I don't know. Maybe my priorities are all skewed. Maybe I'm a freak. When I see an old bike I don't really care about how much money it might be worth if I fix it up a little. I care more really about what it cost when it was new (I love bragging about how expensive the bike used to be and how much it cost me and the fact it rides just like it was new with just a little work that I did myself). Would I be able to get my money back on E-Bay or even make a big profit? Probably not, and I don't care. The Value I find is in the joy of fixing it up and riding, and maybe even having something unique. Plus it's pretty cool when you blow away some yuppie with full gear on a $1,000 hi-tek carbon bike on what they disdainfully judge as 20 year old $50 steel bomber.

I agree. It's a good thing to restore old machines so they can be used again.

Last thing I want is a Trek just like everybody elses. My frame is 14 years old -ancient for a mtb. I get strange looks at bike racks -almost every bike mech that seen my frankienbike says they want to find a R, that they all started racing R's...

Fact is -handbuilt is the stuff, and you'll pay big bucks now, just like years ago. Quality workmanship is pricey....A $200 paint job isn't going to save you when I come on the trail behind you.

Why the hell do Alu bikes weigh 30+ pounds..and my chromoly mtb WITH chromoly stem and seatpost weighs 22??? Oh sure it's a light metal, Alu...but you need supersize tubes and a wack of suspension so it won't crack....

I have found a new frame though...chromoly dh bike frame, but not a loser big company...little guys who have a rep and work hard to keep it. If i bought say a Cannondale and it snapped, I'd NEVER ride their bikes again...replacement? Why? I didn't die the first time so you want me to wreck AGAIN?

Components ...well, I like new parts, that part of developement I got use for...friction shifters...man those sucked.

Got pics of your nasty ride? I stripped off my paint..now the frame has a nice patina >orange...guess I better finish the clear coat...

"Sure is a light bike...didn't know aluminium rusted?" I wrap my tubes in white hockey tape and rub the chain grease off on it. The uglier, older the bike >sweeter the victory.

I love chasing roadies...I blow them off the line..maybe fight for a mile or 2...they always get me on endurance....unless we come to a hill >then I sprint...maybe if i had more than 7 gears...but man, gimmie that 10T cog and i'm going to fly!

City racings fun...kinda dangerous tho.

My 14 yr old Ritchey IS my good bike..I treat the newer Trek and Nishiki like the crap they are.

The most valuable bike is the one you use everyday, and for many of us it is a bike looked down upon by bike snobs.

I read an article about the Kronan, the new production swedish army bike. The founder of the company compared the Kronan to the pencils used by Kosmonauts. The story is, the first astronauts took pens with them to fill out some forms or check some checklists and they discovered that ball point pens don't work in space, so nasa spent 17 million developing a zero gravity pen. The soviets heard about this and thought, oh well we'll just use pencils.

The old bikes we ride as those pencils, they work just fine. They could be lighter or faster or be $4000 more expensive but they don't to be any of these things

I ride a 1985 KHS John Howard bike and I wouldnt trade it for anything in all the world. It's light and fast and it looks great. Newer almost never means better. I also have a Giant 'Attraction' MTB I found on the side of the road that I put back together and kick around town on. Wouldn't trade that one for all the tea in China. I can't tell you how many no name nothing bikes I have put back together for the neighborhood kids, I am just glad kids still ride bikes.
So what's it all mean Capt Ron? Well, nobody knows...keep it simple and don't be afraid to ride an old bike, just ride...

Points well taken! "Good" is not the same thing as "expensive" or "modern."

I have to wonder if our ultra-tech, expensive bikes will be discussed in somebody's vintage/classical forum in thirty years... or will they be long-forgotten like our digital cameras?

Unfortunately the NASA space pen story is false

You guys are ALL heratics!!! To even consider a swell old
bike as good as a new mega expensive bike is......well,
hearisy!!!!!!!

[I'm a heratic,too!! ]

I'm sorry but my old bikes are not as good as the new
modern Treks and cannondales.

they are better.

I don't care what it's worth, nor the original price. I 2 old treks
1984 and 1985, and they ride great, sure one of them was top o' the line
back in the day, but who cares? Its the ride.
If I were going to buy a new bike, Pegoretti or Serotta is about the closest
I'd come to big manufactures.

Marty

The one thing I dislike about cycling is the cliques. Vintage versus modern, road versus off-road, high end versus entry level, etc. When I go out riding and wave to a cyclist going in the opposite direction, I don't get a wave back unless I'm riding their kind of bicycle and wearing their style of clothing. At least when I rode motorcycles, everyone on a motorcyle would wave back. In fact, one time when I parked my Honda 750 cafe racer at the side of the highway for a bio-break, a group of Satan's Choice stopped to see if there was something wrong with my motorcycle and offered to help! That's what bicycling should be like. The important thing is that we're all on bicycles. More comraderie is needed between all types of cyclists. As Red Green would say, "I'm pulling for you, remember we're all in this together".

Ha -I just bought a 30 year old 16mm motion film camera.

Some new stuff sucks..disposable bb's? My Logic headset and loose ball bb are 14 yrs old too. They run perfectly. All the components are new, but anything that has lasted that long and runs I'm repairing and keeping...looks like I'm stuck with that 1 inch threaded steerer forever. Damn...I was wanting to run front suspension.

Quality will not go out of style..but with modern manufacturing may be harder to find. Or just go old.
Somebody wants to sell an old Fat Chance for cheap 'cause it doesn't have enough 'bling' is just the fool i'm looking for....I'll even lie and tell them it's a crappy old bike, just give it to me...

My nasty old Ritch cost $150 for the frame (entire bike, but I bought it for the steel) went to $600 with upgrades. If I got hit and had to get someones insurance to replace...that would ring in around $2000.

A mackin' chromoly frame is around 700 new, no way around that except robotic\ factory welding. (yeeech).

I am only really into mtbing..but I read and explore lots about old road bikes..'cause they are classy and old. I love lugs (not so hot for mtb) but I have lugged road frames and will build an exotic old roadie someday.

Funny, my housemate has a new guy hot for her, he's 6.4 talll and is a pro triathelete. He said his Alu road bike is the same weight as my steel mtb...wacky. I'm trying to get a steel frame for him- He hasn't even RODE a steel tri bike yet (young). Sure is nice to have someone I can talk about cycling with.

All my friends have bikes..only one I'd say is a cyclist. Well 2 now.

https://www.243racing.com/page155.htm Not road, not old, but I might just go for it rather than a new R. And I expect to ride it for YEARS.

Man I dig bikes...might have to sell my car to get this one running.

oh please, this has zero to do with cliques, pissin contests or the bicycle wave.
It does have to do with perceived value vs. real value of older bikes.

Marty

Perception is quite subjective - and we, being humans are influenced both by emotion and logic. I think that the cliques aren't as universal as the previous post would have you believe, but their existance IS real, and shows that we all have some preconceptions, and dare I use the word, prejudices that color our view of the world. I freely admit that I prefer what I became familiar with when I came of age.

I view the machines that people ride today as having less "soul" then the graceful hand-made beauties that I choose to ride. I hope to continue to remind myself to not transfer the feeling of soul-lessness to the people who ride them. We have much more in common with them than we do with our couch potato brothers and sisters who sit at home increasing their risk factors for heart attacks and diabetes.

I wish you guys lived around here. I have steel step through frame bike in sitting on the curb and no one will take it. It has good paint. Needs new tires and somebody took the saddle when they took the matching men's bike that I put out on the curb next to it. It road better than the men's bike. It looks like dumpster time.

well I prefer my old 27" w/26" frame 79 Schwinn to any new ones and beside my old Steel road bike weighs less than my sons new 26" w/24" frame Alu mtb

besides it's like I keep tryin to tell my customes Newer dont mean Better

I'm not saying that cliques don't exist, nor am I saying that we don't have preconceived notions
about bikes and riders. All I'm saying is that this isn't what this thread is about.

Marty

Naw, I rarely ride wearing dresses anymore.

Yeah I put my old POS Schwinn Caliente and my wife's Traveller on the curb. Both were red, sort of a matched looking pair. My bike was crap and hadn't rode it in a long time. Hers was in good shape she still had been riding hers until she got a new bike recently. Someone took mine which is cool but they took her saddle but left the bike. I doubt anyone takes it now. We still have 9 bikes.

I think it's difficult to separate them. What I say the respective values are, is likely to be very different from what someone who proudly rides a Lance Armstrong, Tour de France replica would say they are.

oh please, this has zero to do with cliques, pissin contests or the bicycle wave.
It does have to do with perceived value vs. real value of older bikes.
__________________________________________________________________________

Oh really? the comment that started this thread said: "Plus it's pretty cool when you blow away some yuppie with full gear on a $1,000 hi-tek carbon bike on what they disdainfully judge as 20 year old $50 steel bomber."

How is that non clique ish--the classic struggle between the haves versus the have nots. I ride both, i have a Cannondale road bike with Full Record and AM Classic wheels and weighs mid 15 pounds. And i have a cheap thrift shop fixed gear Nishiki made from 4130 steel and i dont know how much it weighs cause i already know its heavy.

Which one rides better? depends on the terrain or the purpose i guess. But to say that hands down the Nishiki bike is a BETTER bike (because it is older) is like saying a 1975 Volvo wagon is BETTER than a 2003 Porsche----thats complete BS.

Bikes arent like wine---they dont age to perfection. A bike doesnt become a better ride if you just let it sit for 20 yrs.

I understand the original statement and i too enjoy keeping up with guys on nice bikes when im on my steel $40 fixie. I guess the feeling for me is that when im keeping up with or "beating" guys on my $2000+ bike is that I should be beating them and i am. And when im on the steel POS (that i love) i shouldnt be able to do it but i am. The bike is about 10% of the equation----the rest is the rider.

I just like bikes. And i like people that ride bikes. And i always wave (or nod).

jeremyb

"Which one rides better? depends on the terrain or the purpose i guess. But to say that hands down the Nishiki bike is a BETTER bike (because it is older) is like saying a 1975 Volvo wagon is BETTER than a 2003 Porsche----thats complete BS."

Ummm, what if your bike is like vintage Porsche. My bike probably would have been marketed around $1200 in '90. Actually it was probably not marketed as it's proto >crazy stuff like a 140mm tandem axle.

The bikes worth what I get out of it. The reason I ride it is not nostalga...it was designed and tigged up by the best mtb frame welder on the planet.

I have no probs racing against new HT, I've ridden a few -they all sucked. Nothing under $1000 bucks came close. If I waste this frame, I have to go to old Tom and pay the man...frame around $800.

I ride an old bike....because it's a WICKED bike frame. Stunning responsiveness, master welding, stupidly hard steel.

It's more 'the General' from dukes of hazzard than a Porsche tho-.

Jeff, nice bike!

It's nice to see old-skool mtn bikes in vouge again. The '80s-'90's mtn bikes actually lookes like bicycles rather than engineless motorcycles. I believe Rivendell is actually resurrecting thier old mtn bike frame but with the slack angles and frame geometry like your bike.

Great philosophy Jeremy! We need more cyclists like you.

I have about 12 bicycles of different vintages (1961-2003) , different disciplines (ATB, commuting, touring, road race, time trial ) and widely varying cost ($150 - $5000). Each one was designed for a different purpose and for a different price point, using available technology for the era. Taking this into consideration, I would say that they are all quality bicycles and it would be hard to hard to rate one superior to the other. I enjoy them all.

I'm sorry if some of you felt that my original post was off topic, but I continually see this adversity popping up in the forums and clubs. It's sad, because this is not the way to grow our sport. We need to encourage everybody in their cycling endeavours, even if they do not mirror our own.

Recently, I visited NASA in Houston. The gift shop was selling "official" NASA space pens. I was tempted to buy one, because they will write upside down. At my job, I sometimes need to take some notes standing up, using the wall as a "desk". But, they were more expensive than the ten cent BIC pens I use for taking notes and unlocking my bike. I got the impression that the gift shop sells quite a few of them though.