JohnnyBee

*lol* Those Rascals look like some of the Folks from the Velodrome !


Johnnybee.

Scooper

Yep; lots of really bad business decisions, but the quality of the products wasn't ever compromised.

wrk101

Stan would know. I can only speculate. So I guess I will....

Having had a Schwinn Continental, bought new in 1970, I couldn't wait to move onto something else. And that bike had a waiting list to buy it. In my own humble business experience, profits hide problems, and keep management from aggressively holding costs and improving product. Why upgrade when you have a waiting list to buy the current product?

I think Schwinn left the door wide open for newcomers, like Trek, to enter the market in the mid 1970s, and then Cannondale by the mid 1980s. Schwinn certainly could have moved upgrades down the product line, and perhaps might have not lost market share to Trek and the Japanese manufacturers. By 1974, my dream bike was a Nishiki International. For close to the price of the Continental, I could get full cromo frame, alloy wheels, nice Suntour components, three piece alloy crankset, and so on.

In the midst of making all of that money, it would have been hard to convince company leadership that moving cromoly frames down the product line, and converting to lighter weight (and great functioning) Japanese derailleurs and components. I see the great stuff they were making and selling in the late 1980s and just wonder, what would have happened if they would have made bikes like that in the late 1970s? Consider all the marketing companies that took market share in the mid to late 1970s: Univega, Lotus, Centurion, Nishiki, and more. None of them made a bicycle, but all of them took share from Schwinn. I guess they snuck up on Schwinn.

ColonelJLloyd 

I somehow became a collector of Japanese Schwinns. I have the following:

• 1973 World Voyageur
• 1977 Volare
• 1981 Voyageur 11.8
• 1988 Voyageur

I like them all. I'm currently building up the Volare and it should be a neat one. The World Voyageur is my favorite. I have always liked these as they were only available for one year and were the first Japanese Schwinn. Mine is especially cool to me as it is the only 25" model I've ever seen or heard of and has no serial number.

Fuzzy2964

I have a World Voyageur (1972 Serial #) that I really like. Touring geometry and the first Schwinn to be made outside the US, at least that is what I have been told.

john hawrylak

I certainty agree with the last 2 posts (the Colonel & Fuzzy) that the World Voyageur & Voyageur II (identical bikes) are very nice. I bought one in 1975 and still ride it. However, I do not believe they are “touring bikes” for the following reasons:
• The 74 through 76 catalogs (Voyageur II) never touted them as touring. They were presented as high quality, light weight & great components.
• The first generation Dura Ace crank used was a double with alpine gearing, perhaps a compromise, but Shimano made same crank in a triple.
• The dropouts had only 1 eyelet, not 2.
• The head angle is 74° on my 21” frame (Wixey WR300 zeroed to top tube), a rather steep angle for touring.
• The calculated trail is between 47 to 53 mm (1-3/4” & 2” respectively) depending on the exact fork rake which Schwinn did not specify. I used the 1-3/4 to 2” since the 1975 stock Touring Paramount used 2” rake & the 78 used 1-3/4” per the catalogs. 1981 catalog shows rakes of 1-3/4” to 2” for various models. The 47 to 53 mm trail is somewhat low for touring, but just right for a quick handling bike. A larger frame may have a slacker angle.

Based on this I would conclude the World Voyageur & Voyageur II can be used for touring, but were not specifically designed for touring.

neurocop

I've got the same blue/white bike (in 54cm), an '87 Tempo all original with 6-speed rear, indexed Shimano 105 transmission, 105 brakes and pedals, Maillard hubs, fluted Laprade alloy seatpost (and suede Vetta saddle), Tange Levin headset, Tange forged DOs, and a Tenax (non-SL) DB frame. This was apparently a couple of notches down in Scwinn's '87 line up, below the Paramount and Peloton, but it has to be one of the nicest riding road/commuting bikes I've owned. The non-SL Tenax is fairly lightweight but stiff enough for loaded touring and heavier riders. You can find them for $200-400 and in good shape are well worth the coin.

SteveSGP

I was very sad that the Voyageur 11.8 I rehabbed was too small for me, I really wanted to keep it.

jeebusaurousrex

Adding to the weight info, my '87 22" Circuit (21.5 c-c both seat and TT) is a hair over 21lbs with modern components.

I have an '87 23" Tempo with 9spd Ultegra and some heavier wheels and it was definitely somewhere around 24lbs. Tenax tubing feels much stiffer than the SL built Circuit though.

Buddy's '85 23" Peloton (Panasonic) with 9spd 105 if I remember correctly, 23lbs.

Tenax '87 Madison (Panasonic? Definitely Japanese) is also pretty heavy for a bare bones track bike. Not sure about the weight.

I love Schwinns from the 1980s!

tmh657

9 speed DA-Ultegra-600 The 24" frame makes it a wee bit heavier than most.I think the Ultegra seat post looks tasty and not too pricey.


It's a fun ride fixed as well and the original Concor Profil saddle is comfy, IMO.

jeebusaurousrex

Looks great as both! How do you like the aftermarket fork and stem combo on the fixed?

Japanamount

The Series Paramounts have already been mentioned, but I thought this thread would be a good excuse to share my enthusiasm for my own '91 Series 5 Paramount. Though some wouldn't consider it "upper end," it is simply one of the sweetest bikes I've ridden. It is stiff enough in the right places to get the power to the ground on sprints and climbs, let it is compliant enough for a cush ride. It is also has a very connected, secure feel on high-speed descents. I've got no complaints about the Shimano 105 components. The shifting is crisp and positive. The brakes have plenty of stopping power with good modulation capability. I paid $300.00 for mine at the beginning of December and it was all stock and in like new condition when I bought it. So far, the only thing I've changed is the saddle (Stock Vetta unit was coming unglued) All in all, a heck of a great value and an absoulte blast to spend a day on. My days of lusting after an 80s Colnago Master are over!

J.

tmh657

I put the carbon fork on when it was 9 speed. It's about 1.5 pounds lighter than the steel fork. That's a pretty long head tube. The threadless stem isn't as elegant as the quill, IMO but on the fixed gear it works.

Japanamount

Indeed it does...

Very nice!!!

J.

Chris Chicago

it is interesting how schwinn quality rose through the 80s. early 80s they just had a few nice bikes and the mid to lower end stuff wasnt anything great . but by late 80s there was a ton of good stuff and the mid/lower models were much nicer...as the company was going bust

my early 80s world had steel rims, still cottered crank and was all hi ten. late 80s worlds had aluminum cranks and rims, and cromo tubes.

wrk101

My theory is that it was a "little too late" response to the influx of quality bikes from new competitors like Trek, (and later, Cannondale) along with the myriad of high quality, better component, lighter weight, and lower priced Japanese bikes. Just as the bike boom was breaking, the supply of quality bikes was skyrocketing.


Had Schwinn started making those moves when Trek started up (1976), maybe the outcome would have been different. Kind of like how the american car manufacturers ignored the Japanese car makers. That didn't work out so hot either. Remember the responses to the Toyota Corolla? Chevy Vega, Ford Pinto, AMC Gremlin? Really sad to me to think about the passing of a world renown brand like Schwinn.

miamijim

I worked at a Schwinn dealer through the 80's and think it was generational more than anything else. Younger buyers didn't want 'grandpa's' bike.

calamarichris

+1 When I was 16 and riding my 86 Peloton, most of the guys on my team had Colnagos, DeRosas, Vitus'. I remember feeling back then as if everyone else had grown-up's bikes. But of course now I feel like guys my age riding around on the latest plastic-fantastic 15-lb bikes look a little silly with their pot-bellies bouncing off their thighs.

sykerocker 

You're probably correct that the World Voyageur was not exactly designed for touring . . . . . . . but . . . . . . . . . back in 1972 it was one of the few bikes available on the dealer's floor that was readily and easily adaptable for high end touring. Back then, a 'touring bike' didn't really exist (at least not in Bike Boom America) unless you were having something custom built. Which is to be expected, because a mere three years earlier voicing the thought of an adult going long distances, overnight, on a bicycle would have more than likely gotten you a "you're kidding, right?" look.

We tend to forget just how limited our options were 40 years ago. Back then, a Raleigh Gran Prix was very close to being a 'serious racing bike'.

Desertrats97

What about the Ontare or 974 those were great stiff bikes. ? i have seen them on ebay from 100-450

Chris Chicago

was the peloton priced similarly?

my experience works with wrk101's explanation. in 82/83 i Had a world that got stolen from me and it was replaced with a similarly priced sekai. both were lugged hi ten but sekai had araya alloy rims, sugino cranks, nicer handlebars and brakes. a few years ago I was arguing with a pretty knowledgeable bike guy that schwinns werent great for the money in 80s. he said i was dead wrong but I think he basing it on late 80s.

though the grandpas bike makes sense as well. esp when they were putting out so few nice bikes and most associated schwinn with varsitys or suburbans

Grim

Actually I just picked up a 83 SS today.

Frame is Tange DB Champion. Quality looks good on it. ARX derailleurs and Ayara red label rims.
Not sorted out yet for a ride impression and a little smaller then I like a 59cm seat post so probably a flip if the TT is short. I'd guess around 22-23lb comparing it to a bike I know is 22.4lb. Catalogs actually list it as a step up from the Tempo in 83. S/N location and the stainless drop out treatment looks Panasonic to me.

Sierra

Want to sell the original steel fork?

I'd like to put one on my '87 Circuit to match the chrome stays.

jeepr

I have one of those too. If I remember correctly, the early 80s were touted as a "light touring" bike. Mine came with front and rear racks. It is a very nice riding bike. They changed to a more race oriented geometry in later years.