Bar position variations
 

Looking over the various pics in C&V one sees bars positioned many different way. Some people position their bars with the forward throw dropping down and the drops horizontal, parallel to the TT. Some place the bars much lower than the seat too. I've always like the hand positions (and the look) of bars with the forward throw being horizontal. With the various bars I have this puts the drops at some angle with the forward end sloping up from horizontal. I've never been able to bend down but so far, so bars positioned really really really low are uncomfortable.

I'm curious, have there been consistent period-based styles from manufacturers? Or by racing teams? So many bike details are driven by what appear to be fads in the marketplace, while other details are clearly functional or ought to be.

Similarly, I've read mention of "modern" bar shapes or classic shapes. This would seem to an area where style could trump functionality if riders don't have a clear idea of what they prefer and why. It's such a fuzzy detail. Pretty subtle stuff until you have developed a preference.

While some will disagree, I have been told many times over the years that the correct position for traditional drop bars is with the lowers parallel to the top tube. Nowadays with the ergo bars and sloped top tubes I set them with the lowers either parallel to the ground or a few degrees positive.

Some folks, especially those from a competition background will fit a bike with a performance fit, smallish frame, lots of drop from saddle to bars, some who are more casual or interested more in comfort will have a slightly larger frame and less drop. Then there is the "Hobo" fit or Rivandale fit where folks ride frames three size ranges too big and the bar top even to or higher than the saddle. Of course, some bikes are designed for and intended to have a high bar, like the old Stingray, lol.

As to saddle to bar drop, that is a function of frame size and an individual's fixed PBH, therefore their BB to seat crown measurement should always be the same for all bikes, the smaller the frame, the more seat post exposed and the higher the saddle will be in relation to the bar tops and etc. A strong rider on the drops with a good four inch drop will be in a position to deliver maximum power and efficiency and good aerodynamics. Some people raise the bars so high that when they are in the drops they are higher than with a "performance" fit when on the tops--lol--why.

Some people like their bars jacked way up, I always though it looked kind of hobo but not as bad as flipping them over backwards. On my "fast" bikes I like about four inches (or more) of drop and on my more relaxed bikes about two inches. These are my opinions, others will vary considerably.

some people pose their bars for pictures. if it looks perfect, this is probably the case.

short, fast rides will have a more aggressive position.

long rides will be set up for comfort.

personally, i like my stems high, and the bars tilted up so the bends can be as flat as possible as long as possible. when the bar begins to bend, thats where i'll put my levers, so it mimics a bullhorn bar.

I tend to set the tops of my bars level with the stem, such that the lower portion of the drops are angled upward relative to the ground. On the larger bikes, the seat is about level with the stem and I find it very comfortable to ride the drops for extended periods, because I can lean forward without straining my back or wrists. Likewise, riding the hoods puts my wrists at a more natural angle.

Here is my 62cm Miyata for example:

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h.../DSCF7074a.jpg

On the really small racy-type bikes (like my 56 cm Trek below), I set the bars the same way for the same reasons, but the seat ends up 3 inches higher than the stem, to maintain the same distance BB to seat crown (just as Loose Chain had observed).
- This makes for a more aero, but less relaxed posture: Consequently, I spend much more time on the hoods, and less time in the drops on these little bikes.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...k760-Sidea.jpg

So which bike is really more aero? As long as I am riding more than a few miles, it’s the small bike in theory, but the big bike in practice. (YRMV.)

That is how I have done things this summer. I jacked the stems up on all three of my bikes with drops. I can say for sure that raising the stem on my Raleigh I feel like I put less pressure on my wrists. I feel more balanced, like my weight is more evenly distributed. I also experience significantly less neck pain on longer rides.

I set up most of my bikes much like this trek, with the drops pointing roughly toward the rear axle. Don't know why but it's comfortable for me, and I'm not a racer so I'm mostly riding the hoods.

I think having the drops at an angle feels more natural to my wrists.

The old rule of thumb was the end of the bars with the plug should point at the rear dropout. I like the tops of the bar flat to the stem; racers seem to like the lower portion flat to the top tube. Other than being completely wacky, I think its a matter of personal preference; set them up how you're most comfortable.

My Cross Check, modern ergo bars:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...s/P6030305.jpg

One of my Centurions:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...s/DSCF0023.jpg

The Pinarello:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...IMG_0223-1.jpg

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...s/PA240117.jpg

The Guercitto, it will have a high saddle and low bars is apparent:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...s/PA300140.jpg

My future hobo bike:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...s/DSCF0038.jpg


The distance from the BB center to the crown of the saddle is always the same on my bikes so that I have the same leg extension adjusted only for different shoes, cleats, pedals and fore/aft position requirements and to some degree crank arm length. They are all very much the same.

Oooh.... I have a Hawthorne with a very similar (maybe the same) frame. I love the seat stays arcing up to become twin top tubes, a la mixte. Sadly, the bike is too small for me. Eventually I need to change out the cranks and rebuild the wheels to make it roadworthy. The graphics on yours make it look a little newer than mine (which has a 1960 SA hub if I recall correctly).

Exactly what I expected, which is to say there is a "correct" way to do it but it depends on who you ask. And of course it will be different for different people.

I find the concept of "ergo" bars amusing. Isn't everything on the bike supposed to be ergonomic? Weren't dropped bars supposed to be ergonomic back then or did they intentionally make them non-ergonomic? :rolleyes: I guess ergonomics varies with the decade.

Back when I tweaked my first ten-speed in the early 70's I didn't know how the bars were supposed to be set. I found I liked them better with the forward throw section parallel to the stem. I threw together a quick diagram of hand forces to illustrate what I think are the reasons.
Attachment 154183
When the bar tilts forward the hand must provide more gripping, i.e more anti-sliding force. When the bar is raised, the direct thrust of the arm is more perpendicular to whatever part of the bar the hand is holding, so the required anti-sliding force is less. Plus it places the brake lever closer for quick reach when riding the tops and requires less rotation of the wrist to brake from the hoods. But of course it's different for everyone.

Thanks for the enlightenment,

I prefer my bars to have the tops level with a smooth transition into the hoods. The drops are sloped, but it seems more comfortable than level drops, because my wrists are straight.
http://i649.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/P9292448.jpg

http://i649.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/PA052452.jpg

http://i649.photobucket.com/albums/u...s/P8032310.jpg

If you use the Italians as a role model, this is what my old boss, Lenny Preheim (RIP) observed. They consistently set up handlebars the very same way.

Top of bars slopes downward slightly. Bottom of bars points to rear axle or slightly higher. I.e. neither drop nor top is horizontal. Tips of brake levers protrudes very slightly from the plane formed by the extension of the bottom of the bars. I.e. you can run a ruler along the bottom of the bar, and the tips of the levers intercept this ruler.

This positioning makes the levers accessibly equally from the top and bottom.

In my case a lot of it depends on the shape of the bar (anatomic or not), whether the bike has brifters or not and whether I have a clip on aerobar.

In most cases, the bars are position in the way noglider describes, with the levers just at the curvature on the bar (levers pointing down) like this:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2760/...fe16fef7_o.jpg

When an aerobar is involed, is a different story: I ride in the drops only to get a different hand position and I need equal opportunity access to the brakes from all other three positions, so the result is something like this:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2645/...19b55e4f_o.jpg

I like to turn them upwards, and opperate the brakes with my thumbs.
Gives a nice relaxed riding possition and its easier to hang bags of the bars too.

http://www.prettyshady.com/2010/up/DSC_0137.JPG

Very well said. BTW, ergo bars are, IMHO, a very good development that should not be sneered at.

I wasn't sneering at ergo bars, only the terminology and the idea that it was a new concept.

I'm not sure what constitutes an ergo bar today. Can you describe? That's one of other things I was hoping to learn with the original post. The last time I bought any bar was, oh, 1980, perhaps. Maybe as late as '85.

This is an ergonomic bar:

http://www.interlocracing.com/blkbirdcomp1.JPG

Notice the flat aero shape and the anatomical drops
(and there is no way to use those with a conventional stem.)

Unless the bar clamp is more than a little deformable. :lol:

(Thanks.)

Yeah, entirely off subject but when I saw that Hawthorne it looked so artsy I just had to spend the 5 dollars USA to own it :).

I think I've seen her riding around Detroit.

I like the Italian set up for my bars... the bottom of the drops always points down and the degree varies according to the bar and what I use the bike for.

I looked at the original ads for the 1957 Peugeot PLX8 when I set mine up... seems to be a common set up for touring and club bikes of the era.

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...010spring1.JPG

On a touring bike it gives you a very comfortable had position when you are in the drops... having the hoods level with the saddle and a degree or so if rise reduces hand / arm fatigue.

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...010touring.JPG

Bars are tilted down on the raleigh and the curvature of these road bars still has the ends pointing down and back... if these were a maes bend the lower bar ends would be level to the top tube

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...leigh2010a.JPG

My recent HB conversion, feels great
 

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=154237

I think sloped grips are better.
I finally got tired of numb hands , on straight and almost straight bars on my '89 Raleigh and this
Specialized Crossroads. This is my upsidedown '74 Raleigh HB. :) ( rightside up was too high on this frame). Yesterday I rode about 20 city miles and 61 country miles. My hands felt so good. I tried gloves , but they were tight and numbing also. Bike weighed 41 lbs here. Avg. was 11.89 mph, including a town tour.
3 LBSs couldn't help with the different 22.2 mm mount , so i used a sanded copper drain pipe and PL construction glue. :lol: I have no garage or blow torch etc. I chopped the carrier also because i bought it the year before they were designed for disk brakes.
I found out where the CFers go to play. haha

I suspect you were mixing up anatomic with ergo? Same idea, different word!;)

Since I spend the majority of time on the drops, I set the angle of the final straight section of the drops for maximum comfort. Like others have indicated, I position the brake levers for accessibility from both the hoods and the drops. The top of my stem is typically about 4" below the top of my saddle.

Anyone who doesn't position their bars exactly the same as mine is obviously deformed! :p j/k
Seriously, looking at other peoples setups, aesthetically I think as long as the initial forward throw of the bars is horizontal or downward, and the final straight (rearward) part of the drops is also horizontal or or downward, my sense of aesthetics is not violated. The brake levers can anywhere that puts them roughly parallel to the curved section of the drops.

Why? Are there anatomic bars too? Anatomy hasn't changed much with the recent decades as far as I can tell.

(Aw, heck, I didn't bring it up in the first place!)

I am reluctant to say it, and I'm not trying to say anything likely to start a war, but I've been very surprised to see the saddle and bar settings of many bikes I see pictured on the forum. If the saddle isn't even close to level, and tilts down at the front, the rider will slide forward; the handlebars on those bikes are often angled upwards, perhaps to try and compensate.

my currently most comfy set-up:

http://www.fivenineclimber.com/image...ne/may2010.jpg

more drop relative to saddle, but compensated by pointing bar ends towards rear axle. frame is slightly too small, so I use it mostly when there's hammer fest on the program:

http://www.fivenineclimber.com/image...june2_10_2.jpg

look no further than "the man" for the answer:

http://www.bikecrave.com/wordpress/w...ading-card.jpg