis-marked hub? How did I do?

Anyway, the bike is in good shape with only a broken chain pull on the left side, some missing brake parts and it once had an odometer mounted to the fork. The tires are Dunlop and the rims are stainless steel. I haven't dated the shifter yet so that is next.

I tried to inflate the tires to no avail but the tread is in great shape. The shifter worked without effort and it made one shift.

I apologize for the photos. I was so focused on the details that I missed getting a shot of the whole bike.

I don't own the Golden Arrow. I have made an offer and been allowed to move it in-doors and examine it. The device on the downtube is at this time unknown. It is my belief that it is a center stand and a one leg is missing. It has a long arm that clips on up near the top of the downtube. The cylindrical part is steel and has two long slots going around the circumference with notches at the ends that would engage the rods in a full down position. It looks like that would have the end of the rod, now near the headset touching the ground. really poor design. I think it is a 21-35 model with a K series hub.

Rudge Roadster
http://www.flickr.com/photos/frankth...7623848852622/
and the Raleigh Golden Arrow
http://www.flickr.com/photos/frankth...7623849022336/

more to come on both these bikes.

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Old 04-14-10, 07:03 AM
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Cool. Looks like a very nice bike.

I have a pre-war Schwinn with an early AW; it is stamped AW fairly clearly, with a faint 0, which I interpret as 1940. There are a couple other forum members who have late 30's bikes with early AW hubs; see if you can compare notes with them. What other words can you see on your hub shell: patent applied for?

On the trigger, see this article.

Was Rudge made in Nottingham before it became part of Raleigh?

Edit:
From a little googling &c I gather Raleigh bought Rudge in 1943. Rudge was originally based in Coventry, and the word Coventry appears on the head badge as late as 1937:

Since your rear fender decal clearly states Nottingham, I suspect it's a Raleigh and from after 1943.

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Old 04-14-10, 09:31 AM
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Thanks for the reply, only the word "Patent" and "sturmey Arch" with the final "T" of patent directly below the "R" of archer. The shifter is a long-trigger handlebar three speed , last year of production was 1938. Do you know the first year of black cranks?
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Old 04-14-10, 10:16 AM
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I don't know anything about the black cranks, sorry. They are said to be wartime production; I don't know.

We need to hear from Mark, aka sciencemonster, preferably with more photos of his '45 Rudge.

According to Martin Hanczyc, your trigger shifter is Model GC3, made 1938 - 1948.


Flickr user Grubb1937 gas a great photostream that includes a photo of a '51 Nottingham Rudge:

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Old 04-14-10, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by rhm View Post
I don't know anything about the black cranks, sorry. They are said to be wartime production; I don't know.
That is correct; what few bikes and cars were built during wartime had no chrome; it being needed for the war effort. Don't know when the wartime restrictions ended; probably in 1945. Fits well the 1938 - 1948 timeframe for the trigger shifter.

Interestingly, this 1942 Mercury has blackout hubs, but retains the chrome chainwheel, crank, and handlebars. Best guess is that they enough of these lying around after the restriction to continue installing them.

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Old 04-14-10, 03:54 PM
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RHM, you are correct in your assertion that it is a post-Raleigh Rudge. I examined the exploded drawings of the model 11 Raleigh (111 Rudge) revealing that it perfectly matched the unit I have. I am glad to finally narrow down the date to at least a ten-year period. I will try using Raleigh frame numbers to narrow it down further. Thank all of you for your help!

I have not yet found the production dates for the 11/111 frames.
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Old 04-14-10, 04:10 PM
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FTW - cool a celebrity on board. I still every day rely on 'the FTW design' stem that holds my cockpit in place
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Old 04-15-10, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by ftwelder View Post
RHM, you are correct in your assertion that it is a post-Raleigh Rudge. I examined the exploded drawings of the model 11 Raleigh (111 Rudge) revealing that it perfectly matched the unit I have. I am glad to finally narrow down the date to at least a ten-year period. I will try using Raleigh frame numbers to narrow it down further. Thank all of you for your help!

I have not yet found the production dates for the 11/111 frames.
Why not send Sciencemonster a PM, and ask him the serial numbers on his Rudges? I'm guessing the number on yours will be pretty close to that on his '45 which, like yours, has no date on the hub.
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Old 04-15-10, 08:22 AM
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So... you didn't get the Raleigh in the first post?
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