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Help with Raleigh Competition restoration/clearcoat question

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Help with Raleigh Competition restoration/clearcoat question

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Old 10-16-12, 05:05 PM
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DCTrimble
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Help with Raleigh Competition restoration/clearcoat question

Hi,

I am in need of advice. I have a 1973 Raleigh Competition that I have owned since new (leftover, bought it in 1975 from Turin Bikes in Evanston for $235). Well surface rust and aging parts moved me to disassemble the beast. My in laws operate a metal business outside of Chicago and blasted the frame for me and used a favor to have a local powder coater paint the frame and fork. The fork was half chrome - they did a very nice job of using a silver powder coat to mimic the look of the chrome. I had a friend here paint the gold trim around the lugs - looks okay.

So here is my problem and question. I was able to source original looking decals from ebay but have had no luck trying to find someone to attach the decals and clear coat the bike. Everyone I ask tells me something different and the price estimates for those who say they could do it are near what a complete paint job would be. I saw a couple of posts quoting "Dr Deltron" indicating that automotive clearcoat could be applied and you did not need to sand it down. Basically, clear coat, apply decals, then clearcoat again I believe. Does that sound like it would work? Is there any shop out there that would be willing to do this work? I am in Washington, DC but could ship the bike. My goal is to get the frame done this winter so I can build up the new bike for the spring. Thanks in advance for any and all advice you can throw my way!

David

p.s. welcome ideas as well on the rebuild - what level of componants to buy etc... Not critical to me to be original but I want a good look since I am shallow that way.
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Old 10-16-12, 09:52 PM
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Hi David,

I don't know if this will help but I have painted a dozen or so frames over the years but I have done the jobs using car paint either acrylic or two-pack. I have applied the decals between the colour coats and the clear coats. I have only used a clear coat that worked with the paint type.

I don't know how a clear coat would work over a powder coat. Also, if it was painted a little while ago, I would be concerned about contamination of the powder coat surface e.g. finger prints, grime, etc.

What I would do is to go back to the powder coater (or another powder coater) and ask their advice. They have most probably encountered this situation before.

The decals are probably easy to apply.

Best of luck.
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Old 10-17-12, 07:14 AM
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I applied decals over powder on this 1978 Raleigh Comp restoration. No problems so far, although the decals probably aren't as scuff resistant as if they had been clear coated:



















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Old 10-17-12, 08:41 AM
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What a beautiful bike southpawboston.
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Old 10-17-12, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Gary Fountain View Post
What a beautiful bike southpawboston.
I agree! This is powdercoat? WOW

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Old 10-17-12, 11:23 AM
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Wow. Just wow.
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Old 10-17-12, 12:12 PM
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I *love* that bike.

Good thing, too- I own it now.

southpawboston has it right- the decals are in quite good shape without clear coating, two years on. I am careful but don't baby it excessively.
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Old 10-17-12, 12:14 PM
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Beautiful paint on that restored 78. Here is my unrestored '79 for reference.


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Old 10-17-12, 04:31 PM
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so skip the clearcoat and soldier on!!!

Originally Posted by Coreyk View Post
I *love* that bike.

Good thing, too- I own it now.

southpawboston has it right- the decals are in quite good shape without clear coating, two years on. I am careful but don't baby it excessively.

That is certainly an appealing way to go. So at the risk of being a noodge, any tricks to installing these decals? And lastly, would love suggestions on components to use for this - I had updated my chainring and brakes around 1980 so they are not period and I would like higher performing pieces if possible without losing the look entirely...
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Old 10-17-12, 04:40 PM
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If you don't clear coat, there is a way to help protect the decals a bit. Clear sign maker's edge finishing pen. It lays a clear acrylic along the edges of the decal to help keep them from lifting. I used this technique on my Gitane and it seems to work well.
http://www.hhsignsupply.com/productc...Pen-p42701.htm

There are some techniques that make installing decals easier. Follow the directions that come with the decals. Lay strips of masking tape just under where you want the down tube decals to use as a reference line. Cut very thin strips of masking tape and align them with the points on the seat and bottom bracket lugs on the seat tube, to use as centering references. It helps.

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Old 10-17-12, 04:46 PM
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If it were mine, I'd build it up just as Southpaw has done his. Campy G.S. Or, maybe with a Huret Jubilee derailleurs like were on the one I had.
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Old 10-17-12, 05:50 PM
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Thanks for the finishing pen tip. Unfortunately, my decals did not arrive with instructions!

On the build, the huret is nice, I like the idea of keeping the downtube shifters. I would really like advice on a wheelset, crank and center pull brakes... no doubt I am forgetting something, I like my handlebars and stem. I lost somehow my original brooks saddle (to another project as I recall) so will need a new saddle. Love the Brooks look but am hesitant at the thought of trying to break one in! Are they like jeans now, pre washed?
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Old 10-17-12, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by DCTrimble View Post
Thanks for the finishing pen tip. Unfortunately, my decals did not arrive with instructions!
+1
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Old 10-17-12, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by rootboy View Post
There are some techniques that make installing decals easier. Follow the directions that come with the decals. Lay strips of masking tape just under where you want the down tube decals to use as a reference line. Cut very thin strips of masking tape and align them with the points on the seat and bottom bracket lugs on the seat tube, to use as centering references. It helps.
Good tip. Another tip that came with the instructions for my decals was to spray soapy water on the frame before applying the decals (wet application). That you you can slide the decals around before they set. Then just squeegee out the water once you find the perfect placement.

Originally Posted by rootboy View Post
If it were mine, I'd build it up just as Southpaw has done his. Campy G.S. Or, maybe with a Huret Jubilee derailleurs like were on the one I had.
My year came stock with the GS group, and I received the bike 100% stock except for a missing saddle and seat post. I thought the post I found to replace it was a GS, but one astute observer informed me after the fact it was a fairly rare superleggeri post... and a nice upgrade! (Yes that got passed on to you Corey!)

Originally Posted by jim hughes View Post
Beautiful paint on that restored 78. Here is my unrestored '79 for reference.

Wow! For the original paint, that's in superb shape! I've never seen one with the original decals so well preserved!
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Old 10-17-12, 09:49 PM
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Jim, that bike is just beautiful! I hope you enjoy riding it- I am in love with mine.

The acrylic edge finishing trick is a fabulous idea. There is a 1982 Bianchi here that I might try that technique on, too.

"My year came stock with the GS group, and I received the bike 100% stock except for a missing saddle and seat post. I thought the post I found to replace it was a GS, but one astute observer informed me after the fact it was a fairly rare superleggeri post... and a nice upgrade! (Yes that got passed on to you Corey!) "

Anton, I know I got the bike of a lifetime; This is the first road bike I've ever had that had no compromise about it.

To the OP: go ahead and be confident that you can apply the decals without clear-coating. I would wager that the acrylic sign painter's edge pen will add some durability. Both Cyclemondo and Velocals do wonderful quality decal & transfer work. I've heard some very good things about H Lloyd in the UK, but have not had occasion to use them.(yet.)
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Old 10-19-12, 10:56 AM
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i am about to get a competition powder coated too, and i was still wondering what to do about the half chromed fork/ stays. i love the look of the chrome but mine is in pretty bad shape and i doubt i could just polish it out. Anyone else ever get the chrome silver powder coat deal to achieve a more "original" looking finish? dctrim- how much more would you say this service costed you instead of just a solid color?

my goal is not a pure restoration, but more of a "resto-mod" mostly original stuff, except for where it could get overly expensive. i.e. re-chroming
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Old 10-19-12, 12:15 PM
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I believe Robbie has clearcoated decals on PC.
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Old 10-19-12, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by DCTrimble View Post
Thanks for the finishing pen tip. Unfortunately, my decals did not arrive with instructions!
You're welcome. I owe that tip to someone here, but can't remember who right now. Your decals came WITHOUT instructions?
That's no good. Where'd you get them?
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Old 10-20-12, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by RALEIGH_COMP View Post
i am about to get a competition powder coated too, and i was still wondering what to do about the half chromed fork/ stays. i love the look of the chrome but mine is in pretty bad shape and i doubt i could just polish it out. Anyone else ever get the chrome silver powder coat deal to achieve a more "original" looking finish? dctrim- how much more would you say this service costed you instead of just a solid color?

my goal is not a pure restoration, but more of a "resto-mod" mostly original stuff, except for where it could get overly expensive. i.e. re-chroming

Hi, here are a couple of pics - assuming I figured out the technology. I think it looks pretty good but not for a real restoration. I was fortunate in that my in laws operate a metal business in Chicago and a powder coater did this work for free for them. I really do not think it would be that expensive - it is a second color of course. Chroming has gotten expensive and I am not sure there are many that really would know what to do with a bike fork. I am on a similar restoration path - retro look but will make some compromises for functionality. I had the stays widened to take a more modern hub - I think I would like to go with a compact crank but hope to keep the shifters on the downtube. Not sure what derailleurs will work etc... will likely lean on the LBS for much of this. Also, need to figure out wheels.

Regarding the decals, I actually found the instructions which I did not think I had. They do indicate the clearcoating is not needed. I have an email to the person in Australia that I got them from regarding whether the material is tough enough to withstand a clear powder coat treatment. I can't imagine they are but its my last shot at pursuing clearcoat.
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Old 10-20-12, 07:35 PM
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Update on my decal, question, from the source in Australia (great guy, very responsive and helpful). Decals are only good up to about 60 Celsius so could not go through a clear powder coat treatment. Also, thought the edge finishing pen would not be needed for high quality decals like he offers. Both answers appeal to my desire to less so now on to to noodling out what I want in the rebuild. Thanks.
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Old 10-21-12, 04:23 PM
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nice, ya i bet it couldn't be more than like 30 maybe 40 dollars on top of the normal cost. that looks really good though, ill most likely end up going that route. keep posting up dates, i love my old comp (though only recently acquired) and love to see them all nice and fresh..
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