Hi... ok, sooo I have two used Campagnolo Athena (I think) headsets that I had pulled out of two frames. I do everything myself except for headsets....

The mechanic said that there was pitting in both of them on the lower cups (he showed my the little dots where the bearings would sit and get stuck...

He recommended getting two new headsets as these are no good...

The only thing that bugs me is that I REALLY like the look of these headsets and now I'm afraid that if I buy a used one on ebay that it will have the same problem... NOS ones are too damn expensive...

Is there any solution to this pitting?? It feels like a waste to chuck out two beautiful campagnolo headsets....

If they are junk then I was thinking of buying some NOS campagnolo Record ones as they seem to be pretty common for $80 on ebay (unless someone knows where to get them cheaper because I would like to pick up 3-4 of them to have a couple extras in stock)

Thanks!

use loose bearings which will space in between the indentations. no need for a new headset, sounds like a typical LBS response, unless the steering feels extremely "indexed." it should be totally fine though, i run a lot of headsets with fork crown race and bottom cup showing slight indentations.

The mechanic is 100% correct, what he says is not nonsense, the headset will never be as designed again. This does not however mean that you cannot improve on what you have, and bring it up to an acceptable level. The suggestion given by lowlife simply will not work in a Campagnolo headset as the spacing of the balls in Campagnolo cages in Campagnolo headsets are precisely what they would be with loose balls. So placing loose balls will give you the same situation as a Campagnolo caged set. If you want to improve on the set-up, remove one cup and replace it at 90° to where it used to be in the frame, then get a caged bearing of a less expensive headset where the bearings are spaced differently than with the Campagnolo headset.. This is generally the best improvement that you can get for your buck. It will however not be like new.

I thought CDM had "spun a bearing" himself until I understood that placing the cup at 90 degrees would have him rotate the cup in it's bore rather than find some other "90 degree" location. It started me on a morning giggle picturing holding the bearing cup on the front of his head tube,.

THats campy 4 u OVER RATED!!!!!!!!!!!!!! strong light A-9 is the way to go

I never heard that about the cages/loose balls interesting stuff but does that apply to a NR/SR era HS or all HS? I have heard the trick of rotating the lowercup or crown race (depending which is bad) 90'.

Just which Athena HS do you have? One bad thing about the first gen C-rec era HS is that if they are factory installed you may have a threading issue getting something really low like a DA or 105 on the fork.

Hi, hmmm I'm sill confused what you mean rotate 90 degrees????

Im not sure about the headset model but I know that the campy one will thread on because it's a rossin frame.

ok... sooo first off I'm still a little confused about this 90 degree thing...


Also, what about this??
.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Campagnolo-Record-1-1-inch-threaded-headset-/270885371626?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f1206beea
.
Is that headet english or italian? does it matter?

Does campagnolo still make those headsets, i.e. can my LBS order one? Or are all the ones on ebay NOS so must be ordered through them??

Thanks!

I cant say I 100% agree with your bearing statement as loose balls will move more freely whereas caged bearings are held in a fixed position relative to one another.....but you are correct, Campy headsets dont generaly allow for more loose balls to placed.

I always thought that even on a Nuovo Record headset, using loose balls instead of the retainer set would allow one more ball. Not?

I believe its a carttridge bearing headset and NO, it doesn't matter if it's English or Italian.

Look at the lower cup odds are it is only pitted in one area for about a 30d area. Now when the cup was in the bike that would have been the section of the cup towards the rear of the bike. Hold it in your hand in the position it would have been on the bike which would make the dimpled section at 1800 (6:00PM), then rotate clockwise so that area is not about 2100 (9:00PM) that will most the dimpled area to an area where is will not bear as much weight and not be as noticable.


As to the threading.... The original "Chorus Era" headsets were very tall and depending how it was installed the threading on the fork may not be long enough to allow a shorter headset to be correctly adjusted.

Do you have pics of yoru HS? This looks to be from the original, '88/9 to '92ish Athena HS

https://www.ochsnerusa-store.com/prod...rod=CA-1131063

Not going to argue about Campy right now, but honestly, have you tried to buy a needle-bearing A9? There are new Stronglight headsets called A9, but today precious little new product has needle bearings. I've seen two versions: ball bearing and cartridge bearing. No information presented by Stronglight about the nature of the cartridge bearings, so I assume they've cheaped out and are offerring some ball-type cartridge bearing.

I'd love to be proven wrong.

Campy headsets, back to the Record days, will last a really long time (decades of time and 100's of thousands of miles) with maintenance, as will any other well-designed and well-made bearing. They were not designed for press and forget use, being soaked in grit, or lubricated in salt. Heavy rain can wash out grease or the oil that grease carries. The same can be said for Tange, Ritchey, Origin8, and any cheap crap headset you buy, as well as of many so-called sealed headsets. If you really want to treat headsets like disposable parts, fine, you have no business worrying about Campy. And especially you have no business complaining about it if you can't manage such basic maintenance.

You should probably get a Shimano STX or something that has easily replaced cartridges. Or the current Stronglight headset-like object they now call an A9.

Why do you think it's cartridge? I have a Chorus headset on my Trek 610 taht came in the same style box, and was bought new, and it has caged balls. I bought mine around 2003.

I'm not familiar with Athena headsets, but going from caged to loose was the common fix for the Record, Nuovo Record headsets. I can't argue whether loose ends up with the same number of balls without conducting an experiment, but loose the balls end up side by side and caged they're spaced apart, so I can imagine another ball would fit.

Besides, the straight ahead indexing, while annoying, is not really noticable while riding, and doesn't cause any safety issues I'm aware of.

I prefer to make use of what I have over buying more crap, but replacement does seem to be the LBS solution.

If you're riding no handed it can result in pain.

A Campagnolo set of caged balls has just as many balls as you would be able to fit in loose. This is not the case with most other caged balls, where you can often fit 2, 3 or even 4 more when using loose balls. Given the same number of balls, they will always fall back into the pits, even if, as Miamijim correctly states, the loose balls can in theory be lined up perfectly next to each other with one single large gap. The theoretical possibility does not occur in a properly faced frame, especially where pitted headset parts are involved. When I said to remove the lower cup and turn 90°, I meant to turn it in the horizontal plane by 90° not on the vertical plane.

Ok, maybe you're right. I may have to check that theory...

If you decide that one of these headsets is trashed and plan to buy a new one, let me know. I'm missing the fork race for my Athena headset and would be willing to buy one of your headsets if you feel the cups are pitted too bad.

Thanks,

James

You're correct. The newer A9 use cartridge bearings and don't last very long. Mine only lasted 2 years, the older needle bearings lasted about 20 years.

Shutter, got your PM but can't PM back because I'm below 50 posts.

As for price of a used headset, I know on ebay chorus and athena headsets in good condition are selling for $60-$70. I really don't want to spend that much since I only need the crown race, but if I can't find one I may not have a choice.

You stated that you have two headsets, is one worse than the other, or could you put the worst of all parts together into one crappy headset you wouldn't normally want to sell (assuming the crown race is OK)?

My thoughts on my best case scenario would be that I find a race for $20, that's much less than a full set but I'm not expecting a steal either.

You can send me an email at (lotekmod at msn dot com)

James

Low cost bearing retainers, are perhaps what was in mind..

they can be n+1 for balls..

Perhaps getting a lower sealed bearing headset race is possible.
they certainly get beat up more than the upper one.