7spd rx100 and 105 rock.

+1. Especially love 105SC. Have a touring bike coming my way with 7 speed Deore DX/LX, looking forward to trying those.

Not surprised by the mentions of the "lower" tier Simano stuff (including the light-action).

Didn't give up much in the performance dept. to the higher end stuff. Only a small weight penalty as well.

Shimano should be credited with giving consumer a modest bike that didn't have to have utter crap on it.

I learned that lesson the hard way, too. Now I carry a spare Campy binder bolt with me in my tool bag.

Well if it has to be C&V, I'll have to skip out Nitto Technomic quill stems and Diacompe BRS-101 brakes. And, someone has already covered SunTour Accushift.


So my vote is the 6400 Tricolor group. (For heavens sake keep it a secret!) It's too bread and butter for a lot of Euro-enthusiasts, and there are no shi-shi points in the offering. But, it's solid metallurgy, elegant, well engineered, in the ball park of the lighter racing gear and has the trickle-down pedigree from Dura Ace but at a galactically cheaper price. And it works!

Since I already have a Regina G.S. Corse on the back, the noise doesn't bother me at all. It also serves as an early warning system, for pedestrians, in case I don't see them, with my bad eyes. I've only used those shifters for one day so far, yesterday, so I might be jumping the gun, but they seemed great to me. Most importantly, no ghost-shifting, which was what brought most of us to SunTour's Power Shifters. I haven't taken these ones apart for cleaning yet, but Velobase said these are more adjustable than the SunTours. Mine are already pretty smooth, so I'm a little leery of messing with them. I'm a big fan of Symmetrics too, but I dunno, will those work well on a triple? I get a strong feeling, that they're fairly limited to doubles. (?)

I would say flint catchers / tire savers, not only very useful but also a nice authentic addition to a vintage bike.

I wouldn't call tricolor underrated. It may not have the resale of Campagnolo or dura ace, but it is rare to find someone say anything negative about it. It may be under valued, but not under rated. I think rx100 is where underrated comes in. I don't know if many realize it is basically a better looking version of 105 wich also functions like dura ace.



shimano did bring great groups to the common man but once Campagnolo went 10, they stole the show. Campagnolo went all in with 10spd when shimano was still making 8spd on the low end. Not only that, but pre "escape/power shift", their low end levers had the same basic internals as record, the full line was compatible, looked identical from more than 5ft, and used the same ergonomics.

after sti became the norm, I feel lower end shimano groups lost some of their appeal. 105 has been consistently good, but under that it gets hit or miss. I recently worked on older tiagra and it left me missing rx100. It isn't "utter crap", but the gap from low end to high end grew. It look like electronic may close that gap again (for better or worse)

Good point. I still have a set of 8-speed RSX levers from my first "good bike" that I've been holding onto just in case. They are bombproof.

+1 for these great seat posts

Sachs New Success brifters and rear derailleurs. I know I'm in the very small minority using these, but the New Success brifters, which are built by Campy, are rebuildable with Campy Ergo power parts, shift better (lighter feel, easier adjustment) than comparable Campy Chorus, and the RD's seem to be absolutely bullet proof. Haven't had one wear out in 20 years of trying.

I accept your point: 'under-valued but not under-rated'. I was thinking these were synonymous. Still, I do not remember being impressed by great numbers of Italian, artisan-built frames being decorated with 600/Ultegra. But then authenticity and so-called 'period correctness' would account for much of that. As for me, I'd not be hesitant to bolt this group onto anything. That might be countenanced as a sin by some enthusiasts.

Permit me to move on a tangent and say that if there is a 2nd tier Shimano line that is truly under-rated it would be Tiagra. But I can't call it C&V.

I am more and more intrigued with the idea of building up vintage frames using Tiarga. This is very affordable stuff that in my humble estimation differs from the higher Shimano echelons in terms of its slightly more porky weight. For example: I have a set of Tiagra brakes that seem identical to my Ultegra but for a few ounces more. What's more, Shimano will sell Tiagra front and rear brakes individually without any penalty for splitting a set — at least here in Japan. That helped me save a few thousand yen one time. And in one shootout that tested stopping power, a Tiagra brake-set outperformed Ultegra and I think D/A as well. The reviewers put it down to the slightly increased mass. It was thought that it contributed to less distortion when stressed — something the encumbered touring crowd might consider.

9spd tiagra sti levers left me feeling cold. That said, 10spd tiagra with 7900 downtubes and some aero brake levers might be a great way to refresh an old steel bike without breaking the bank. I bet it would look and perform admirably.

Thrifty Bill, you always make too much sense!

Kickstands, yeah, OK, I guess I'll have to grant that. Dork disks, absolutely. Wheel reflectors, yup. Stem shifters, heck yeah. They work just fine, and they're easy to use. I even had them on a couple of beater bikes. They were great.

I have one of those Gran Turismo derailleurs. I bought it just for the heck of it. It works very badly. It shifts spontaneously, wandering in and out. If anyone is interested in it, let me know.

Does 531c count? Is it underrated? I might be wrong, but it seems to have a reputation for being a workhorse tube-set, and never gets the 'praise' that slightly more exotic, or even equivalent stuff does.

I don't think that it has ever been under-rated. Many of the finest artisans anywhere have constructed frames from 531 — including Italian frame makers. (I have one.) Many of the greatest road races in the world have been won on 531 frames. Reynolds 531 is a legend that is not likely to flicker and die any time soon. Moreover, and least according to my information, in recent times Reynolds has offered to extrude batches on special order. Quite remarkable considering the original tubing was introduced in the early 1930's as airframe material.

hee hee. Yeah, I showed that thing from its best side, 3Speed. I only keep it because I think it an awe inspiring, kind of beautiful hunk of 70's metal. I only tried one briefly back in the early 70's, on a friend's bike, but they have a bad reputation and most folks suggest they're best used as paper weights, or as self defense weapons. In The Dancing Chain, Frank Berto says that if it ever got caught up in your spokes, the bike frame would bend before the derailleur would.

Better keep it in case of home invasion, Noglider. You could do some serious damage with that thing.

Mavic 821 8 speed down tube index shifters! Quiet, smooth and precise.

But what about 531c?

+1 on RX-100.
For vintage components, how about Suntour Power Shifters? The ratchet down-tube ones can be had very cheaply (I bought a set NOS on the Bay for $10), and I think they work great.

And I see that you, like me, run your front tire saver "backwards". That is, pointing toward the incoming tire, which I did for a specific reason I've mentioned before so won't go into here, but, I've since placed mine under the fork crown. I agree, they're handy and, I think, prevent flats. An important consideration for me, what with tubulars being such a pain to fix.

Thanks.
People usually disagree with me about this, but:
I've had two locally-made SLX frames, and all my 531 frames (about half-a-dozen) crapped all over them.
Sure, that's a small sample size, but still

I guess locally made frames are no good.

Please go into the reason just one more time.