Posting here because not only are the bikes vintage, but also some of the riders. I'm 54 and the bike is a '68 U08 Peugeot.

After riding with the hot shots, I've recently dropped the handle bars about three to four inches below my seat height. I don't think I like it much. Not only do I bend down farther, but I also feel constricted at the hips.

My question: Is the geometry on these older bikes such that lower bar height does not work well, no matter how young or supple you are? I'm 6' 195 lbs. The frame is the HUGE size made in those days. Others have commented that the bikes of that era placed the rider behind the pedals and modern racing bikes center the rider more directly over the pedals. If this is so, the lower bars on an old style geometry bike would REQUIRE that the hips have a sharper angle to the pedals than todays bikes.

Any thoughts?

If this is too stupid, maybe someone could explain on a 6th grade level, what is meant by "relaxed" geometry. The hot shoes often comment on my bike after a test ride: "It's so comfortable, but a little flexible." I notice a different feel when I take a turn on their new tech bikes, but am not sure how to describe it.

Tyson

This is a good question; I bought a '68 Motobecane Grand Touring this summer and I'm going through the same process as you, trying to arrive at a more relaxed position that's still reasonably efficient. When I got the bike, the drops had already been replaced with 24" BMX bars. I had no interest in drops, but the BMX bars were practically without sweep and had 4" of rise. Mounted in the original SR 85mm stemn it looked odd and handled odd. I found a set of 'North Country-style' bars similar to those on old Raleigh tourers, and they've gotten me closer -- my hand positions are about 4 or 5 inches directly above where they'd be in the drops. I can still pedal pretty efficiently, but a lot more experimentation is needed. To that end, I'm going to install an adjustable quill-type stem. That ought to give me a large enough selection to find the right (or at least right enough) selection.

In the 1950s and to some extent through the 1960s aluminum handlebar stems a seat posts were not as good as they are today and were prone to breakage. So back then people rode bigger frames with less seat post showing and they used a shorter handlebar stem so a longer top tube was called for.

By the 1970s handlebar stems were available in much stronger drop forged aluminum; seat posts too were better. The result was frames got smaller; (More seat post showing.) top tubes got shorter so with a longer stem the rider’s weight was more over the front wheel making for much better handling.

These old frames generally had shallow head angles, long fork rake, and a long top tube. This in turn made the seat angle very shallow around 70 or 71 degrees. This is what people usually mean by a relaxed geometry; or more ‘laid back’ for want of a better phrase.

You are right in your assumption that with your bars low and sitting so far back your hips are restricted and my advice is to raise your bars a little at a time until you can find a position you can live with. And you will have to accept the fact that with a frame this old you are never going to achieve the same riding position as others on their newer bikes.

Compare the length of your top tube with that of a comparably sized modern frame. I believe UO-8 top tubes are considered longish; mine certainly is, which is also why I can ride a small 54cm frame comfortably.

A handlebar 3-4"/8-10cm below the seat is probably too low, unless you are into serious time trialing. I keep the top of the drops 1.5-2"/4-5cm below the top of my saddle on my road bikes, and that is already a very aggressive stance, particularly if I bend my elbows. I, too, am 54 years old.

Guys,

Thanks for the informative replies. The bars are going to be raised a couple of inches tonight! I liked them where they were originally well enough. Should probably have left well enough alone. The "new tech" guys often do whatever is "in" without really wondering "why?".

My thought is that being comfortable in some measure, helps one be efficient and faster in the long run.

Tyson